• WANTED: Happy members who like to discuss audio and other topics related to our interest. Desire to learn and share knowledge of science required. There are many reviews of audio hardware and expert members to help answer your questions. Click here to have your audio equipment measured for free!

Which DAC measurements do you like to see next?

SIY

Grand Contributor
Technical Expert
Joined
Apr 6, 2018
Messages
10,386
Likes
24,749
Location
Alfred, NY
In the primordial past (college, early 1980's) I used a fairly small box (about an 18"~24" cube IIRC) lined inside with absorption to measure near-field performance over most of the frequency range. Bass response was tough without a real anechoic chamber (which I had access to at the time; these days, the local college has a nice one, but I'd have to pay to use it or rope one of my friends on staff to help). The box when sealed had a pretty low noise floor after I wised up and suspended the measurement box within a larger box with thick walls and so forth to better isolate the measurement box from the outside world. And tended to test later at night when the building was quieter.

The bigger problem for me was getting a source that was known good over a wide range of frequency and dynamics. The good measurement mics often outdid the drivers used to send test signals to the mics. I had some piezo and compression drivers that were OK from maybe a few hundred Hz but sub-100 Hz I am not sure I was ever satisfied I knew what was limiting the measurements. My Earthworks was good to 5 Hz and at that time I had no good low-distortion driver flat to 5 Hz around.

But again, not my day job, so I was probably just being ignorant, or stupid, or both...

Or too early to the game. The key to getting good midband and HF measurements is gating the impulse response, which wasn't easy in the early '80s unless you were lucky enough to have Nicolet FFT gear (the NIC system I used then was >$100k). You do need a calibrated reference mike (I based my measurements off a B&K 4133 for most of my reviews, but have a new reference now). Ditto your sound source- it doesn't need to be flat, you can normalize it out. You do need a way of getting the diaphragm position repeatable for substitution, in my case a hanging string and golf ball, which are secured out of the way during measurements. A turntable with the diaphragm centered will allow you to get polar pattern data.

Noise floor measurements require isolation, either something like your box or, if you really want to plumb the depths, the BLANK chamber I use (which has allowed me to measure noise below 5 dB SPL).

Distortion is best done at a moderately low frequency in a nearfield setup. Most cheaper test mikes which otherwise look fine for frequency response fall apart in this test. Some expensive ones do, too. Here's a good expensive one versus a superb expensive one:

Earthworks M50 Distortion vs PCB 377A06.png
 

alex.r

Member
Joined
Jun 8, 2018
Messages
24
Likes
16
It would be amazing if you measured Realtek ALC 1220 on some respectable mobo brand and compared it with super-duper-audiophiliac stuff. :)

Interested in these measurements too.

Personally use Asus Gene VIII which claims:
1528492734502.png

or some of the latest their stuff like - Asus ROG Rampage VI Extreme:
1528492986631.png


Also would be great to see some measurements of some cheap and known Raspberry HAT DACs if it's suitable for audiophile forum - maybe a few in the way of comparison like:
1. Hifiberry DAC+ PRO (TI PCM5122)
2. iQaudio PIDAC-PRO (TI PCM5242)
3. Allo BOSS I2S DAC V 1.2 (TI PCM5122)
4. JustBoom DAC HAT (TI PCM5122)
5. ST4000 DAC ES9018K2M HDMI I2S TCXO (ES9018K2M)
6. AUDIOPHONICS I-SABRE V4 DAC ES9023 TCXO (ES9023)
7. AUDIOPHONICS I-TDA1387 TCXO (TDA 1387)
8. AOIDE DAC II ESS ES9018K2M I2S DAC (ES9018K2M)
9. AUDIOPHONICS DAC I-Sabre ES9038Q2M KALI EDITION (ES9038Q2M)

Thanks for your work.
 

Dialectic

Major Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Sep 26, 2017
Messages
1,740
Likes
3,098
Location
a fortified compound
Interested in these measurements too.

