Volume knob position on multiple devices in a chain

[spotifyguru]

Let's say you have 3 separate devices: dedicated dac -> tube preamp -> power amp.

Would the volume on each device effect the quality of the signal? What's the best volume level for each device?

 

[escksu]

Let's say you have 3 devices: dac -> tube preamp -> amp.

Would the volume effect the quality of the signal? What's the best volume level?

The amp is it power amp or integrated amp?

 

[spotifyguru]

The amp is it power amp or integrated amp?

power amp, updated op to hopefully make it clearer what im trying to find out

 

[escksu]

power amp, updated op to hopefully make it clearer what im trying to find out

Oh ok, in this case the volume control is only on pre-amp and DAC.

IMHO, you can ignore the volume on the DAC and just use the pre-amp's one.

 

[kchap]

Where it works best. So many assumptions which may be wrong. Here goes:

Volume Control in DAC.

Pros​

- No danger of overloading amp or preamp.​

- Potential for volume control via USB or SW volume control.​

Cons​

- Noise. The preamp and possibly the DAC and PA/HPA can contribute to the noise.​

​

Volume Control in preamp.

Pros​

- Better i.e. lower, noise floor at medium to low volume levels​

Cons​

- DAC may overdrive preamp. Preamps often have a gain stage between the input and the Volume Control. Older preamps may be too sensitive and subject to clipping.​

​

Volume Control in PA/HPA

Pros​

- Lowest noise floor.​

Cons​

- Again, DAC may overdrive preamp.​

​

See how confusing it is! Personally if the output of the DAC and the input of the PA/HPA are reasonably matched I prefer ditching the preamp and having the Volume Control in the DAC with a direct connection to the amp.

 

[Chrispy]

Might try this https://www.hometheatershack.com/th...o-equipment-in-your-system.35677/#post-317665

 

[escksu]

Where it works best. So many assumptions which may be wrong. Here goes:

Volume Control in DAC.

Pros​

- No danger of overloading amp or preamp.​

- Potential for volume control via USB or SW volume control.​

Cons​

- Noise. The preamp and possibly the DAC and PA/HPA can contribute to the noise.​

​

Volume Control in preamp.

Pros​

- Better i.e. lower, noise floor at medium to low volume levels​

Cons​

- DAC may overdrive preamp. Preamps often have a gain stage between the input and the Volume Control. Older preamps may be too sensitive and subject to clipping.​

​

Volume Control in PA/HPA

Pros​

- Lowest noise floor.​

Cons​

- Again, DAC may overdrive preamp.​

​

See how confusing it is! Personally if the output of the DAC and the input of the PA/HPA are reasonably matched I prefer ditching the preamp and having the Volume Control in the DAC with a direct connection to the amp.

I am confused. Are you saying your power amp has volume control? Because if there is, it would be an integrated amp instead of power amp. I have never heard of a power amp having volume control. Volume control is always done by the pre-amp side in a pre/power combo.

Pre-amp is the most important in a pre/power combo. Thats where it makes the difference in sound quality.

If there are multiple gears with volume controls, I simple keep those before the pre-amp fixed at halfway mark and ignore them. Use the pre-amp for volume control.

 

[kchap]

I am confused. Are you saying your power amp has volume control? Because if there is, it would be an integrated amp instead of power amp. I have never heard of a power amp having volume control. Volume control is always done by the pre-amp side in a pre/power combo.

True, the preamp is the normal location for the Volume control. I was taking a generic approach. Some people like the idea of external volume control on the input to the PA, a lot HP amps have a volume control and there are minimalist 'integrated amps' which are just a PA with a potentiometer between the input connectors and the PA.

 

[RayDunzl]

I have never heard of a power amp having volume control.

Here's one example, of many similar configurations across different vendors:

I agree volume control is rare on a unit intended purely for home use, though.

 

[escksu]

Here's one example, of many similar configurations across different vendors:


View attachment 152255

I agree volume control is rare on a unit intended purely for home use, though.

I wouldn't exactly call it volume control. Its more of gain control. No doubt they do affect volume but it is mainly purpose isn't the same as a volume control knob/dial.

 

[escksu]

True, the preamp is the normal location for the Volume control. I was taking a generic approach. Some people like the idea of external volume control on the input to the PA, a lot HP amps have a volume control and there are minimalist 'integrated amps' which are just a PA with a potentiometer between the input connectors and the PA.

Possible but it would be extremely rare. Most of the amps in the market ar alot more sophisticated that that, esp when they need to deal with multiple inputs and even need DAC etc...

 

[RayDunzl]

I wouldn't exactly call it volume control. Its more of gain control. No doubt they do affect volume but it is mainly purpose isn't the same as a volume control knob/dial.

Educate me, then...

 

[escksu]

Educate me, then...

You can google around for gain control vs volume control. Gain is to control the input while volume is control output. Anyway, OP didn't start this thread to discuss about power amp gain controls so I will stop here. If you wish, you may start another topic to talk about it.

 

[antcollinet]

Surely you want volume control at the last possible step - to keep SNR to a maximum up until then. This is assuming you have well designed components working to standard line levels (no overload/clipping).

 

[VanO]

I can tell you how I have my system set up. I'm using an ifi Zen Signature Dac (which has a fixed or variable volume setting). I have it set to variable and use it to control the complete system volume.

Dac > Bellari EQ570 (two outputs) >

> 2 active crossovers (Rolls SX45 and SX95) >

> SX45 > #1 preamp/amp as high level pass, #3 as low level pass.
> SX95 > 8" sub, 6.5" sub, pass-thru to #2 preamp/amp.

1. Aiyima Tube A3 preamp (volume set to 12:00) > Aiyima A07 #1 (volume set to 3/4 or about 3:00) > Dali Spektor 2 speakers.
2. FX Audio Tube T01 preamp (volume set to 12:00) Aiyima A07 #2 (volume set at 12:00) > Pyramid tweeters.
3. Douk Audio G4 (volume set at almost minimum) > Dayton Audio BST-1 Bass Shaker.

 

[Jimbob54]

Let's say you have 3 separate devices: dedicated dac -> tube preamp -> power amp.

Would the volume on each device effect the quality of the signal? What's the best volume level for each device?

Broadly control the max volume with the last component in the chain with a knob, fine tune during listening with the last component with a remote to control the volume. As a headphone listener that is easy- headamp for the former, DAC for the latter. I imagine a similar approach with a DAC and a pre is what I would take assuming the pre was clean at higher levels - not sure about if you want the tubes to add anything though, cant imagine they would add anything at low levels if at all.