Whats the most efficient way to transition from 2 channel to 5.1 or 7.1 system?

[twistedin]

I'm hoping to upgrade my 2 Channel system to something more robust. It will be used for mostly music but would like at least a 5 channel surround sound set up for occasional movie watching. I'm not too concerned with the sound quality/loudness of the surround speakers.
My Current Setup:
-KEF LS-50 x 2 Speakers
-Emotiva TA-100 2 channel Integrated Amp
-HSU VTF-2 MK 5
I also have a separate Topping E30 DAC and JDS Labs Atom Amp that I could incorporate.
Would it make sense to just sell the TA-100 and start fresh with a 7.1 AVR? I'm concerned an affordable AVR wouldn't be powerful enough to drive the LS 50's.
Could I use the TA-100 as the driver for just the main two channels and an AVR for the rest?
Or could I get a 7.1 Channel processor, and a 5 channel amp, and combine it with the TA-100?
Also how important would it be to match the center channel with the other LS-50's?

 

[Blumlein 88]

Either get a surround pre/pro, add amps to what you have and speakers of course.

Or maybe the simplest is this Denon AVR which tested well.

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ds/denon-avr-x3600h-av-receiver-review.12676/

And get your surround speakers.

If the Denon AVR is a bit short of powering your LS50's, then you can use the pre-amp out to keep using your Emotiva for the front two channels. Pretty simple, and efficient.

 

[twistedin]

Either get a surround pre/pro, add amps to what you have and speakers of course.

Or maybe the simplest is this Denon AVR which tested well.

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ds/denon-avr-x3600h-av-receiver-review.12676/

And get your surround speakers.

If the Denon AVR is a bit short of powering your LS50's, then you can use the pre-amp out to keep using your Emotiva for the front two channels. Pretty simple, and efficient.

Thanks for the advice. So a surround pre-pro is basically an AVR without the amp? I could use the TA-100 that I have for two of the channels and get another 3 or 5 channel for the rest?
I like the Denon AVR but it's a little out of my price range and 9 channels might be overkill. Do you think the more affordable AVR-X1600H would have similar sound quality if I don't need a lot of power/more than 7.2 channels? Would using the Topping E30 make any sense in the setup?

 

[Blumlein 88]

Yes a pre/pro is an audio video preamp. I'd suggest buying one 2-5 years old. You get a great discount and basic performance doesn't change much. At least with Marantz and Denon units.

So yes, one of those, keep your TA-100 for the front speakers and get other amps for the rest. Still might be hard to keep your budget this way.

I don't know if the X1600H would have the same performance with just lower power. I would guess it does, but till tested no way to know. The problem with it is the X3600H has preamp outputs for external amps while the X1600H does not. I would doubt the X1600H has enough power for you built in.

Using the E30 for direct input over analog into the AVR might be a bit of an improvement, but the AVR won't pass all the qualities of the E30.

 

[Putter]

Yes a pre/pro is an audio video preamp. I'd suggest buying one 2-5 years old. You get a great discount and basic performance doesn't change much. At least with Marantz and Denon units.

So yes, one of those, keep your TA-100 for the front speakers and get other amps for the rest. Still might be hard to keep your budget this way.

I don't know if the X1600H would have the same performance with just lower power. I would guess it does, but till tested no way to know. The problem with it is the X3600H has preamp outputs for external amps while the X1600H does not. I would doubt the X1600H has enough power for you built in.

Using the E30 for direct input over analog into the AVR might be a bit of an improvement, but the AVR won't pass all the qualities of the E30.

The problem with using the TA-100 for the front speakers is that it's an integrated amp with no way to bypass the preamp so you end up with 2 preamps in series. That might be OK for the surrounds (although not ideal), but problematic for the fronts.

If you want to get some functionality from the TA-100 of it in that system you could still use it for the phono preamp and as a tuner since the tuners included in AV receivers are mediocre and they often omit a phono input. The Denon 3500 and 3600 do have phono inputs, but the earlier versions (3300 and 3400) don't and many other AV receivers also don't have phono inputs.

 

[Dj7675]

Agree that if the X3600 is out of budget get the X3500 for around $500 from an authorized dealer with warranty. When operated in its normal operating range under it performs close to the x3600.

 

[andreasmaaan]

The problem with using the TA-100 for the front speakers is that it's an integrated amp with no way to bypass the preamp so you end up with 2 preamps in series. That might be OK for the surrounds (although not ideal), but problematic for the fronts.

I agree it's not very elegant, but I wouldn't necessarily say it's problematic. It depends on the performance of the TA-100.

If the preamp section is relatively clean (i.e. low distortion/low noise), I don't see how there could be a problem.

 

[twistedin]

Yes a pre/pro is an audio video preamp. I'd suggest buying one 2-5 years old. You get a great discount and basic performance doesn't change much. At least with Marantz and Denon units.

So yes, one of those, keep your TA-100 for the front speakers and get other amps for the rest. Still might be hard to keep your budget this way.

