Which DACs are interesting for modest DIYs running 16bit/48khz?

[Hayk]

I will add to the list ES9018K2M. This DAC can bypass its OS filter, function in mono, and adjust by software the THD. It cost $2 a pair inc ship from Ali.
It requires a uC to configure at startup that I am looking for STM32 as it costs $1 plus a usb stick to allow the DIY upload the program.

 

[Hayk]

From AKM I find affordable ak4493seq, about$6. It can bypass the DF and run in mono. Any good to add on the list?

 

[Hayk]

Both ESS and AKM use mulibit delta-sigma. I could find the ESS is 6bits as cs4398 and AD1794 but nothing about AKM. The ESS can fine adjust the resistors of 6bits. All these are nothing else but cheap versions of pcm69 which uses laser trimmed 10bit+1bit(maybe delta-sigma). It looks like 1bit only DACs technology is over.

 

[Hayk]

This video shows clear superiority of AK4493 over ES9039q2m.

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[Hayk]

I assambled nearly all the DACs, missing CS4303 to arrive in few weeks because free shipment and a second pair of AD1860 That I will receive tomorrow.
In all cases when a chip was advertised K or J, was fake, I received ordinary type.
The SM5865 CM went wrong as I ordered a pair from taobao, 8¥ each but received 1 piece and not refunded, the new price now ¥54 for me ¥5 for Singapore.
The AD1865 in PLCC are far cheaper than the other casing.
I got 10xTDA1543A and 30XTDA1545A about $0.25 each.
I will think over the AKM, the AK4499 seams to be different with switched resistor filter instead of capacitors, but for now it costs $42. I will consider it when $20-$25 range.

 

[Hayk]

 

[Hayk]

I started to design the PCBs for this project. It will be a mother board with 3x I2S inputs, SRC4190 board, and necessary logic to drive a plug in board.
8 plug in boards are now considered to carry over 20 type of DACs.
Studying more carefully the PCM67/69, I noticed I have done the wrong choice.As I explained, the DAC should be slightly non linear to be lower distortion, the idea this circuit does, an offset at the BPZ. The table below shows the weird Digital to analog conversion. If it says 67 is best suited for CD player and 69 , which has lower offset, better for audio DSP, it means the distortion generated for 67 is for 16 bit and 69 for 18 bit. This why I must use the PCM67 instead which requires 384Fs, 6x64x96 khz=36,864 Mhz.

 

[fws]

List of DACs by chronological order.

Audio DAC and ADC History

You have ALC889 listed as 2008 which is the "first release" in datasheet. My C2D era motherboard Gigabyte P35-DS4 used ALC889A and was released in 2007. I tried checking for datasheet to see if those are different chips, but couldn't find any. Gigabyte only specs it as 106 SNR.

btw. ALC650 used to be a bit recognizable model in some crowds due to controversy of it being used as DAC for nVidia SoundStorm (MCP-T APU/DSP), it was fairly usable though.

As for CS4398 affictionados, I have it in Sound Blaster Z which was actually measured by Amirm
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...nd-measurements-of-sound-blaster-z-card.9127/
If I recall right the amp stage on Headphone out runs on Max97220. I always found the sound to be flat and pleasant. I don't usually assign any magical perceived sound qualities to a flat and clean DACs, I was never able to assign any audible differentiating qualities to DAC chips, and I specifically got that card, because I was annoyed by some non-flat USB DACs I got after switching from X-Fi XtremeMusic card (PCI), but now despite having superior DACs like SMSL PS200 (ES9039Q2M), I still find something pleasant about that Z. I would actually gladly buy a new modern DAC or combo on CS4398 just because that good assotiation I have with it. Funnily enough, seems like my X-Fi ran on 8 channel CS4382.

 

[Hayk]

Thank you posting your opinion about these 2 DACs.
The ALC889 is 8 channel, too complicated to implement.
The CS4398 that you affectionados, do you use it for 16 or 24 bit?.
This DAC is the only 24 multibit sigma delta I found, that gives the distortion for [email protected] at -60db to be 2%. The lowest is TDA1541A S2 , 0.22%.
Have you ever compared it with CS4303, that I read many consider to be the best from this brand.
To start with design, I will make 3 plug ins. 1:TDA1543A/1545A +TD6709.
2: PCM56+AD1856+AD1851+AD1860+PCM61. 3: PCM67+AD1865+AD1866.
I make it interlaced so that JLCPCB will not notice each PCB is multiple circuits, or else the cost is $4×N for 5 pcs.

 

[Hayk]

Does running a CS4398 in mono differential can make it any better?

