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What's the difference between tone, timbre and tonality
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Multicore
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Timbre is when you're referring to the tone (FR) of musical instruments. The difference between tone and tonality is, iiuc, like the difference between social and societal, it depends how fancy you want to seem.
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Not close to correct, at least not in the disciplines within which they are most frequently used. In hi-fi discussions they are too vague, unspecific, or ill defined to be particularly useful. The question of their differences is also too vast to be covered in a compact thread. Nonetheless, I will toss out a very incomplete overview of their use within their most relevant domains.
Timbre is almost universally used to describe the quality of a sound, typically of a musical instrument or voice. There was a long, often contentious thread on ASR about how one might describe, define, or specify timbres.
Tonality, within musical domains, refers to the harmonic scheme (and style periods) to which a genre or piece of music belongs. For instance, Most Western music from c 1600-1900 is tonal, i.e., it employs what is called common practice harmony. Blues and Beethoven (and tons of other music) fall into this system. Most earlier music is either known to be or theorized to have been modal, as is most non "Western music.*" Music of 20th and 21st century is filled with various "tonal schemes" which are neither modal nor common practice, a list of which (very incomplete) includes atonal, serial, microtonal, and polytonal (which also describes some non-western and early musics).
Tone, used by itself, is too vague to be useful in most discussions. In music, a single pitch might be called a tone or it could also be used as a rough synonym for timbre, comparing or describing similar timbres, which is close to its least scientific use in audio discussions.
This barely scratches the surface. Good luck filling in the gaps.
* Ironically, K-POP is musically Western, Eastern geographically. Like Blues, Jazz, and R&R, it is a fortuitous collision two (or more) musical schemes.
I'd suggest spectral energy, but you can measure that too.
kemmler3D
Master Contributor
As used by the unwashed audiophile masses I would say they're basically the same thing and often referring to something that has none of those properties (like a DAC), or misapplying timbre to talk about speakers / headphones.
As properly defined I would agree with @Multicore. Timbre has a well-specified meaning relative to musical instruments, and tone / tonality (as used in the audio, as distinct from music worlds) are roughly equivalent and less specific ways to describe the subjective character of sound.
"The tone is bright" "the tonality is treble-heavy", etc.
Timbre is whatever present in the sound makes a given musical instrument sound like itself, I personally think using the word in other ways is controversial.
As properly defined I would agree with @Multicore. Timbre has a well-specified meaning relative to musical instruments, and tone / tonality (as used in the audio, as distinct from music worlds) are roughly equivalent and less specific ways to describe the subjective character of sound.
"The tone is bright" "the tonality is treble-heavy", etc.
Timbre is whatever present in the sound makes a given musical instrument sound like itself, I personally think using the word in other ways is controversial.
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Multicore
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That's correct and I should have noted it.
In the audio/hifi domain it's a fancy way of referring to tone (timbre even more fancy) when dealing with things like speakers, mics or pickups.
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Or the difference between method (correct) and methodology (pompous and incorrect).
Tone controls used to apply to Bass/Treble sometimes Mid tweaking controls. Now often converted to DSP based EQ.
Timbre is not a measurement quality, best reserved for subtle differences in sound between instances of a specific acoustic instrument category, outside of the audiophile / electronics context.
Tonality is in the mix for subjective audiofool descriptions mixed in with the other two, without objective distinctions or real meaning other than "how it sounds to me"
Timbre is not a measurement quality, best reserved for subtle differences in sound between instances of a specific acoustic instrument category, outside of the audiophile / electronics context.
Tonality is in the mix for subjective audiofool descriptions mixed in with the other two, without objective distinctions or real meaning other than "how it sounds to me"
solderdude
Grand Contributor
To me, thus not the actual meaning but you asked for 'what say ye' and not for the best definitions just opinions.
Tone (again to me) is a played note on an instrument. Amplitude and frequency over time defines that tone.
The spectrum/decay/amplitude at the source level.
Timbre are the amplitude, frequency and time components and how these are heard by your ears and reconstructed in your brain... the perceived note(s) of specific sound sources. Basically the perceived 'note' as described above,
Tonality is a technical aspect of a specific 'frequency response' of a transducer for instance. Not a played note but rather an alteration in frequency response of the means used to (re)produce a note.
I'd even say it's an unfortunate borrow when applied to transducers, where well established metrics (like FR) serve far better.
MattHooper
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I think tone and timber are related, with timbre being a sort of specific subset of considerations.
Looking it up to refresh my memory….
Generally speaking, I believe in acoustic and musical theory, “timbre” refers to the tone or tonal color of a sound. But more specifically, timbre is the “main perceptual attribute that allows your ear to distinguish between two different sources of sound—such as a grand piano and a cello—even when they are playing the exact same note (pitch) at the exact same volume (loudness).”
Whereas tone can be attributed a somewhat wider scale, like “ the tonal balance of a system.”
At least that’s how I tend to think of them.
I may note for instance when I’m listening to a loudspeaker that it has a general tonal balance tilted downward - somewhat raised in the bass through lower mid range, and high frequencies rolled off, leading to what I might perceive as an overall “ warmer” sound signature.
But within that general tonal description, I will be able to recognize and describe the many different timbral differences of various instruments and voices.
To me timbre is the quality that is sort of
“ sounds like what it’s made of”….eg the signature that distinguishes a drumstick hitting a wood object like a wood block versus a metal object like a symbal or chime.
Or even if it were hitting a tabletop made of wood versus a table top made of metal or plastic.
And it’s the timbral qualities of different instruments and voices that I tend to note and care about first in a sound system.
I can tolerate certain colorations in the tonal balance of a sound system (maybe an elevated lower midrange, a bit of sparkle in the high frequencies), so long as the more specific timbral qualities of different instrument sound generally right or beautiful to me.
Looking it up to refresh my memory….
Generally speaking, I believe in acoustic and musical theory, “timbre” refers to the tone or tonal color of a sound. But more specifically, timbre is the “main perceptual attribute that allows your ear to distinguish between two different sources of sound—such as a grand piano and a cello—even when they are playing the exact same note (pitch) at the exact same volume (loudness).”
Whereas tone can be attributed a somewhat wider scale, like “ the tonal balance of a system.”
At least that’s how I tend to think of them.
I may note for instance when I’m listening to a loudspeaker that it has a general tonal balance tilted downward - somewhat raised in the bass through lower mid range, and high frequencies rolled off, leading to what I might perceive as an overall “ warmer” sound signature.
But within that general tonal description, I will be able to recognize and describe the many different timbral differences of various instruments and voices.
To me timbre is the quality that is sort of
“ sounds like what it’s made of”….eg the signature that distinguishes a drumstick hitting a wood object like a wood block versus a metal object like a symbal or chime.
Or even if it were hitting a tabletop made of wood versus a table top made of metal or plastic.
And it’s the timbral qualities of different instruments and voices that I tend to note and care about first in a sound system.
I can tolerate certain colorations in the tonal balance of a sound system (maybe an elevated lower midrange, a bit of sparkle in the high frequencies), so long as the more specific timbral qualities of different instrument sound generally right or beautiful to me.
MattHooper
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Well…we make up words to communicate.
Just like the made up words in your post.
So I’m not exactly sure what your point is.,
If they don't units of measurement they existential or rhetorical concepts up for subjective interpretation. Is the tone of my comment condescending, authoritative, reassuring, etc.
MattHooper
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