What do expensive speakers sound like?

[NicC]

Hi all. The thread title is my actual question - sparked by another thread on ASR asking what kind of system people would assemble if they won the lottery. I have no idea because I haven't heard anything that would be considered expensive.

So I’m curious - what’s the most expensive speaker you’ve ever actually listened to? And more importantly, what were the sonic differences compared to something like a well-measuring $4,000 pair?

I imagine the sound might be “bigger” - but I don’t even know if that’s a thing. I'm not a science man, and my mind can't conceptualise how more expensive speakers can make 'better-sounding' pressure waves. More accurate, yes. More precise timing, yes. Is the wave 'bigger' maybe, as though it were magnified?

Side notes:
1. I'm thinking of going to a hifi show in Melbourne next year where I could hopefully hear some expensive gear - just out of curiosity. I'm wondering how impressed I will be

2. More specifically: it was the Kii Three BXT speakers a member posted, that got me thinking. In Australia they sell for $57 829. Wowser!

Extra side note (30 minutes or so, later): After reading and learning on this site for a few months now, I think I’ve learned there can be no major difference, physics is, as physics does - and diminishing returns kick in. But crikey, tens of thousands, even hundreds of thousands of dollars? Someone’s gotta hear something different surely Mind you, at an anniversary dinner last Friday, I ordered the 85-day aged steak at $110. It was good, but did not taste any better than a well-cooked, regular rib-eye at $20! I may have answered my own question

 

[Chrispy]

$k for a pair isn't particularly the highest capability in some cases, but can be quite good. It's much more than the retail price, tho. Diminishing returns for speakers can easily start in the $4k/pr range, but ....

 

[DVDdoug]

I'm not a science man, and my mind can't conceptualise how more expensive speakers can make 'better-sounding' pressure waves. More accurate, yes. More precise timing, yes. But how's the sound of these 'big boys'?

"Better" generally DOES mean more accurate... More like it was intended and more like what it sounded like in the studio. Once you get close to that you can boost (or cut) the bass, or boost (or cut) the highs, etc. Or, sometimes just a few recordings "need" some adjustments.

There is SOME correlation between price and sound quality and how loud the speaker can go while staying clean, and without burning out... More than with other audio components., except amplifiers also have to put-out enough power without distorting.

With awesome speakers and an adequate amplifier power you can get fantastic sound from your phone!

There's also some correlation with size. A little 5-inch woofer in a small box isn't going to make realistic bass you can feel in your body.

But... super-expensive speakers aren't necessarily super-better. In fact, an exotic-expensive may not perform as well as a more practical good speaker.

1. I'm thinking of going to a hifi show in Melbourne next year where I could hopefully hear some expensive gear

That can be fun and educational. And it can be overwhelming. A visit to an audio/video store can also be enlightening. Bring a CD that you're familiar with and maybe they'll let you play it on different speakers. At a show you usually can't A/B or listen to the same recordings on different speakers, or hear different speakers in the same room. You are listening to a "staged" setup.

Oh... If you go to an audio-video store, listen to some surround sound. I "only" have 5.1 but I really enjoy it! I have a shelf-full of concert DVDs with surround. And with regular stereo recordings I use a "hall" or "theater" setting on my AVR for some delayed reverb in the rear channels and the "feel" of a bigger room. ...But that's not "accurate as intended".

If I won the lottery I probably wouldn't buy $50K speakers. But I might build a nice dedicated home theater and I might want a pair of these monsters!

...Headphones are a "different experience" than speakers in a room but you can get very good sound (perhaps unbeatable sound) for a few hundred dollars.

 

[MattHooper]

So I’m curious - what’s the most expensive speaker you’ve ever actually listened to? And more importantly, what were the sonic differences compared to something like a well-measuring $4,000 pair?

I imagine the sound might be “bigger” - but I don’t even know if that’s a thing. I'm not a science man, and my mind can't conceptualise how more expensive speakers can make 'better-sounding' pressure waves. More accurate, yes. More precise timing, yes. Is the wave 'bigger' maybe, as though it were magnified?

Of course, more expensive doesn’t equate to better sound. But it can. (or even different sound…)

I believe the most expensive audio system I’ve ever listened to was the MBL Radialstrahler Xtreme full system. $398,000,000 I believe!

I was able to listen to these huge omnidirectional speakers on my own for a while, listening to whatever I wanted to in a dedicated room at a high-end audio store.
That was fun as hell, especially since I’m a big fan of MBL speakers.