I don't know if the X1600H would have the same performance with just lower power. I would guess it does, but till tested no way to know. The problem with it is the X3600H has preamp outputs for external amps while the X1600H does not. I would doubt the X1600H has enough power for you built in.

Using the E30 for direct input over analog into the AVR might be a bit of an improvement, but the AVR won't pass all the qualities of the E30.

Great point about the pre-outs. I didn't check to see if the lower models had those, I guess they'd be essential if I wanted to go the AVR > External amp route.
What do you mean by AVR won't pass all the qualities of the E30?

 

[twistedin]

Agree that if the X3600 is out of budget get the X3500 for around $500 from an authorized dealer with warranty. When operated in its normal operating range under it performs close to the x3600.

I'm not seeing any available online unfortunately, any recommendations on sites to check?

 

[twistedin]

The problem with using the TA-100 for the front speakers is that it's an integrated amp with no way to bypass the preamp so you end up with 2 preamps in series. That might be OK for the surrounds (although not ideal), but problematic for the fronts.

If you want to get some functionality from the TA-100 of it in that system you could still use it for the phono preamp and as a tuner since the tuners included in AV receivers are mediocre and they often omit a phono input. The Denon 3500 and 3600 do have phono inputs, but the earlier versions (3300 and 3400) don't and many other AV receivers also don't have phono inputs.

Ah. I wouldn't use the tuner or the Phono to be honest, it probably would be best to just get rid of it and start fresh.
Do you think something like the Denon X3500 would be able to power the LS50's cleanly with moderate listening levels?

 

[Blumlein 88]

Great point about the pre-outs. I didn't check to see if the lower models had those, I guess they'd be essential if I wanted to go the AVR > External amp route.
What do you mean by AVR won't pass all the qualities of the E30?

The E30 probably has lower noise, and lower distortion than the analog path of the AVR. It also is better than the digital section of the AVR. So you'll gain a little avoiding the AVR digital section, but the analog section will be something of a bottleneck. Now I doubt you'll hear a difference so it isn't that big of an issue.

I also agree the T100 having a preamp likely isn't a big problem.

 

[RickSanchez]

Do you think the more affordable AVR-X1600H would have similar sound quality if I don't need a lot of power/more than 7.2 channels?

Also worth mentioning the other advantage of the X3500 / X3600: both use Audyssey MultEQ XT32 for room EQ, instead of the MultEQ XT on the X1600. In addition to the higher filter resolution I believe XT32 also has subwoofer EQ that allows for managing 2 subs independently.

 

[Dj7675]

I'm not seeing any available online unfortunately, any recommendations on sites to check?

For quite a while there was several places offering it for $499/$549 delivered (new,full warranty). I purchased mine from listen up on ebay and I also later saw safeandsoundhq had them at that price as well. I don’t see that price any longer unfortunately. As mentioned before, if you located a new or used x3300/3400/3500 I think all of them have about the same performance. If streaming is important, Denon models with an H at the end are Heos compatible which is nice to have built in.

 

[twistedin]

Also worth mentioning the other advantage of the X3500 / X3600: both use Audyssey MultEQ XT32 for room EQ, instead of the MultEQ XT on the X1600. In addition to the higher filter resolution I believe XT32 also has subwoofer EQ that allows for managing 2 subs independently.

View attachment 65277

Ah yes definitely another thing to consider.

 

[twistedin]

For quite a while there was several places offering it for $499/$549 delivered (new,full warranty). I purchased mine from listen up on ebay and I also later saw safeandsoundhq had them at that price as well. I don’t see that price any longer unfortunately. As mentioned before, if you located a new or used x3300/3400/3500 I think all of them have about the same performance. If streaming is important, Denon models with an H at the end are Heos compatible which is nice to have built in.

Are your still using the 3500? What kind of speakers after you running through it?

Right now I'm streaming music through Roku > TV > TA-100. I've though about moving to a raspberry pi set up. Would that be similar to what Heos does?

 

[twistedin]

The E30 probably has lower noise, and lower distortion than the analog path of the AVR. It also is better than the digital section of the AVR. So you'll gain a little avoiding the AVR digital section, but the analog section will be something of a bottleneck. Now I doubt you'll hear a difference so it isn't that big of an issue.

I also agree the T100 having a preamp likely isn't a big problem.

Gotcha. Do you think that powering the main two LS50's through the TA-100 and the center channel LS-50 through the AVR would create a noticable imbalance? Or would that get corrected through Audyssey?

 

[Dj7675]

Are your still using the 3500? What kind of speakers after you running through it?

Right now I'm streaming music through Roku > TV > TA-100. I've though about moving to a raspberry pi set up. Would that be similar to what Heos does?

I have an x3500 in my living room/tv >M106 (no sub). It does exactly what I need it to and then some. Having extra amps to do zone2 is helpful. I have an X8500 in our theater for a 7.1.6 setup with 3 M16, some DIY Coaxials for the other channels. I have 2 Rythmik L12s (soon to be 4). I am a huge fan of both. Good amps/dac, good room correction (with app), excellent features, menu/GUI/software is rock solid and quick.