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Volume limiter for the subs

Oddball

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Not sure if this is a good idea, but would still like to try - thus the gear to implement should not be necessarily very costly as eventually might not prove to be a good solution.

Origin of the problem is my preference for elevated bass in HT contend, which does not necessarily align with the way that some soundtracks have been mixed. Some soundtracks are relatively shy in bass content even though it is present and can be emphasised with running LFE at higher levels. The problem is when the peaks come, this level is way too loud and wrecks all kinds of havoc.

We are generally talking about peaks that are relevant for 0.1% of the movie vs. the rest of the movie. On balance, I don't see a reason we need to be on a scale that approximates life and adds 20dB peaks for a scene, two or three in the movie. I can clearly note the drama even if the peak is 5 or 7dB, especially if I have already lifted the overall LFE level by the same amount. In other words, I don't really like the dynamic range that some titles employ in the low end as they are underemphasising the regular content and then blasting for 30 seconds or less. Not really sure what the artist wanted, or what gear they used, but at the end of the day I would like to have it my way.

Based on the best of my knowledge, this option is not addressed in any AVR/AVP firmware or EQ software. Perhaps for a reason, but the experiment is still the king of the knowledge. Thus, what I would need for this exercise is adjustable volume limiter between the AVP and the subs where I could limit the overall volume going to subs to e.g. 110dB or 115dB (or any other number), which would effectively just cut the peaks that would have been e.g. 125dB without this cut. Balanced solution would be better as already have these cables, but if RCA is cheaper, then ready to invest in some additional cables as well. Given the subs are in play, the range is really from 0-120hz. I roll them off very steeply after 100hz. Distortion is not really such a big issue in this range, but obviously would want something that is half way decent. Have 4 subs, and need solution in one or multiple boxes for all of them.

Any help with suggestions what gear to use for this experiment would be much appreciated.
 
Your AVR should have a setting for dynamic compression, sometimes "DRC" or "Midnight Mode". It's not necessarily for the bass but it can help to keep the dialog loud enough to hear without blasting you with effects.

Or you could get a Compressor/Limiter and plug it inline with your sub. (These are "pro equipment", usually with balanced connections so you'd need to confirm it can be adapted for unbalanced RCA connections.)
 
Your AVR should have a setting for dynamic compression, sometimes "DRC" or "Midnight Mode". It's not necessarily for the bass but it can help to keep the dialog loud enough to hear without blasting you with effects.

Or you could get a Compressor/Limiter and plug it inline with your sub. (These are "pro equipment", usually with balanced connections so you'd need to confirm it can be adapted for unbalanced RCA connections.)
Many thanks Doug. Much appreciated. Audyssey that I am still using (at this day and age :eek:) has a whole suite of solutions, but unfortunately not the one that I am looking for.

Your link takes me to same nice bass guitars, so that might be a sign to pick up the guitar again after 40 or so years. But nothing related to compressor or limiter even with search on that site.
 
Onkyo AVRs have an LFE level setting. It’s different from the subwoofer level and is specifically meant for cases like this. Check if your AVR has this option - if you don’t mind adjusting it manually, it could be the solution. The default value is 0dB and can be set at -10dB, -20dB...
 
Onkyo AVRs have an LFE level setting. It’s different from the subwoofer level and is specifically meant for cases like this. Check if your AVR has this option - if you don’t mind adjusting it manually, it could be the solution. The default value is 0dB and can be set at -10dB, -20dB...
D&M has this too. This is for a different purpose though. The solution that I am looking for is to basically alter the dynamic range of the LFE. Up the regular level and then cut the peaks - with surgical precision that Audy tools don't posses. While would not want to buy Storm or Trinnov just for this exercise, not aware they have this setting either.
 
D&M has this too. This is for a different purpose though. The solution that I am looking for is to basically alter the dynamic range of the LFE. Up the regular level and then cut the peaks - with surgical precision that Audy tools don't posses. While would not want to buy Storm or Trinnov just for this exercise, not aware they have this setting either.

Yeah, that would be more like a dumb workaround than a solution.

Maybe compressor in the minidsp 2x4 hd:
 
Yeah, that would be more like a dumb workaround than a solution.

Maybe compressor in the minidsp 2x4 hd:
Thanks for sharing. Mini has some interesting features so will definitely explore.

Some dumb questions are actually smart and the other way around. Solution that I have defined is a smart potential solution for me. For you could be ultimately the opposite, as apparently it is.
 
I roll them off very steeply after 100hz.
Have you tried to cut them at 40- 60 Hz instead of so high? The quick roll-off is a good idea for controlling the distortion typically seen in a 6-12 dB roll-off on mains and subs. I use 48 dB on the sub to bass columns, and from the bass columns to the mains. I've tried 48 on the bass columns with both 24 and 48 to the main side.

I prefer sharp, quick transitions mainly because of the music I listen to. There are a lot of congas, bongos, and tight drums used. Nothing worse than a bloated rumbling sub/bass because of gradual slopes that take forever to roll off.

I don't use HT, and what I do use has all the whistles and bells, with an exception. 1. Tone control. 2. Adjustable trim. It's easy to use with a remote, and something I will personally never do without. I'm a McIntosh guy, BUT there are variants in other brands. I think Yamaha has a trim feature on their tone controls.

Maybe something as simple as Schiit Lokius: XLR, RCA, and a bypass. Behringer DCX2496, you would have to hook it up via a laptop or walk over and switch to a given preset setting. They have gain limiters, a lot of options for XO preference, and are balanced XLR and 1/4" plugs, both have noise cancellation with AES48 wiring for pro cabling.

BTW, 110-115 peaks below 100 Hz is VERY loud. 125dB, I personally wouldn't be around without plugs and muffs even for a short burst. Turn the GAIN down, and cut at 40-60 Hz. You might be surprised how good it sounds. :-)

Regards
 
behringer mdx 4600 has a smooth audio limiting with no click noises ( unlike the DCX 2496 , stormaudio isp 32 ) i may suspect even the trinnov

plus the mdx 4600 can be used for 4 subs or 8 subs if two mdx are used

the clicking noises are audible if simply tested with any low frequency sine wave 40Hz and audio limiter set to -24dB avr avp level turned up to -24dB and the click noise

if one wants audio limiting switched on and movie soundtrack that has all the highs mids filtered out leaving low frequencies will have an audioble DCX clicking noise

use the MDX 4600 plus has an audio compressor and signal noise gate which can be useful

plus the extra gain i have on my JBL subs is anywhere up to

the b-chain i could daisy chain the MDX to do few sub bass things , plus a lot more besides all that



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That is an interesting approach. One thing that I would not want are clicks when the limiter comes to play. Very good point,

As far as other responses, this is not an exercise to correct any suspected and potentially offending frequencies. It is as simple as noted, limit the output. The peaks will be in a wide range of frequencies, and only the SPL limitation will address the ask I had.
 
That is an interesting approach. One thing that I would not want are clicks when the limiter comes to play. Very good point,

As far as other responses, this is not an exercise to correct any suspected and potentially offending frequencies. It is as simple as noted, limit the output. The peaks will be in a wide range of frequencies, and only the SPL limitation will address the ask I had.
you should follow ,
the audio limiting is okay for the stage screen channels HF horns , don't really notice clicking noises
so get MDX 4600 they are cheap , how many i have x3 of them i think ?
i guess want a video , maybe in the next few hours ?
 
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