How did they sound?

Massive, ultra clear, dynamic, and at times intensely realistic, as if they had beamed three-dimensional musicians right into the room.

As it happens, I didn’t find them quite as overall coherent as the smaller less expensive MBL 101E model. Which could’ve been a set up issue. But they were still plenty of fun and made any $4,000 speaker I’ve heard (or anywhere near that price) sound like laughable little toys.

Side notes:
1. I'm thinking of going to a hifi show in Melbourne next year where I could hopefully hear some expensive gear - just out of curiosity. I'm wondering how impressed I will be

I highly encourage you to go to a hi-fi show!
With the right attitude, they can be tons of fun. Where else can you sit down and listen to ultra expensive audio gear? You’ll find that often enough, whether it’s the gear itself, or the problem of speakers shoved into small hotel rooms, it doesn’t sound as good as it could. But every show there’s usually at least a few rooms that can be quite head spinning, or entertaining or interesting.

 

[NicC]

Oh my gosh - that is a hifi system? It looks like sci-fi punk art or something Omni-directional? Interesting. I appreciate the responses guys. So, there can be an experience to be had with something so…large!

 

[NicC]

But I might build a nice dedicated home theater and I might want a pair of these monsters!

I like this part on their website: It's time to shake the ground and leave your audience in awe

 

[RayDunzl]

This was probably the "most expensive" room I was in.

I don't remember anything playing, just a bunch of suits walking around sizing up the people wandering through.

Kinda like being in a New Car Showroom.

 

[MattHooper]

Coincidentally, here’s a high end audio newbie who just posted his impressions of listening to some systems at a high-end audio store, which includes his “ seeing God” moment of listening to the MBL Xtremes;

https://www.reddit.com/r/audiophile/s/riOL3Ite1B

 

[Waxx]

The best setup i heared was not that expensive for the parts, but it was well callibrated to the room and sounded neutral in most parts of the room. It was a JBL M2 with 4 custom subs and extensive dsp processing and room correction. Amps and DSP were also custom but based on Hypex modules and a Sharc based dsp. The owner is an engineer that made most of the custom gear himself.

I heared many expensive setups arround speakers of Wilson, Tannoy, Kiplish, B&W, Sonus Faber, and they are not that different than cheap speakers in sound. Some setups are good (but overpriced) but a lot are essentially expensive bling bling things that make sonud. You don't need a very expensive setup to have good sound but some very expensive speakers do sound very good.

 

[JSmith]

Looks like part of the inside of a TARDIS.


JSmith

 

[Marc v E]

Good speakers sounds effortless without you thinking about the speaker at all.

I listened to some speaker costing 89k, but they are now 169k. What high end speakers usually do have is big size which means big effortless bass.

Anyway, it doesn't matter, because price only determines performance up to 1000 or so. And bass can be easily added through subs.

Imo what really counts is a speaker that performs well in your room.
What that means ime is full range, with subwoofers, dsp in amp or dac for room correction and subwoofer integration and an easy way to do that.
A good enough avr is a great choice to get there with ease. Could also go for dsp/eq in dac or streamer which is ubiquitous these days.

Summarizing: 1000 a pair standmount speakers, 900 avr, a sub and you've got yourself a system that makes you worry less and enjoy more.

 

[Pareto Pragmatic]

And more importantly, what were the sonic differences compared to something like a well-measuring $4,000 pair?

It depends on the speakers.

Let me put it this way, I did a lot of research on options and ended up spending $1500 usd on speakers (that measure very well indeed). What would $4500-5000 get me in comparison?

+/-2db versus +/-1.5db from the speaker, at a guess. That's it. And my room would make that irrelevant.

Generally speaking more money buys you less distortion and the ability to play louder, coming from better enclosures, drivers, and parts. Better finishes, like veneer instead of vinyl wrap. Usually deeper bass compared to less expensive speakers from the same brand.

Once you hit $2000, I think you are going to get very, very, small improvements from that point on. If you can hear them, and they bother you, and you can afford the upgrade, go for it.

 

[NicC]

Random question - how big a difference does a second sub make? I read some members build their systems like this.

 

[Mort]

Wide directivity in a big room will sound very different than direct sound nearfield. There can be big differences, even with a 'flat' frequency response.

