What's Left In Speaker Design To Reduce Distortion/Increase Detail Retrieval?

[tuga]

Which you have to transduce to hear thus have zero reference to be accurate to.

Sure. That is the purpose of this topic - enumerate "What's Left In Speaker Design To Reduce Distortion/Increase Detail Retrieval?"

But, you'll surely agree, listening tests have to be complemented with (a comprehensive set of) measurements (and not just a Spin).

 

[tuga]

No, because audible is all that matters.

Audible to whom?

 

[tuga]

Perhaps "poorer", just like our vertical hearing

Yours or humans in general? Show me relevant research.

Look up bible chapter 7.6.5.1 (although with a tiny sample of 3) and also in this piece from AudioXpress: "an interesting group of papers by Jorma Salmi and Anders Weckstrom, starting with their 1982 Audio Engineering Society (AES) paper “Listening Room Influence On Loudspeaker Sound Quality And Ways Of Minimizing It” isolated and explored, by way of a number of experiments—including straight wire bypass and anechoic vs. echoic rooms—the notion that correlated, vertical reflections were a primary source of perceived coloration from loudspeakers in rooms."

It's perhaps not given enough significance because Revels and JBLs perform poorly in this parameter

 

[tuga]

Poor excuse that never hinders your speculations

It's a critical assessment of what I have read, others prefer to take what they read at face value...

 

[tuga]

Nope, but I believe dismissing 100 years of said research leads to looking audio forum audiophile silly, always without cognizance.

I agree. I don't dismiss the whole 100 years of research, only the poor research and dubious interpretation of the data made during those 100 years...

 

[FrankW]

Yours or humans in general? Show me relevant research.

That burden is all yours to show coaxial vertical are preferred, since the very paper (Salmi) you cited used a non-coaxial...hilariously

 

[tuga]

That burden is all yours to show coaxial vertical are preferred, since the very paper (Salmi) you cited used a non-coaxial...hilariously

Preference is off-topic...hilariously

 

[FrankW]

Preference is off-topic...hilariously

Indeed for coaxials

 

[FrankW]

B&W 8**

 

[tuga]

Perhaps "poorer", just like our vertical hearing

I agree if that our localisation ability is poorer on the vertical axis, as per e.g. "Perception of vertically separated sound sources in the median plane "Taeho Kim
But the spectral balance at the listening spot is a combination of direct sound and early reflections.

 

[FrankW]

I agree if that our localisation ability is poorer on the vertical axis, as per e.g. "Perception of vertically separated sound sources in the median plane "Taeho Kim
But the spectral balance at the listening spot is a combination of direct sound and early reflections.

Correct, we hear predominantly laterally with 2 laterally evolved ears. Enjoy your B&Ws

 

[tuga]

Correct, we hear predominantly laterally with 2 laterally evolved ears.

What has that to do with the tonal balance at the listening spot becoming a mess due to ceiling reflections with non-coax speakers?
You wanted something that could be improved, there you have it.

Enjoy your B&Ws

I don't own B&Ws.

 

[FrankW]

B&W 8** https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...l-music-pros-using.12225/page-38#post-1502344

I don't own B&Ws.

Enjoy your studio B&Ws

 

[tuga]

Enjoy your studio B&Ws

I don't own B&Ws. And try focusing on the ball...

 

[FrankW]

And try focusing on the ball...

Sure, non-coaxials are a non-issue for both of us. Until evidence shows otherwise.

 

[Galliardist]

Correct, we hear predominantly laterally with 2 laterally evolved ears. Enjoy your B&Ws

He doesn't own them, and gave a preference against a more recent model, based on owning them in the past. He made this clear when I referred to them in regard to him.

He defends others having the right to own B&Ws, and while I'm, er, biased against them and would only recommend them after somebody has rejected speakers that better fit the average person's likely controlled preference, owning B&Ws isn't illegal or invalidated by the research, and it's therefore a valid choice.

What's the current position on wavelengths, driver separation and "virtual" point sources? Have the older ideas that you could have a virtual point source been rejected, even in the horizontal plane? I don't have any reference works available at the moment.

 

[tuga]

Sure, non-coaxials are a non-issue for both of us. Until evidence shows otherwise.

The evidence is a FR measurement at the listening spot. You can't pick and choose.

 

[FrankW]

What's the current position on wavelengths, driver separation and "virtual" point sources? Have the older ideas that you could have a virtual point source been rejected, even in the horizontal plane? I don't have any reference works available at the moment.

Not quite sure what you're asking, I'm simply saying I'm not aware of any preference for/against coaxials/symmetric vertical radiation by listeners. I'd be happy to look at any evidence.

 

[FrankW]

The evidence is a FR measurement at the listening spot.

That's a pressure microphone snapshot, not a perceptual listening test. Which of course you have none.

 

[tuga]

That's a pressure microphone snapshot, not a perceptual listening test. Which of course you have none.

If you don't like a Spin or a listening-spot measurement, try a MM&M.