I have a plug-in for TDA1543A/45A. It has another 32bit delay to load on each DAC the same channel in differential mode. The TD6709 also needs, but I moved it on another plug in.
The CS4398 has single data input in serial and can use this plug in board.

 

[Hayk]

I am trying to find a reliable distortion measurements of cs4398. The DS says -107db (0.0004%)for 24 bit and -94db (0.005%) for 16 bit.
Audio design guide website gives the best result, 0.0047%&0.009%. On this website, I didn't find any near. It looks like, 24bit is just commercial argument.
Most spectrums show important 2nd harmonic, what the differential mode can cancel it out but the odd ones, will they double?

 

[Hayk]

I read a comparative test cs4398 vs AD1852

CS4398 vs. AD1852 DAC comparison

Big thanks to our member Skullguise, I was able to compare CS4398 vs. AD1852 DAC board in my Oritek Zhaolu 2.0. I had been listening to the AD1852 board for a long time, and without changing anything else in my system, I popped in the CS4398 board and listened. The differences are definitely...

www.head-fi.org

This chip is also affordable and gives the specifications when in mono.
I will discard AD1862 not affordable and AD1866, low quality for the price. Instead I will add the AD1852/53 in mono along cs4398.

 

[audio_tony]

I am trying to find a reliable distortion measurements of cs4398.

This might help?

Measurements of LJM CS4398 DAC kit

Here are measurements of the LJM CS4398 DAC kit (still available on Ebay) I built this around 2018 / 2019 IIRC. The board has had some mods (specifics not shown here). My test setup: Asus Xonar STX sound card with a self built buffer / gain box in front of that. Host PC is an Intel i7 running...

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[Hayk]

Thanks.
Indeed it has even harmonics that can be erased by differential.
I have a plug in board which can carry a third pair of DACs along 2x pcm67+2x CS4303. It must have parallel loading.
In serial type, pcm1738 is also excellent, not sigma delta and affordable.

 

[Hayk]

I gathered the DACs on 5 plug in boards with less than 4.5cm x 6cm max.
The list for now.
Plugin1: 2X TDA1543A/1545A mono + 2X CS4398 mono +2X AD1852mono.
Plugin2: 4X DIP +4X SMD for (pcm56,pcm61,AD1856,AD1851,AD1861,AD1860)+2XAD1864,1865 PLCC.
Plugin3: I call it the exotics, PCM67P, TD6709N, CS4303 all 2X mono.
Plugin4: 4X PCM1702 +2X SAA7350.
Plugin5: 2X WM8740 mono +2X PCM1794 mono +2X SM5865 mono.
The mother board gets right or left justified multiplexed L-R from the SRC and provides the plug-ins R, -R, L,-L and multiplexed R&-R, L&-L. 16,18,20,24 WCK for 16bit only. 12Mhz and 24Mhz MSCK are also provided.
I still have space for other DACs.

 

[Hayk]

Replaced the AD1852 with AD1853, same same but current output instead of voltage. Double price but still affordable.

 

[Hayk]

By looking Pioneer DACs, I read PE8001 re-branded PCM1716. It equipped the top model PD S707.
This chip dates 1988 and says multilevel delta sigma but not the type we know nowadays with 6 bit R2R+1bit, it is just 1 bit transformed into 8 levels.
Bellow you find the organigram.
It has lower distortion for 16 bit than cs4398 and affordable priced.
The outputs are voltages.
I am reconsidering the LS7881 from Sanyo. I read many like the high frequency character over TDA1543 and equipped a great number of CD players from best known brands. 5 pieces cost $1.5 only.

 

[audio_tony]

am reconsidering the LS7881 from Sanyo.

LC7881 surely?

 

[Hayk]

Many great brands used it in their serious models, Luxman, Pioneer, Marantz,Onkyo..
When I listen, not a single of them I found nice to listen to.
Sanyo itself for its good sounding cd player CD710, uses Sony CX 20152.
This DAC is made of 3 DACs, a 9 bit R2R+ 3 bit PWM +4bit level shift.
It has 20 times higher distortion than TDA1543, 0.08%. At high frequencies which are -30db ,the distortion should be above 2%.
I really don't understand why people like it. If there are DIYs interested in, I'll add it.

 

[Hayk]

The document bellow says the CS4397 was developed by the same team of Phillips TDA1541A.

Evolution of DAC & digital filter - DutchAudioClassics.nl

On March 8, 1979 Philips publicly demonstrated a prototype of an optical digital audio disc at a press conference called Philips Introduce Compact Disc in Eindhoven, Netherlands.

www.dutchaudioclassics.nl

Is it BS or real?