 

[boxerfan88]

Well designed expensive speakers I’ve heard at HiFi shows sounded “full” with “scale”. The excellent performing ones come with multiple medium/large bass drivers (not multiple puny woofers). Imaging wise about the same as well designed less expensive speakers and a tad less holographic (maybe because of the hotel room).

* Full = excellent LF extension, time aligned, can make out bass notes/textures relatively easily, crazy bass doesn’t affect midrange
* Scale = can play loud & handle music peaks with hardly audible distortion, throws a soundstage as big as the front wall where the speakers are.

 

[Keith_W]

If you are coming to Melbourne, you'll find that the best sounding systems are not in the hi-fi show, they're found in people's homes. That hi-fi show is great for meeting fellow hobbyists, meeting designers, having a nice chat and a good laugh, and socializing. Even speakers that I know are supposed to be very good don't sound great at the show. They are all compromised by the rooms, the high ambient noise, and show conditions. High ambient noise means that speakers have to be played louder than normal listening volume, so many of them sound strained and compressed. I have been very disappointed by the sound of Revels, JBL's, Kiis, and KEF's at the show, even though I have heard the same speakers in people's homes and been impressed.

As for steaks, there is a definite difference between a nice dry-aged steak vs. a $20 steak from Coles! The smell alone gives away the difference, it's more intense, more beefy, and has a slight funkiness to it. There's also a different kind of juiciness, a $20 Coles steak tastes watery by comparison. Not all dry aged steaks are created equal, you need to find a good one. I recommend you go to Victor Churchill and try their steaks. They are a butcher by day and restaurant in the evening. If the restaurant is too expensive, buy the steak and cook it at home. In fact you don't even have to eat, just walk in there and smell. That should give you a good idea what a good dry aged steak should taste like.

 

[sigbergaudio]

Random question - how big a difference does a second sub make? I read some members build their systems like this.

The answer (as for anything ) is that it depends. But normally you will not be able to get an even frequency response in the frequency range of the sub with only one sub, and if you do, it will only be in a very small sweet spot. So two subs will give you significantly more even bass response (and in a larger part of the room), and it will of course also increase headroom with 5-6dB which can also be significant. If you have some flexibility in where you place the two subs and can experiment with that, the result will be even better.

One sub can work well, two subs is almost always a significant improvement - and what we recommend for all our customers, and no, it's not just so we can sell more subs.

 

[JeremyFife]

If I took a pair of great (and also expensive) speakers and just plonked them into my room ... I'm fairly sure they'd sound awful!

In a better room, properly placed with treatment/EQ, I'd expect (hope) that they would disappear and I would be able to crank up the volume without really noticing 'loud' - just an increasing sense of scale and wonder

I'd be living alone by then ...

 

[Mart68]

So I’m curious - what’s the most expensive speaker you’ve ever actually listened to? And more importantly, what were the sonic differences compared to something like a well-measuring $4,000 pair?

The most expensive I can think of was the Magico M9 which are $750,000 for a pair.

They were with D'Augustino pre amp and monoblocs and full DCS stack. Total system cost over one million pounds.

Sound was terrible with ripping high frequency distortion making it unlistenable. This was at a show. I don't know what the issue is as none of that equipment or the speakers should have that problem.

Someone suggested that since the D'Augustino amps draw so much current it may have been voltage sag on the mains causing the issue. This was at a hi-fi show with 50 odd systems playing at once, in the absence of any other credible explanation I'd have to go with that.

As usual the people running the demonstration seemed to be blissfully unaware of how bad it sounded.

So I can't really tell you what they sounded like other than 'big'.

The most impressive expensive speaker I ever heard remains the JBL 4365 (since replaced by the 4367) which were a paltry £10K at the time (about 2018).

TAD Reference One were also very good - £150K

Differences to a good four grand speaker? Not massive but probably worthwhile if you have the money.

 

[Frank Dernie]

IME the performance aspect that makes a speaker expensive to make is going deep in the bass and having a high loudness capacity.
Accurate large bass drivers are very expensive to design and manufacture as are mid and high frequency drivers that can handle a lot of power and go loud.
The secondary part of the cost is manufacturing and exotic or expensive material finishes which are inevitably very expensive for small production numbers.

In a real domestic room very loud speakers are not needed IME. Going deep may well be, mainly depending on the sort of music you listen to, and good subs are expensive because of the manufacturing cost of good bass drivers.

I haven't listened to any of the modern high end speakers but for music enjoyment at home I am pretty sure you don't need them..