warning: price increase ahead

[A Surfer]

@amirm has - in this particular case - just told us. In others, the mods do.

I agree, it is just that sometimes people may actually get in trouble with the community as a result of being offside on the rules. When the rules are somewhat opaque it may make it more difficult for people to judge what is allowable until after the fact. That was why I had believed that political discussion was broadly disallowed.

I'm good with it though. This is Amirm's community and we're guests so ultimately if he is comfortable why should I have a problem?

 

[digicidal]

If this is such a good idea, why don't we apply it to every state in US? Surely someone in California would want their job protected against someone in Nevada. No?

I'm 100% for this particular option... as long as it's fully reciprocal. Currently the entire state of California is moving here... and as near as I can tell they don't produce anything other than human excrement, impotent outrage, and traffic jams.

I wish this was just politics. Then as you say, we could ignore it. But what we are discussing has far left that domain. Every person in every country is impacted by what is going on. And directly so. Just like other major catastrophes, we do bend the rules for members to both vent and share their insight into what is going on. We have done that for the pandemic for example. If it gets out of hand, yes, we will close it.

I think it's great... too bad things were much more totalitarian and narrow-minded 5 years ago... definitely made being stuck inside less enjoyable on ASR. My push back on the emphasis specifically would be that every person in every country is also impacted by near-constant currency manipulation and unrestricted deficit spending. Then again I'm just happy to watch the world burn so it's all fun for me... subsistence farming here I come!

 

[Waxx]

I agree, it is just that sometimes people may actually get in trouble with the community as a result of being offside on the rules. When the rules are somewhat opaque it may make it more difficult for people to judge what is allowable until after the fact. That was why I had believed that political discussion was broadly disallowed.

I think the disucssion is not pure politics, it's more the consequence of a political descision that affects us that we discuss. I and many avoid to call names just to keep it that way.

 

[Gitfiddle]

That is subjective isn't it? And this community is supposed to be against subjectiveness in audio evaluation so I find it interesting that suddenly political discussion is okay.

So how do we know what things transcends politics?

I'm not an admin, and a very new member, but surely anything that has such a widespread effect across the audio world needs to be discussed in a civil manner. Obviously this can go off the rails; and I could see the thread getting locked once the terminally online crowd hijacks the actual discussion of manufacturing, purchasing, and disruptions to supply chains.

It seems Amirm has given you their opinion on the existence of the thread as well, so take their opinion over mine. After all, I am quite new to posting here.

 

[A Surfer]

I think the disucssion is not pure politics, it's more the consequence of a political descision that affects us that we discuss. I and many avoid to call names just to keep it that way.

True, but many political discussions that go wrong are when people discuss the consequences of political decisions. No matter, clearly this thread is deemed acceptable so that will be good enough for me.

 

[jayapple]

To be honest, Trump's tariff war will only affect Americans themselves, especially those with low and medium incomes.

Cheap products won't enter the US market. American-made goods? This seems like something from the last century.

Nowadays, American-made products are no longer competitive.

Tariffs won't help at all. Such a blockade will only accelerate the self-sufficiency of countries around the world and enhance their own competitiveness.

 

[jayapple]

I believe that globalization is the greatest invention of capitalism in the 21st century.
It can harvest the whole world without spending a single soldier or a penny, and at the same time enjoy the best profits for itself.

However, now the United States is about to destroy it by its own hands. The problems of the United States stem from itself, and external factors will not solve them.

Giving up globalization is the beginning of the decline of the United States.

 

[A Surfer]

This ad (from FB) is a perfect example of how the EU reacts on the Tarrifs:

View attachment 443104
The trust in the US is gone, and that won't be easy to repair again and cost the US a lot of money...

You are quite correct about the trust. No nation will ever trust the US again, certainly not fully. These policies are almost certain to strengthen China's position in the world. America has always needed the rest of the world as much as the rest of the world has needed America. If the rest of the world is smart, they will not negotiate bilateral deals with the US.

Trump is all about divide and conquer. That Administration does not want coordinated resistance against their trade war as the rest of the world actually has much more economic might when combined. Not that it is harmonious, but in theory it could be somewhat harmonious. Unless the US intends to use military power to force people to trade on their terms it is just possible that this trade gambit will significantly weaken the US. Which would be a great shame I feel.

 

[DavidEdwinAston]

I honestly don't care what happens to prices on new stuff we don't actually need. HiFi has always been well into discretionary spending, unnecessary, and everyone has more than enough lying around in various forms to keep them going indefinitely even if manufacture and retail sale stopped tomorrow or prices went stratospheric.

