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Which Speakers Are Know To Have The Best Spinorama Measurements?

Johan Liebert

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I love the independent measurements taken on this site.

But I've seen mentions of related products for both passive and active speakers that have better measurements yet.

For example when the M16s were reviewed I found it interesting that the M126Be didn't have better measurements than their M105s even though they are Revel's Flagship for that design.

Or when the Genelec 8341A were reviewed there was mention that their 8351B's measured the best.
 
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Johan Liebert

Johan Liebert

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Thanks, I do find it interesting that the Kef R3's and Genelecs were the best measuring so far in so much that I'm taking a serious look at the R3s.
 

phoenixdogfan

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Thanks, I do find it interesting that the Kef R3's and Genelecs were the best measuring so far in so much that I'm taking a serious look at the R3s.
He's still very early on into this process. I would hold off until he gets the opportunity to Klippel some things like the Kii3s, Revel Performa f228be, Dutch & Dutch 8cs, and possibly Gradient 1.4s before making a leap.
 
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Johan Liebert

Johan Liebert

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He's still very early on into this process. I would hold off until he gets the opportunity to Klippel some things like the Kii3s, Revel Performa f228be, Dutch & Dutch 8cs, and possibly Gradient 1.4s before making a leap.
He's still very early on into this process. I would hold off until he gets the opportunity to Klippel some things like the Kii3s, Revel Performa f228be, Dutch & Dutch 8cs, and possibly Gradient 1.4s before making a leap.
I guess I can be a bit more patient. Not moving to my new place until June.
 

ReaderZ

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I love the independent measurements taken on this site.

But I've seen mentions of related products for both passive and active speakers that have better measurements yet.

For example when the M16s were reviewed I found it interesting that the M126Be didn't have better measurements than their M105s even though they are Revel's Flagship for that design.

Or when the Genelec 8341A were reviewed there was mention that their 8351B's measured the best.


There was a thread on Genelec's forum about why 8350A measures better than the flagship 8351A on Sound and Recording.

And 8350A is far from best measured on Sound and Recording.
 

Sancus

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There was a thread on Genelec's forum about why 8350A measures better than the flagship 8351A on Sound and Recording.

And 8350A is far from best measured on Sound and Recording.

A very old thread? The 8361A is now flagship and the 8351B is probably the best measuring Genelec speaker overall.
 

ReaderZ

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A very old thread? The 8361A is now flagship and the 8351B is probably the best measuring Genelec speaker overall.

No, flagship consider the size, 50 vs 51, and no, it's from last year, where 8350 easily beat 8351A.
As for best measuring, please link, I haven't found much of 3rd party measurement, much less one site who measured both 8350 and 8351B.
 

pozz

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8350A
8351A

Both from Sound & Recording. 8350A is better in a lot of areas. I don't know what the best measuring speaker on S&R is. Maybe the JBL M2.

I have not seen any independent measurements of the 8351B yet.
 

ReaderZ

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8350A
8351A

Both from Sound & Recording. 8350A is better in a lot of areas. I don't know what the best measuring speaker on S&R is. Maybe the JBL M2.

I have not seen any independent measurements of the 8351B yet.


That's the ones I was talking about, I think 8351 A was only better in vertical dispersion and maybe small edge in one other measurement, 8350 was better in the rest.

Do you have a link to the JBL M2? I can't find it.
 

Sancus

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That's the ones I was talking about, I think 8351 A was only better in vertical dispersion and maybe small edge in one other measurement, 8350 was better in the rest.

Do you have a link to the JBL M2? I can't find it.

Directivity for the M2 was posted on this other forum, I haven't seen it on the S&R site itself. I haven't seen an independent measurement of the 8351B, but given that Genelec's measurements always correlate well with third party, I'm not worried about it, though it'd be nice to see the max SPL graph, that's the only major piece of useful information S&R adds for me. But honestly it's immaterial unless you're not using a sub for some weird reason.

