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Watches - Are These the Best of Times or Worst of Times?

A basic old wristwatch still has a place, whether quartz or mechanical. Compared to a smart watch, my mechanical watch is smaller, lighter, doesn't need any battery, doesn't need to boot up, never crashes, never needs firmware updates, cannot be hacked, and will last for decades if not forever, not subject to planned obsolescence.

OTOH, when I'm out running or cycling I wear my smart watch (a Suunto Race). It tracks everything I want to track, tells me everything I need to know during the activity, logs all of my activities and tracks my fitness. Why not wear it all the time? Mainly, it's too big/bulky, doesn't fit well with conventional long sleeved shirts, gets in the way when performing desk activities, and charging the battery would become a pain.
 
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48mm
 
I think the implied promise of smart watches like Apple's is that they're going to deliver a more-optimized life in an appealing manner: How can a person say no to such a thing when it's presented as an investment in one's well-being! I'm not philosophically opposed getting one, but when I think of the rest of the "ecosystem" needed to make it all work, my eyes glaze over. And while you can own the watch, the greater ecosystem is someone else's property, and you are but a guest.

Not surprised if the secondary market for high-end watches has cratered: I had the impression it been dominated by speculators.
 
JeffS7444 said:
Not surprised if the secondary market for high-end watches has cratered: I had the impression it been dominated by speculators.
Click to expand...
Agreed.
It made no sense to me it was fuelled by makers, particularly Rolex, manipulating the availability to make even mass produced base metal watches hard to get which was OK for when demand was growing but not as soon it stagnates.
A bit like a Ponzi scheme.
 
Frank Dernie said:
Agreed.
It made no sense to me it was fuelled by makers, particularly Rolex, manipulating the availability to make even mass produced base metal watches hard to get which was OK for when demand was growing but not as soon it stagnates.
A bit like a Ponzi scheme.
Click to expand...
Earlier this Fall I went into the jewelry store we had purchased our watches and a few things for my wife from to look at watches. I really love the look of the Submariner, even though I know the cliche I really love the way they look. I tried one on and it looks even better in person. Then I found out that if I wanted one there is over a year's wait to get one. Absurd. I'm 73 and there's no way I'm waiting that long for a watch. @Frank Dernie Is correct, it's simply manipulation of the market.
 
Ken1951 said:
Earlier this Fall I went into the jewelry store we had purchased our watches and a few things for my wife from to look at watches. I really love the look of the Submariner, even though I know the cliche I really love the way they look. I tried one on and it looks even better in person. Then I found out that if I wanted one there is over a year's wait to get one. Absurd. I'm 73 and there's no way I'm waiting that long for a watch. @Frank Dernie Is correct, it's simply manipulation of the market.
Click to expand...
If you like the look, and don't care about brand names or having to fork over a small fortune, the $60 Addiesdive quartz is pretty great. And you don't have to worry about having anyone take it away from you in a dark alley! Quartz movement is very accurate, not quite as good as the VH31 versions, but close. I believe they also make an automatic version.
 
Joe Smith said:
If you like the look, and don't care about brand names or having to fork over a small fortune, the $60 Addiesdive quartz is pretty great. And you don't have to worry about having anyone take it away from you in a dark alley! Quartz movement is very accurate, not quite as good as the VH31 versions, but close. I believe they also make an automatic version.
Click to expand...
I've decided to just stay with my Breitling as I've worn it since 2001 and likely buy myself a new pair of binoculars for birding!
 
Ken1951 said:
Earlier this Fall I went into the jewelry store we had purchased our watches and a few things for my wife from to look at watches. I really love the look of the Submariner, even though I know the cliche I really love the way they look. I tried one on and it looks even better in person. Then I found out that if I wanted one there is over a year's wait to get one. Absurd. I'm 73 and there's no way I'm waiting that long for a watch. @Frank Dernie Is correct, it's simply manipulation of the market.
Click to expand...

They are not pulling a De Beers diamonds by inventing scarcity that does not exist. Rolex is not willing to increase production to match current demand, and has done a brilliant job of controlling their market, not the same as manipulating the market per se. There's no lack of watches that are as good or better for similar or less $. But, they're not a Rolex. For some that matters, some it does not. Rolex has taken the long view in their approach and obviously it's been very effective for them. Look at Grand Seiko, JLC, or Glashuette Original for a watch as good or better for similar or less $ than Rolex.
 
WillBrink said:
They are not pulling a De Beers diamonds by inventing scarcity that does not exist. Rolex is not willing to increase production to match current demand, and has done a brilliant job of controlling their market, not the same as manipulating the market per se. There's no lack of watches that are as good or better for similar or less $. But, they're not a Rolex. For some that matters, some it does not. Rolex has taken the long view in their approach and obviously it's been very effective for them. Look at Grand Seiko, JLC, or Glashuette Original for a watch as good or better for similar or less $ than Rolex.
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And there's a thriving used market and Rolex watches do hold their value quite well - and I say that as someone that loves mechanical watches, owns some high end watches... but I have never bought a Rolex watch for myself. Even though I admire Rolez for that - they help keep the value of their brand (which also benefits their customer base), and their movements are bomb-proof.
 
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WillBrink said:
They are not pulling a De Beers diamonds by inventing scarcity that does not exist. Rolex is not willing to increase production to match current demand,
Click to expand...
You see a difference here that eludes me.
IMO they are 99% the same.

Rolex are excellent watches actually mass produced in very high numbers compared to the high end competition and successfully sold at a high profit in controlled numbers.

This is financially beneficial to Rolex, their dealers and some customers.
 
Oh yes, perceived scarcity is a tool used by luxury brands!
https://www.markuskramer.net/scarcity-creates-value-lessons-from-luxury/

But it's just one tool of many: While we may like to think that we make purchase decisions independently, Martin Lindstrom illustrates how powerfully we are influenced by the opinions of others:

The Leica Camera people certainly know a thing or two about the luxury-products game: Garden-variety products can generally be had from stock, but if you want the latest models, you may be in for a wait, and if you want a special-edition release, you'd better have access to the factory grapevine, and immediately reserve a place in the queue, because by the time the general public hears of it, it's already sold out.

I'm still very much drawn to products which seem to have a certain "something", but I like to think that as I've matured, I like to think I'm able to place more weight upon my own opinions, and pleasing myself, and caring less of how it's perceived by my peer group, who in any event, would only be momentarily dazzled by whatever I buy, and there's always someone else willing/able to spend more.
 
Status brands interest me less and less...I'm just not willing to pay the inflated price, and as to status., none of my friends cares at all what I wear, what I drive, or what I use...it's taken me a while in life to realize, nothing we do is very important or noticeable to anyone else...so the only reason to buy or use something is for yourself...if it matters...which often it doesn't. Alcohol. Watches, Jewelry. Cars. Etc. Rinse and repeat.
 
pablolie said:
To me as a mechanical watch collector, the notion that Rolex limits supply is ridiculous.
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Generally, the number of Rolex watches is limited by the rate that they can produce in-house movements, and they produce a lot of them too. They do an amazing job of controlling their market by tightly regulating who can sell them and how they do it. That's not artificially limiting supply nor creating a false scarcity. That is to say the scarcity is completely legit due to the demand side of the equation.
pablolie said:
The reason I don't own one is because how omnipresent they are.
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Only some models and one reason I got rid of the Sub I had was it felt like everyone seemed to have one, or a fake, but that's another story...
 
The true products being sold by the luxury-goods sector are dreams!

Cartier:
A. Lange & Sohne:
Aman:
And a brand which will be familiar to @Frank Dernie
 
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