What is the weird ES9039SPro? A Topping exclusive DAC chip?

[mike7877]

So I have a D90 III Sabre, which advertises MQA playback. It also states using the ESS ES9039SPro...

In the ES9039Pro datasheet (which covers both the ES9039Pro and ES9039MPro), the "M" is differentiated from the non-M in one line on the first page, where it's said the "M" version does "full MQA playback".

When using google to search for the ES9039SPro, I find the Topping D90 III Sabre in the first page of results, along with various sellers of it. Nothing at all from ESS or other DACs for sale which might use it.

I thought "this must be a typo or something", but when looking at a picture of the teardown of the D90 III Sabre someone did here, though it's kind of hard to make out, the chips do appear to read "ES9039SPro"

Is it safe to assume the S is just the M? What's going on?!!

 

[Jimbob54]

Datasheet refers to the SPro. Eg page 6 pinout for both the mpro and Spro .I guess S is standard .

https://www.mouser.co.uk/datasheet/2/1082/ES9039MPRO_ES9039PRO_v0_2_1-3079309.pdf

 

[JustJones]

Far as I can tell there's only the PRO and MPRO, I don't see SPRO.

SABRE Audiophile DACs – ESS Technology, Inc.

www.esstech.com

 

[Jimbob54]

Far as I can tell there's only the PRO and MPRO, I don't see SPRO.

SABRE Audiophile DACs – ESS Technology, Inc.

www.esstech.com

Check p120 with the markings. Looks like ESS buggered up the naming convention. The MPro is the MQA one - the SPRO is the standard. No chip will be marked as just the PRO.

 

[Jimbob54]

Is it safe to assume the S is just the M? What's going on?!!

The opposite. The S is the non MQA one (Standard I guess)

 

[MCH]

happens with other ESS dacs too, sometimes bear a Q sometimes not.... here they mention S, M, MS...

(from the datasheet)

( from product brief)

 

[JustJones]

Check p120 with the markings. Looks like ESS buggered up the naming convention. The MPro is the MQA one - the SPRO is the standard. No chip will be marked as just the PRO.

Thanks, it shows the ES9039 SPRO and the ES9039 MSPRO

 

[Jimbob54]

Thanks, it shows the ES9039 SPRO and the ES9039 MSPRO

The plot thickens further.

 

[mike7877]

The plot thickens further.

Lol.

I wonder how Topping implemented MQA then... strange!
(the teardown https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/topping-d90-iii-teardown.55330/
Maybe the Altera chip? Why not just get the M lol

 

[JustJones]

Topping might not be using the M version and unfolding MQA before. The $80 SMSL SU1 does MQA.
They have a pile of the old Altera chips to get rid of?

 

[mike7877]

Topping might not be using the M version and unfolding MQA before. The $80 SMSL SU1 does MQA.
They have a pile of the old Altera chips to get rid of?

That's what I was wondering. Is this method inferior? The same as sending MQA expanded and over 24/96 or whatever?

 

[JustJones]

Photo from the D 90 III teardown thread. Isn't that large chip, bottom of the picture the Altera?

 

[mike7877]

Photo from the D 90 III teardown thread. Isn't that large chip, bottom of the picture the Altera?

View attachment 398960

Yes, that's it. I can't see what the model is (there are a lot of them with varying prices from $10 to nearly $100, I assume they have different processing capabilities etc.)

The standard ES9039Pro chip costs $100USD (when buying 1 at a time, drops to $75 with orders of 1,000 or more).

I don't (can't) see them charging too much more the the ES9039MPro. Realistically, not more than $5-10 more, because the 9068AS supports MQA and is only $16 buying individually...

Unless Topping had the Altera chips just hanging around, for free, it would've been cheaper to buy the M chips. More reliable in the long run, too because less components = less to break/go wrong.

 

[mike7877]

Does anyone know if the audio quality is different using an Altera chip to expand the MQA? I know with Tidal, you can expand the MQA on the PC and just send the audio over PCM... Wouldn't this be a superior form of transcoding because CPUs have, especially with all the individual cores now, at least millions more times the processing speed available?

I'm not complaining at all about the sound quality - the D90 III Sabre sounds flawless to my ears, what I'm getting at is, is using the Altera chip basically the same as transcoding on the computer and sending the audio as PCM over something like S/PDIF?
Or is it better?

I do listen to Tidal a lot, and it really irks me that we don't get full quality 16 bit / 44.1kHz files when we select "High". I think we used to...