When you say "easily beat" I immediately get skeptical. There is so much opinion involved in interpreting measurements of speakers as good as the 8350a and 8351a/b. Personally, I don't consider a speaker with poor vertical dispersion to be in the same league as the Ones, almost regardless of what else they do well. And other things like the slightly wider directivity of the Ones are down to preference.
 

pozz

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ReaderZ

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Directivity for the M2 was posted on this other forum, I haven't seen it on the S&R site itself. I haven't seen an independent measurement of the 8351B, but given that Genelec's measurements always correlate well with third party, I'm not worried about it, though it'd be nice to see the max SPL graph, that's the only major piece of useful information S&R adds for me. But honestly it's immaterial unless you're not using a sub for some weird reason.

When you say "easily beat" I immediately get skeptical. There is so much opinion involved in interpreting measurements of speakers as good as the 8350a and 8351a/b. Personally, I don't consider a speaker with poor vertical dispersion to be in the same league as the Ones, almost regardless of what else they do well. And other things like the slightly wider directivity of the Ones are down to preference.

Well, depends on your need you can value some measurement over the others. Just looking at measurements you can read on S&R, 8350 is simply better than 8351 most other areas.

BTW I am not saying which one is the better speaker, but better measurements.
 

Sancus

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Well, depends on your need you can value some measurment over the others. Just looking at measurements you can read on S&R, 8350 is simply better than 8351 most other areas.

Which other areas are we talking about here? Not every area is equally important. Some of the things that S&R measures are totally irrelevant, imo, like IMD.
 

pozz

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@Sancus 8350A's frequency and phase responses are smoother, it handles impulses better (the decay spectrum chart), and shows better output below 100Hz. Those measurements are superior regardless of relevance.

To be clear, if I were to buy a speaker now, I'd likely get the 8351B.
 

ReaderZ

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Which other areas are we talking about here? Not every area is equally important. Some of the things that S&R measures are totally irrelevant, imo, like IMD.

Like I already said, it's up to you to decide what matters to you.
 

ReaderZ

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@Sancus 8350A's frequency and phase responses are smoother, it handles impulses better (the decay spectrum chart), and shows better output below 100Hz. Those measurements are superior regardless of relevance.

To be clear, if I were to buy a speaker now, I'd likely get the 8351B.

If I have lots of budget or money isn't issue at all, same here, 8351B all the way. But I don't and right now retail in where I live, I can get 8350A for about half of the cost of 8351B, then it's not so simple.
 

Sancus

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@Sancus 8350A's frequency and phase responses are smoother, it handles impulses better (the decay spectrum chart), and shows better output below 100Hz. Those measurements are superior regardless of relevance.

To be clear, if I were to buy a speaker now, I'd likely get the 8351B.

Thanks for pointing that out. I had noticed the phase response and output, but not the decay spectrum. It's possible the 8351B has improved output below 100hz, as that is one of the big weaknesses that Genelec seems to be working on from generation to generation.

But yes, if you just tally up measurements like that, it seems like missing the point. It's obvious(to me, anyways) that the whole purpose of the Ones is to achieve excellent vertical directivity in addition to horizontal. And if you don't want that feature, which isn't free, there's a tradeoff for everything, then of course other speakers make more sense.

And it's also pretty clear that what "better measurements" even mean is not settled when we are discussing things that are this good. All designs are trade offs, after all, it's just a question of priorities.

If I have lots of budget or money isn't issue at all, same here, 8351B all the way. But I don't and right now retail in where I live, I can get 8350A for about half of the cost of 8351B, then it's not so simple.

Yes, absolutely, if we add value to the equation, many many things win over the 8351B haha.
 

jonfitch

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I love the independent measurements taken on this site.

But I've seen mentions of related products for both passive and active speakers that have better measurements yet.

For example when the M16s were reviewed I found it interesting that the M126Be didn't have better measurements than their M105s even though they are Revel's Flagship for that design.

Or when the Genelec 8341A were reviewed there was mention that their 8351B's measured the best.

The M126Be doesn't really measure worse than the M105, it just has a off-axis dip at around 1700hz which is the crossover frequency. It's a rather large 6.5" woofer and it looks like they would have probably had to lower the crossover to something like 1200hz to get rid of the dip entirely, which is just not something Revel is going to do with a home theater speaker that requires a lot of dynamics. You can maybe get away with that with a nearfield speaker. It's a small trade-off for more bass.
 
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