Stop buying new stuff. And chit you don't need. Fix things that break. Buy quality in the first place, and preferably from brands who produce and employ in your own countries and keep a stock of parts and support. All the same things I've been saying for decades, but now it is even more important.

Brilliant post John. Although you are rather far away, should my stuff need fixing. And I couldn't do it.

 

[A Surfer]

And when it comes to food, the US does allow additives that other nations consider unsafe and that has been a modest barrier to trade for some US producers.

An American friend of my daughter stayed with us here in Canada for two weeks a few summers ago and he couldn't believe how much difference in taste there was between McDonald's food here and back home. My understanding is that there are flavour enhancers not allowed here, but I may be wrong.

I worry about this as we know clearly that the US wishes that whatever passes their regulatory scrutiny and standards are good enough for the rest of the world. Much of the time that is true, but moving forward with the current war in the US against science and regulation, that may predict less safe standards and if Americans are okay with that certainly that is their right to decide, but other nations must be allowed to set their own standards without being accused of unfair trade practices.

 

[Sokel]

Someone from the American community who lives down the street told me today that it's the first time that he's worried about stuff.
He deals with ships and these guys are usually immune to any restriction but this will affect those as well now as they are expecting a minimum 5% brake on transports.

It seems low as a number but it's translated to many billions for the transports in general, the halt of these days alone had already a big penalty.

 

[A Surfer]

I believe that globalization is the greatest invention of capitalism in the 21st century.
It can harvest the whole world without spending a single soldier or a penny, and at the same time enjoy the best profits for itself.

However, now the United States is about to destroy it by its own hands. The problems of the United States stem from itself, and external factors will not solve them.

Giving up globalization is the beginning of the decline of the United States.

It is a loss for all the world. Peace was tied to economic interdependence and cooperation. Now the US has signaled that it is dog eat dog time again on the world stage. Sometimes the biggest dog doesn't win which often surprises.

I forget which US President said it isn't the size of the dog in the fight, it is the size of the fight in the dog.

 

[Sokel]

I forget which US President said it isn't the size of the dog in the fight, it is the size of the fight in the dog.

That's Mark Twain, no politician would ever say that

 

[A Surfer]

That's Mark Twain, no politician would ever say that

Was it? Thank you. I appreciate the clarification. I was too lazy to search for attribution before posting.

 

[holdingpants01]

This whole thing is such a big win for China, not only they have basically the rest of the world on their side, they also look much more mature politically wise and stable than US right now. If the world move further under their influence, and right now there's no way it won't happen, it's basically handing over the world leadership to China for the time being. I'm sure there are more countries in the line for negotiations in Beijing than Washington. My wife started to learn Chinese some time ago, may become handy. Hǎo yùn o, bàibài!

 

[Mnyb]

If your product contains atoms some part off it is made in china it's inescapable .

No one would bring production back to US companies will just sit this out for 4 years and let the poor Americans take up the bill for it .
It would probably cost even more than the 104% tariff to bring production back .. If even possible at all , it would take decades to bring back some skills and complex supply chains ?

Tariffs migth just protect expensive low quality production from competition ? So it's not only expensive but it will be worse products.

it's nostalgia for a time that cant come back anywhere we Swedes used to make clothes and large scale shipsbuilding was thing ? 1960 is not coming back.
Mom and Dad worked in a factory that made radios in thier youth ?

Next, why cant we have British made cars like they did them in the 1970's while at it.

All this is not even the worst part if those global catastrophe , but i respect the forum rules here and wont go there .

 

[EdW]

There will be some shenanigans for sure.

You’re right here! I think this ‘loophole’, if it ever existed, will be shut down rather promptly.
But a more nuanced case - KEF speakers. Based in the UK but owned now by a Chinese conglomerate. It’s less expensive ranges, the Q and R series are made in China - will all the import price into the US be ascribed to Chinese origin - probably?
Now consider the Reference, Blade and Muon speakers, exclusively produced in the UK, but by a company ultimately owned in China. Nevertheless there is a case that these should be regarded as UK products and only subject to 10% tariff.
Whatever the case this whole behaviour by Trump’s administration does not help the US or the rest of the world

 

[Gary_G]

I wish this was just politics. Then as you say, we could ignore it. But what we are discussing has far left that domain. Every person in every country is impacted by what is going on. And directly so. Just like other major catastrophes, we do bend the rules for members to both vent and share their insight into what is going on. We have done that for the pandemic for example. If it gets out of hand, yes, we will close it.

I for one, am impress we got to, what, 9 pages and it hasn't gone off the rails.