Which speakers are the Classical Music Pros using?

[Floyd Toole]

No. It just wasn’t in that collection.

 

[youngho]

The Beolab 90 would first have to be shown to be virtually identical between directivity modes. I personally believe that the best current way to begin to address the questions in the way that you're outlining would be with simulated listening environments (and simulated loudspeaker directivity indices of varying curves) using a setup like the Aalborg array outlined here.

Thanks to Professor Lokki, here is another link to a different iteration of the room simulation array mentioned above: https://audioxpress.com/news/bang-olufsen-chooses-genelec-for-its-virtual-reality-laboratory

 

[Oukkidoukki]

I am suprised that everyone has b&w. I think today there is a leap available in production quality if they wish to do so. Norwegian studio engineer and grammy winner Morten Lindberg has used Genelec system W371 and 8531 in his latest classical productions. Musically records are not good in my mind, but depht and realism is an another level. Never heard anything like that. I hope more classical producer get in touch with Genelec system. Records will be an another level.

 

[tuga]

I am suprised that everyone has b&w. I think today there is a leap available in production quality if they wish to do so. Norwegian studio engineer and grammy winner Morten Lindberg has used Genelec system W371 and 8531 in his latest classical productions. Musically records are not good in my mind, but depht and realism is an another level. Never heard anything like that. I hope more classical producer get in touch with Genelec system. Records will be an another level.

The "depht and realism" has little to do with the monitoring system, it's the mic'ing and production workflow that takes things "another level".

 

[TunaBug]

I am suprised that everyone has b&w. I think today there is a leap available in production quality if they wish to do so. Norwegian studio engineer and grammy winner Morten Lindberg has used Genelec system W371 and 8531 in his latest classical productions. Musically records are not good in my mind, but depht and realism is an another level. Never heard anything like that. I hope more classical producer get in touch with Genelec system. Records will be an another level.

I hadn't heard of him. Apparently Morten Lindberg really likes his Sennheiser HD 800 headphones, too. That's what you see on his English Wikipedia page (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morten_Lindberg_(sound_engineer)), and Sennheiser has a write-up on him on their Pro Talk site (https://en-us.sennheiser.com/protalkarticles-morten-lindberg)

 

[mSpot]

I am suprised that everyone has b&w.

I'm not surprised at all. B&W made a strong effort to have major classical record labels use their monitors. They were successful at it and publicized it widely, creating a reputation for themselves in the recording industry.

 

[killdozzer]

Yes. I paid $700 ultimately for my second-hand Revel speakers. The tuba was…more…much more.

And I only own two speakers, but there are four more tubas in this room alone.

Musician don’t expect a sound system to create reality—they live that reality in person. They only need enough cues that they can fill in the blanks from their own experience.

Rick “who messes with audio for different reasons” Denney

04:20

 

[Descartes]

I am suprised that everyone has b&w. I think today there is a leap available in production quality if they wish to do so. Norwegian studio engineer and grammy winner Morten Lindberg has used Genelec system W371 and 8531 in his latest classical productions. Musically records are not good in my mind, but depht and realism is an another level. Never heard anything like that. I hope more classical producer get in touch with Genelec system. Records will be an another level.

Yes they produce tremendous multichannel recordings! It is making me consider selling all my gear and buy all Genelec speakers with just a prepro. Just can’t get any good deals in pro-lines unfortunately ;(

 

[youngho]

I own the CD of this -- any specific questions? It's as you say. The stereophile article does a really good job describing what was done.

Take a look at David Greisinger's comments on this under the Learning to Listen link at his website here. He calls it "supposedly anechoic" and criticizes the leakage between the many microphones resulting in the equivalent of many early reflections with short delays.

 

[youngho]

How can anything other than listening in an anechoic chamber be high fidelity? (headphones perhaps)

@tuga

You had brought up the anechoic chamber question several times in this thread. I thought you might be interested to read this quote from Toole in Loudspeakers and Rooms:

“In-head localization seems like the logical opposite of an enveloping, external, and spacious auditory illusion. Perceptions of sounds originating inside the head, which routinely occur in headphone listening, can also occur in loudspeaker listening when the direct sound is not supported by the right amount and kind of reflected sound. The author and his colleagues have experienced the phenomenon many times when listening to stereo recordings in an anechoic chamber, usually with acoustically “dry” sounds hard panned to center or, less often, to the sides. It prompted an investigation (Toole, 1970), the conclusion of which was that there is a continuum of localization experience from external at a distance through to totally within the head. It is often noted with higher frequencies, and it can happen in a normal room with loudspeakers that have high directivity or in any situation where a strong direct sound is heard without appropriate reflections. Moulton (1995) noted that “speakers with narrow high-frequency dispersion . . . tend to project the phantom at or in front of the lateral speaker plane.” In an anechoic chamber, it can occur when listening to a single loudspeaker, especially on the frontal axis, in which case front-back reversals are also frequent occurrences. This phenomenon is so strong that it need not be a “blind” situation. Interestingly, a demonstration of four-loudspeaker Ambisonic recordings played in an anechoic chamber yielded an auditory impression that was almost totally within the head. This was a great disappointment to the gathered enthusiasts, all of whom anticipated an approximation of perfection. It suggested that, psychoacoustically, something fundamentally important was not being captured or communicated to the ears. An identical setup in a normally reflective room sounded far more realistic, even though the room reflections were a substantial corruption of the encoded sounds arriving at the ears.”