Personally use Asus Gene VIII which claims:
View attachment 13089
or some of the latest their stuff like - Asus ROG Rampage VI Extreme:
View attachment 13090

Also would be great to see some measurements of some cheap and known Raspberry HAT DACs if it's suitable for audiophile forum - maybe a few in the way of comparison like:
1. Hifiberry DAC+ PRO (TI PCM5122)
2. iQaudio PIDAC-PRO (TI PCM5242)
3. Allo BOSS I2S DAC V 1.2 (TI PCM5122)
4. JustBoom DAC HAT (TI PCM5122)
5. ST4000 DAC ES9018K2M HDMI I2S TCXO (ES9018K2M)
6. AUDIOPHONICS I-SABRE V4 DAC ES9023 TCXO (ES9023)
7. AUDIOPHONICS I-TDA1387 TCXO (TDA 1387)
8. AOIDE DAC II ESS ES9018K2M I2S DAC (ES9018K2M)
9. AUDIOPHONICS DAC I-Sabre ES9038Q2M KALI EDITION (ES9038Q2M)

Thanks for your work.

I'm perplexed by the marketing in the bottom ad. I'd be surprised if the mobo has discrete mosfets to power the headphone jack.

It would be rather challenging to measure one of those mobos because you would have to build a PC around it first!
 
OP
amirm

amirm

Founder/Admin
Staff Member
CFO (Chief Fun Officer)
Joined
Feb 13, 2016
Messages
44,370
Likes
234,429
Location
Seattle Area
Personally use Asus Gene VIII which claims:
Wow, I didn't realize Motherboard people were going that far in their audio solutions. I have something fancy on my desktop unit which I will measure at some point. :)

Welcome to the forum by the way. Good first post. :)
 

duo8

Member
Joined
Feb 27, 2018
Messages
94
Likes
48
It's interesting to see something that doesn't use realtek for once.
Unless "S1220" is another one of those realtek chips that never made it on their website.
 

Elix

Member
Joined
May 15, 2018
Messages
15
Likes
4
Amir, I'm basically checking this forum every day to see some portable DAC/AMP or DAP measurements from you :) While SMSL Idea is a good DAC, it is on par with my phone (Highscreen Boost 3 Pro with ES9018K2M + OPA1612). There are some interesting entries around:

DAC/AMPs:
SMSL IQ
Toppind NX4 DSD
iFi Audio Micro iDSD Black Label

DAPs:
F. Audio FA1
iBasso DX200
Oriolus DP100
xDuoo X20
 
OP
amirm

amirm

Founder/Admin
Staff Member
CFO (Chief Fun Officer)
Joined
Feb 13, 2016
Messages
44,370
Likes
234,429
Location
Seattle Area

dheepak10

Member
Joined
May 20, 2018
Messages
32
Likes
14
I have this one on loan so review will be coming. Just looking at it, it looks pretty nice!


I have the silver one of that. Will you settle for it?
Looking forward to NX4 DSD measurements
ifi nano iDSD black label by any chance? :)
These two are my shortlist for portable DAC/AMP
 
OP
amirm

amirm

Founder/Admin
Staff Member
CFO (Chief Fun Officer)
Joined
Feb 13, 2016
Messages
44,370
Likes
234,429
Location
Seattle Area
ifi nano iDSD black label by any chance? :)
Does anyone have one that wants to loan it to me for review? I have the silver one and don't use it. Hate to have two of them then. :)
 

mindbomb

Active Member
Joined
Nov 11, 2017
Messages
284
Likes
175
Wow, I didn't realize Motherboard people were going that far in their audio solutions. I have something fancy on my desktop unit which I will measure at some point. :)

Gamersnexus is a youtube channel known for their deep dives into computer hardware. I think it would be cool if you guys teamed up to cover the current state of motherboard audio - he probably has a bunch of new motherboards you can test.
https://www.gamersnexus.net/supportgn/1200-contact-us
 
