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What's hot? Which AMP is currently the strongest contender? (brand new, up to $1000 / 850 Euro in EU ).

solderdude said:
You can safely skip all the R2R DACs.

There are plenty of DAC speaker amps even with BT connections.
Anything that can supply 70-150W in 4 ohm will probably do (be good enough).

There is no 'best' amp nor DAC-amp nor speaker.
Also tests won't reveal if it will function problem free for the coming years either,
All DAC's and amps willl 'sound' good.
Click to expand...
This is a fallacy:

“All DACS and amps will sound good”

More accurately stated:

“Competent DACS and Amps within their linear bandwidth won’t have a sound that’s good or bad, they’ll be transparent”
 
jmdesignz2 said:
This is a fallacy:

“All DACS and amps will sound good”
Click to expand...
Yes it is... it seems I forgot to add the usual 'competent' ;)


jmdesignz2 said:
“Competent DACS and Amps within their linear bandwidth won’t have a sound that’s good or bad, they’ll be transparent”
Click to expand...
Absolutely... Signal quality will be fine.
They will 'sound' good too, but so will the ones that are not considered 'transparent' they just don't measure within the 'considered transparent' performance limits.

In the last 20 years or so I have not encountered a single DAC nor amp (aside from some cheap few $ toys) that sounded bad (as in really broken) unless they were broken or not getting a good signal.

Even the ones rated poor (for whatever reason) may still 'sound' good to most people.
There may well be quite a few of them that won't measure well and may not be 'transparent' but never heard a bad amp (fortunately),

There are many amps and DACs that I have not heard or used so there might be quite a few that don't 'sound' good but I did not hear it.
If I 'listened' to 0.01% of all DACs and amps I would be really surprised.

I have heard a lot of bad 'sound' but the culprit was always the speakers (and/or locations they were used in) or headphones or them being driven by under powered (and clipping) amps or poor recordings or music I did not care for.
 
rocksteady said:
1. Why that is? Honest question.
2. This statement seems to contradict the above...
Click to expand...

R2R DACs are a 'novelty' and have less technical performance than 'normal' DACs.
There are some more expensive ones that have higher performance but still not as good as 'normal' DACs in the same price range.
Even filter-less R2R DACs that have huge distortion and mirror images as well as roll-off are 'very well liked for their great sound quality by 'connoisseurs of high end audio' so even those do not sound bad to the golden-eared listeners (but normal DACs are to them).
Now, some very cheap few $ Ali-express thingies may have some issues.

That said... All 'competent' DACs will sound good unless there is something really wrong with it.
The thing is that most DACs, even the less competent ones will sound good with just a few exceptions.

Even the ones that test 'poor' in ASR are likely to sound good. It is just that they either have higher distortion numbers (but still below audible levels).

The same is true for most amplifiers. As long as they can supply enough power in the required impedance and are not driven into clipping.
Sure there are some that may have some peaking (load dependent) or some roll-off in the extremes (tube or budget class-D) but even those do not sound 'bad' despite showing distortion levels in the few percent at full power. Most listeners only rarely reach those levels.
As long as amplifiers do not clip at the desired SPL they are not really an issue.... sound quality wise.

Speakers and headphones is a totally different animal.
 
Mamocel said:
:facepalm:
Click to expand...
Why are they not a 'novelty' ?

definition of novelty: something new or unusual.

New the technology is not so that leaves unusual.
The K13 can safely be skipped, regardless how many people love the sound, the performance is poor (but not poor enough to sound bad).
 
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R2R DACs existed before Sigma Delta chips...
The good old TDA1541 chip... (1981). AD1862... no date found.:)
 
Mamocel said:
R2R DACs existed before Sigma Delta chips...
The good old TDA1541 chip... (1981). AD1862... no date found.:)
Click to expand...
Yep they preceeded DS and are now obsolete as they are 'old tech' and don't perform as good as Delta Sigma converters.

