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What is this? No golden ears!

Well, you may have a point. It can also be about semantics, as well as touch points. If we take bias , according to Wikipedia:

Bias is a disproportionate weight in favor of or against an idea or thing, usually in a way that is closed-minded, prejudicial, or unfair. Biases can be innate or learned. People may develop biases for or against an individual, a group, or a belief.[1] In science and engineering, a bias is a systematic error. Statistical bias results from an unfair sampling of a population, or from an estimation process that does not give accurate results on average.[2]

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preconceived

(of an idea or an opinion) formed too early, especially without enough thought ...

notion

a belief ...


Which is consciously thought out or not? The interesting thing is the approach. Of course, it is quite pointless to involve someone to do a task if that person
more or less neglect to engage in what the end result of that "non-effort" person will be.

Now I didn't do that, "non-effort" , in my tests described in this thread but I could just listened o the discs for a few seconds, without hardly concentrating and just say: No difference (as I knew)
Note, I did not. I really tried and listened as best I could. I even turned off the freezer and refrigerator to reduce the background noise.:)

Interesting about Harman and the exclusion of those with hearing deficit. Totally reasonable, but was there "tone deaf" included? Those who wouldn't even be able to hear if, for example, the loudness functionality in an amp was on or not? Whether it is tone deafness, or non-training, or...well whatever it is in such a case of loudness? :oops:
But the bias we are taliking about is not just 'bias', it is 'cognitive bias'

it comes from all those automatic processes that filter all the streams of information coming in from our senses so we can understand it and process it without being overwhelmed by it. The headline of the article linked above ("we hear what we expect to hear") is misleading. First that is not what the study was studying (It is already established neuroscience). The specific study was looking to see what area of the brain is doing the filtering - and they found it (or at least some of it) is in the low level subcortex. The consious brain never even gets all the pre filtered information. In the study, the "expectation" is what the brain subconciously expects based on all your years of experience of similar situations. In fact it even posits that the brain encodes information as a difference from expectation rather than the full information - allowing it to dramatically reduce the information needed for that encoding. A little like how compressed video encodes only the differences from a previous frame or a key frame.

A good example of the subconcious nature of this is the demonstration at 0:30 of this video.

Our perception of what the sound is changes based on the mouth movents (making a B shape or F shape while "speaking"). Even when we conciously KNOW we are being tricked, and HOW the trick works, we still percieve the different sound. It is wired deep in our brain such that what the concious brain gets is filtered/modified by what the eye is seeing.

 
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You might be able to edit a preconceived (mistaken) notion; a bias (belief), not so much.
 
Returning to this thread after exactly (!) three years.

I didn't mention this previously, but my source for physical media is the Sony BDP-BX57 Blu-Ray/DVD/SACD/CD player. I found it at a thrift store for $8. Amazon sold me a clone remote for $10. I did compare the analog output of this low-end player, one of the cheapest ways to play SACDs. I compared the sound of the analog output (just two channels, if you want surround, you'll have to use the HDMI output and an outboard DAC) for the sound via Toslink to my Topping E30 DAC. It was not a controlled comparison, but there seemed to be something "broken" about the analog out, maybe that's how it wound up in a thrift store. I made the A/B comparison a long time ago and continue to use the Topping E30.

Meanwhile, I finally break down and subscribe to a streaming service, Tidal in this case, attracted to lots of streams in high resolution and almost all the rest in Redbook. In this case, I can't hear any difference between the streams and my own CDs. Some turn out to be different but it's usually clear that I am comparing two different masters. Case in point; the Herbert von Karajan/Berlin Philharmonic recording of Beethoven's nine symphonies from the early 1960s on DGG. My copy was an early mid-priced issue from the 1980s, the stream on Tidal is the most recent, high-rez remaster prepared for Blu-Ray audio. And there are also a number of recordings that get mangled one way or another when they appear on Tidal. But, everything else being equal, the two formats seem to sound the same.
 
Case in point; the Herbert von Karajan/Berlin Philharmonic recording of Beethoven's nine symphonies from the early 1960s on DGG. My copy was an early mid-priced issue from the 1980s, the stream on Tidal is the most recent, high-rez remaster prepared for Blu-Ray audio.
... and which one sounds subjectively better?
Inquiring/enquiring minds want to know! ;)
 
But, everything else being equal, the two formats seem to sound the same.
IF that is the case. Which was the case why I bought CDs a few years ago. To get hold of the recordings not affected by the loudness war.
BUT now in connection with the CD having had a revival plus that these non-loudness damaged CDs are basically no longer available for me in Sweden in the flea markets I visit, I have stopped playing CDs.
 
... and which one sounds subjectively better?
Inquiring/enquiring minds want to know! ;)
The remaster seems to be less 'gritty', for lack of a better word. I've heard reverb/digital delay used on a lot of remasters of early stereo recordings, like reissues of early Columbia/Epic recordings on the "Essential Classics" series of budget re-releases. I suspect, in addition to SOTA digital de-noising, there is just a touch of reverb on the remasters of HvK's Beethoven symphony cycle. I noted even more improvement with the Lorin Maazel/VPO Sibelius symphony cycle for Decca. I've got the mid-priced set of CDs, Tidal has a Hi-Rez remaster. The remaster has less audible peak distortion, make of that what you will, doesn't seem to have added reverb.

I'm listening to the Tidal streams via an Acer Laptop into the Topping E30 into a Topping L30 headphone amp with the Crinacle Zero 2 IEMs. It's the most analytical gear I've ever owned, and yes—it's dirt cheap, I know. However, these 70-year-old ears are not the most analytical I have possessed. Good thing my hearing is still pretty decent.
 
IF that is the case. Which was the case why I bought CDs a few years ago. To get hold of the recordings not affected by the loudness war.
BUT now in connection with the CD having had a revival plus that these non-loudness damaged CDs are basically no longer available for me in Sweden in the flea markets I visit, I have stopped playing CDs.
I'm volunteering at the local library. We collect and sort donated books, records, CDs, DVDs, Blu-Ray discs and such. So, a lot of CDs pass through my hands, I can buy the CDs for the same price we sell them for, $1 for a single disc, $3 for sets of 3 or more. Quite a bargain, though many of the tiles are pretty useless. But we still get enough interesting titles that I find something weekly. However, I'm more likely to listen to streams lately as Tidal and You Tube have recordings I haven't heard before. Also, it's more convenient.
 
The remaster seems to be less 'gritty', for lack of a better word. I've heard reverb/digital delay used on a lot of remasters of early stereo recordings, like reissues of early Columbia/Epic recordings on the "Essential Classics" series of budget re-releases. I suspect, in addition to SOTA digital de-noising, there is just a touch of reverb on the remasters of HvK's Beethoven symphony cycle. I noted even more improvement with the Lorin Maazel/VPO Sibelius symphony cycle for Decca. I've got the mid-priced set of CDs, Tidal has a Hi-Rez remaster. The remaster has less audible peak distortion, make of that what you will, doesn't seem to have added reverb.

Could all be placebo, best to capture the stream and compare objectively to the CD.
 
Could all be placebo, best to capture the stream and compare objectively to the CD.
I could but I won't. In any case, mhardy6647 requested a subjective analysis, which I provided.

I'm not sure what value there might be in "capturing" the stream. I did a simple A/B comparison between the stream and the CD via my Topping E30, syncing up as well as I could, the stream coming from my computer, the CD coming through my Blu-Ray player, flipping between the two via the DAC's remote. Best I can offer.
 
A digitized stream can be objectively analyzed. Actual difference can be measured.
 
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