OP
amirm

amirm

Founder/Admin
Staff Member
CFO (Chief Fun Officer)
Joined
Feb 13, 2016
Messages
44,370
Likes
234,429
Location
Seattle Area
Gamersnexus is a youtube channel known for their deep dives into computer hardware. I think it would be cool if you guys teamed up to cover the current state of motherboard audio - he probably has a bunch of new motherboards you can test.
https://www.gamersnexus.net/supportgn/1200-contact-us
Good suggestion. I just fired off an email to them. It may not hurt for some of you to express the same desire to them as common readers of both sites. :)
 

Ron Texas

Master Contributor
Joined
Jun 10, 2018
Messages
6,078
Likes
8,914
Rather than start a new thread, I will mention here that I just received an ifi nano idsd black. It drives HD650's to uncomfortably loud levels (for me) but not first row rock concert insane, will cause hearing loss, levels. While advertised as DSD256 capable, it will only do DSD128 on a Mac. I believe the only way to get DSD256 out of it is on Windows or Linux with an ASIO driver with native DSD (not DOP.)

I bought it to use in a nightstand setup with a Macbook Pro and an external USB 3 drive. It's a single box, single connection solution. Space is less than a desktop and I did not want a mess of wires, boxes or heat producing tubes. It is easy to pick it up in one hand with the external drive.

Subjective SQ:

Hints of chocolate, raspberry, tobacco, oleander, hemlock, Tide pods, and Drano. I think you get it.

I am looking forward to seeing the measurements. I hope they are not Schiit.
 

maxxevv

Major Contributor
Joined
Apr 12, 2018
Messages
1,872
Likes
1,964
In other words "coloured and not anywhere near transparent" ?

My guess is that it would measure somewhere in the middle of the road. Not crappy but not best-in-class either.
 

dheepak10

Member
Joined
May 20, 2018
Messages
32
Likes
14
Rather than start a new thread, I will mention here that I just received an ifi nano idsd black. It drives HD650's to uncomfortably loud levels (for me) but not first row rock concert insane, will cause hearing loss, levels. While advertised as DSD256 capable, it will only do DSD128 on a Mac. I believe the only way to get DSD256 out of it is on Windows or Linux with an ASIO driver with native DSD (not DOP.)

I bought it to use in a nightstand setup with a Macbook Pro and an external USB 3 drive. It's a single box, single connection solution. Space is less than a desktop and I did not want a mess of wires, boxes or heat producing tubes. It is easy to pick it up in one hand with the external drive.

Subjective SQ:

Hints of chocolate, raspberry, tobacco, oleander, hemlock, Tide pods, and Drano. I think you get it.

I am looking forward to seeing the measurements. I hope they are not Schiit.
Confused between this one and the NX4 DSD from Topping in the absence of measurements
 

Ron Texas

Master Contributor
Joined
Jun 10, 2018
Messages
6,078
Likes
8,914
Confused between this one and the NX4 DSD from Topping in the absence of measurements

Delivery times on the NX4 are long. You can have a nano black label in your hands in about 3 days. Buy from someplace with a liberal return policy and send it back if you don't like it.
 

Simon740

Member
Joined
Jun 13, 2018
Messages
18
Likes
3
Hello,

Im new on this forum and it will be Nice to see measurements for LKS 004 Sabre 9038 pro.

Regards,
Simon
 

palamudin

Member
Joined
May 21, 2018
Messages
94
Likes
61
Fast search of that device (LKS) netted a discovery that all ESS chips are garbage (as per SBAF membership), that R2R is the real deal and that Schiit is so good every household should have one. I can already hear my device playing worse. Must resist urge to buy 5k dac.
 

palamudin

Member
Joined
May 21, 2018
Messages
94
Likes
61
I just started a thread over at HF on the SMSL VMV D-1. Its also a dual ES9038PRO setup. Would be interesting to see what comes out of it though!

http://www.smsl-audio.com/productshow.asp?id=146
The promotional text on the page is hilarious. Why is it so hard to find a translator to get their thoughts into proper wording. Tho device itself looks like a beast.
 
Top Bottom