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When 12 Gauge Wire is Not 12 Gauge

amirm

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#82
I do plan on "reviewing" and measuring some RCA cables.....

WIth headphone cables I have found that when the impedance of the headphone is high, e.g. 300 ohm, it is actually quite easy to inject noise into the cabling! The typical low impedance of speakers eliminates this but with high impedance headphones, it can be an issue, certainly for measurements.
 

andreasmaaan

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#84
I haven't been able to find the output impedance of the pre out, unfortunately.
Are you able to contact Devialet to see if they can tell you, or to measure it? I see someone asked the same question on Devialet forum and it went unanswered. IMHO this would probably be the most decisive factor as to whether what you're doing is the best approach.
 

watchnerd

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#85
I do plan on "reviewing" and measuring some RCA cables.....

WIth headphone cables I have found that when the impedance of the headphone is high, e.g. 300 ohm, it is actually quite easy to inject noise into the cabling! The typical low impedance of speakers eliminates this but with high impedance headphones, it can be an issue, certainly for measurements.
So what do you think this means for 'medium impedance' headphones?

Most of mine are in the 30 - 65 ohm range.

The only 300 ohm cans I have are my Sennheiser 6XX.
 

watchnerd

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#88
Are you able to contact Devialet to see if they can tell you, or to measure it? I see someone asked the same question on Devialet forum and it went unanswered. IMHO this would probably be the most decisive factor as to whether what you're doing is the best approach.
Got an answer from Devialet support:

"The output impedance is less than 1 Ohm on expert and expert pro."
 

Soniclife

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#89
Got an answer from Devialet support:

"The output impedance is less than 1 Ohm on expert and expert pro."
That's good to know, I've heard other people say they found it to be better than the other amps they had, was always suspicious, but if the less than 1 ohm is true then it could well be very true.
 

watchnerd

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#91
Good. Should make it happier with longer cable runs too :)
Speaking of which, I'm quite pleased with my 10' of Blue Jeans MJC Belden RCA -> TRS, for a little over $50.

The locking Neutrik NJF36 TRS jack is the beefiest I've ever seen on a headphone cable. They could easily put a fancy jacket it on it, "cryo treat" it, and charge some ridiculous price.

 

watchnerd

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#92
That's good to know, I've heard other people say they found it to be better than the other amps they had, was always suspicious, but if the less than 1 ohm is true then it could well be very true.
As a headphone amp, I would rate it not quite as dynamic as my (0.1 ohm output impedance, capable of 20V output) ADI-2 Pro, but a lot cleaner than my Schiit Mjolnir 2 hybrid SS/tube amp.

It's a lot more detailed than the Schiit Mjolnir 2, where the noise floor is higher. I'd put both the Devialet and ADI on par in this respect. Both get adequately loud. The difference is in macro dynamics, where I find the ADI to be better. But on average-low DR music, this doesn't really matter as much.

It's more than "good enough" for me to enjoy when I can't listen to the speakers (too late at night, for example).

If I listened exclusively to headphones*, I'd probably want something better....but if that was the case, I probably wouldn't own the Devialet in the first place.

*caveat for electrostats, which even if only used from time to time, need special snowflake amps
 

Memoryerror

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#93
Have you thought of measuring Cat 5e or Cat 6? I have loads of it around, but don't know if it would do well as speaker wire, or even interconnects.
 

SIY

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#94
It will work OK for short runs as speaker wire. For typical unbalanced interconnects, use something coaxial.
 

amirm

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#95
Have you thought of measuring Cat 5e or Cat 6? I have loads of it around, but don't know if it would do well as speaker wire, or even interconnects.
Cat6 cable is 23 gauge wire. If you combine four of the wires for positive and four for negative, each one will have the equivalent gauge of 17. So it will be quite insufficient for much length of speaker wire.
 

Memoryerror

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#97
Cat6 cable is 23 gauge wire. If you combine four of the wires for positive and four for negative, each one will have the equivalent gauge of 17. So it will be quite insufficient for much length of speaker wire.
Thanks. I found a calculator because my next question was what about eight, but I guess I would have to use twelve wires together. Running three to each speaker, or taking them out of the sheeths and bundling them together, probably not the best of ideas.
 

Sal1950

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#99
Have you thought of measuring Cat 5e or Cat 6? I have loads of it around, but don't know if it would do well as speaker wire, or even interconnects.
What about balanced XLR?
To what end??
Purpose designed speaker and interconnect wires from reputable manufacturers are going to supply the best performance for the intended job.
Joining together a bunch of fine cat cables wires can have no positive effects for speaker signal transfer, and quite possibly some negatives such as shorts or failures from breakage of many fine connections. For the purpose of redundancy I've seen it sometimes recommended to use Canre star quad cable for speaker hookups but IMO that's as far as that line of thinking should be taken.
 

RayDunzl

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As my current speaker cables have 19 strands of 18 AWG (more or less) wire in them, I'm not concerned with them breaking, though they might break something else.

1540963433135.png

SPECIFICATIONS

Southwire SIMpull THHN® or THWN-2 or MTW (also AWM) comply with:
· ASTM - B3, B8 (7,19, 37, 61 Strands), B 787 (19 Wire Combination Unilay Strand)
· UL Standard 83, 1581, and 1063(MTW)
· T90 Nylon/TWN75 sizes through 1000 kcmil CSA C22.2 No. 75
· NOM-ANCE 90° C · Federal Specification A-A-59544
· National Electrical Code, NFPA 70· VW-1 - Sizes 14 through 1 AWG
· CT rated in sizes 1/0 AWG and larger
· FT1
 

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