 

[tuga]

@tuga

You had brought up the anechoic chamber question several times in this thread. I thought you might be interested to read this quote from Toole in Loudspeakers and Rooms:

“In-head localization seems like the logical opposite of an enveloping, external, and spacious auditory illusion. Perceptions of sounds originating inside the head, which routinely occur in headphone listening, can also occur in loudspeaker listening when the direct sound is not supported by the right amount and kind of reflected sound. The author and his colleagues have experienced the phenomenon many times when listening to stereo recordings in an anechoic chamber, usually with acoustically “dry” sounds hard panned to center or, less often, to the sides. It prompted an investigation (Toole, 1970), the conclusion of which was that there is a continuum of localization experience from external at a distance through to totally within the head. It is often noted with higher frequencies, and it can happen in a normal room with loudspeakers that have high directivity or in any situation where a strong direct sound is heard without appropriate reflections. Moulton (1995) noted that “speakers with narrow high-frequency dispersion . . . tend to project the phantom at or in front of the lateral speaker plane.” In an anechoic chamber, it can occur when listening to a single loudspeaker, especially on the frontal axis, in which case front-back reversals are also frequent occurrences. This phenomenon is so strong that it need not be a “blind” situation. Interestingly, a demonstration of four-loudspeaker Ambisonic recordings played in an anechoic chamber yielded an auditory impression that was almost totally within the head. This was a great disappointment to the gathered enthusiasts, all of whom anticipated an approximation of perfection. It suggested that, psychoacoustically, something fundamentally important was not being captured or communicated to the ears. An identical setup in a normally reflective room sounded far more realistic, even though the room reflections were a substantial corruption of the encoded sounds arriving at the ears.”

Thanks for the citation, although I think that you may have missed the context of my quoted comment.

 

[youngho]

Thanks for the citation, although I think that you may have missed the context of my quoted comment.

No, you had brought up testing spatial aspects of speakers in anechoic chambers, but I just couldn't be bothered to find the right post, which is why I referred to your bringing up the anechoic chamber at other times in the thread. In any case, at that time, I had declined to speculate on how loudspeakers sound in anechoic chambers, and I had forgotten about the above text from Toole.

[edit] see here and the following post, didn't seem ironic

 

[tuga]

No, you had brought up testing spatial aspects of speakers in anechoic chambers, but I just couldn't be bothered to find the right post, which is why I referred to your bringing up the anechoic chamber at other times in the thread. In any case, at that time, I had declined to speculate on how loudspeakers sound in anechoic chambers, and I had forgotten about the above text from Toole.

I can't remember, but it's possible that I was using irony.

 

[Newman]

Yes they produce tremendous multichannel recordings! It is making me consider selling all my gear and buy all Genelec speakers with just a prepro. Just can’t get any good deals in pro-lines unfortunately ;(

Pro-lines already are a good deal. Because they have to sell to people who demand maximum objective performance per dollar, for business reasons.

If Wilson had developed the M2 it would have cost $1/4m and been fashioned as the Devil’s Cloak made from high-tech concrete, for no sonic difference.

So the $20k M2 and its brethren at all price points are already good deals!
Cheers

 

[youngho]

I can't remember, but it's possible that I was using irony.

Your irony must have been very subtle if actually intended, see the posts before after this one.

I started a new thread expanding on some speculations I presented earlier in this one.

 

[youngho]

More reports on anechoic listening:

Anechoic listening room?

Not sure if this is the right place. appologies if so. But if you could make an anechoic or close too room as a listening room (for loudspeakers naturally) would that be recommended? i cant seem to find anything, or even any "reviews" of listening to loudspeakers in an anechoic chamber...

www.diyaudio.com

Listening in an Anechoic Chamber

A rare opportunity occurred where we could set p a listening test session in an Anechoic chamber. The experience was very much as I had exp...

augene.blogspot.com

 

[Tom C]

If this question is still about my earlier post then I think that it was misunderstood.

I didn't mean that classical music was written for a particular venue but that different composition types were conceived for a particular kind of venue.
A symphony in a church will sound awful, and a string quartet or a cello suite will not sound particularly good in a large symphony hall.
A good symphony hall will add "quality" to the sound (bass lift, reverb).

Try listening to the Denon CD recording of an orchestra in an anechoic chamber, it's quite interesting. If I remember correctly there's even synthetic simulation the "ambience" of several famous halls.

https://www.stereophile.com/j_gordo...on_anechoic_orchestral_recordingsi/index.html



Edit: I've found an online copy of the booklet -> http://www.angelofarina.it/Public/Denon_CD/denon.htm

Objectivist unobtanium. Who’d a thunk?

 

[andyc56]

04:20

Is it just me, or does that guy look like Herman Munster in drag?

 

[aac]

More reports on anechoic listening:

Anechoic listening room?

Not sure if this is the right place. appologies if so. But if you could make an anechoic or close too room as a listening room (for loudspeakers naturally) would that be recommended? i cant seem to find anything, or even any "reviews" of listening to loudspeakers in an anechoic chamber...

www.diyaudio.com

Listening in an Anechoic Chamber

A rare opportunity occurred where we could set p a listening test session in an Anechoic chamber. The experience was very much as I had exp...

augene.blogspot.com

Non-environmental studios are still being built for a reason.

 

[killdozzer]

Is it just me, or does that guy look like Herman Munster in drag?

Looks aside, I love the guy. In my life, I probably laughed the hardest at his stand up of all other stand ups.