Due to the 'hang' to the old (everything old always seems to sound better) they are now seen more and more.
First using pulls and old stock (used incorrectly without the mandotory digital filter) and a few years ago the 'discrete' ones came around.
These are more of a 'novelty' and came after DS with the 'audiophile promise of more analog sound'. All founded on sentiment and belief.
Especially the 'NOS' are performing technically extremely poorly yet many find them to sound good.
That is a testimony to how poor the hearing relatively is.
 
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solderdude said:
Yep they preceeded DS and are now obsolete as they are 'old tech' and don't perform as good as Delta Sigma converters.

Due to the 'hang' to the old (everything old always seems to sound better) they are now seen more and more.
First using pulls and old stock (used incorrectly without the mandotory digital filter) and a few years ago the 'discrete' ones came around.
These are more of a 'novelty' and came after DS with the 'audiophile promise of more analog sound'. All founded on sentiment and belief.
Especially the 'NOS' are performing technically extremely poorly yet many find them to sound good.
That is a testimony to how poor the hearing relatively is.
Click to expand...
Not sure this proves “poor hearing”

Perhaps the”artifacts, distortions and what have you etc“ and the subsequent interactions within the chain that leads to the listener’s brain is something more pleasing

There’s at least one music instrument that has thrived on “distortion”
 
That's really neither here nor there: at -80dB levels, as nasty as that may be by ASR standards, the chance that you're actually hearing anything other than your imagination is minimal. As Solderdude suggests, it takes a lot of incompetence to design solid-state electronics that are audibly bad in terms of distortion (unless clipping).
(and if you've ever run an overdriven guitar amp into a full-range speaker, you'll know there's nothing pleasant about gobs of intermodulation garbage without the effect of a very narrowband guitar speaker)
 
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oleg87 said:
That's really neither here nor there: at -80dB levels, as nasty as that may be by ASR standards, the chance that you're actually hearing anything other than your imagination is minimal. As Solderdude suggests, it takes a lot of incompetence to design solid-state electronics that are audibly bad in terms of distortion (unless clipping).
(and if you've ever run an overdriven guitar amp into a full-range speaker, you'll know there's nothing pleasant about gobs of intermodulation garbage without the effect of a very narrowband guitar speaker)
Click to expand...
If this is true, what I’m exactly is the point of this entire forum?
 
Tweeter2016 said:
Hello,

I wanted to ask what's hot right now in terms of amplifiers in the $1,000 price range? I don't follow all the latest developments closely, and in China there's something new every week, and every 2-3 months there's a game-changer... About three years ago, the SABAJ A30A was the best (today, most people have probably forgotten about it). What's the absolute best in this price range right now?
I'm actually looking for an amplifier, or possibly an amplifier with a DAC. For a small room (about 20 square meters) and bookshelf speakers. I can buy the DAC separately (I was thinking about the FiiO K13 R2R, good enough?) and the WiiM Ultra as a streamer. Could be class D.

Which AMP is currently the strongest contender?

I want to connect it to the following speakers: Usher S-520 or KEF LS50 Meta or B&W 607 S3 (maybe others, I'm still thinking about it).

Thanks for recomendations!
Click to expand...
A power amp? What range of power/impedance handling do you want at that price point?
 
morejazzplease said:
If this is true, what I’m exactly is the point of this entire forum?
Click to expand...
There are plenty of more interesting topics to discuss than the "sound" of electronics.
(By the way, don't take my word for it, it's easy to play around in Audacity or whatever and test what different amounts of crud added to the signal sound like.)
 
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morejazzplease said:
If this is true, what I’m exactly is the point of this entire forum?
Click to expand...
1 - As pointed out by others - plenty of other stuff to talk about.
2 -To provide a scientifically valid alternative view point for our visitors -who until now have seen nothing but audiophile folklore.
3 - To shine a light on the equipment that is badly designed and has poor performance.
 
antcollinet said:
1 - As pointed out by others - plenty of other stuff to talk about.
2 -To provide a scientifically valid alternative view point for our visitors -who until now have seen nothing but audiophile folklore.
3 - To shine a light on the equipment that is badly designed and has poor performance.
Click to expand...
And to learn about things that really do matter - loudspeakers, acoustics, psycho-acoustics.
 
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