Vintage Yamaha NS-1000M or Linkwitz Speaker System

[dualazmak]

OK, understood. Yes, I realize that if he would like to go into multichannel with NS-100 or NS-1000M, he first need to get it at the second market since he had already sold his NS-1000 .....

 

[FrantzM]

The Yam CA-2010 belonged to my father's. Back in my teen years he had a system with the CA-2010, the NS-1000M, a Yamaha YP- Direct Drive, Yamaha Cassette deck and a Revox A-77 R2R .. He sold the NS-1000M .. He passed away 30 years ago and I found the Yamaha system in the attic,,, They seem to all function.
I find interesting that I could re-purpose the system and update it with what I have learned the past few decades. Multi-subs being at the forefront. I need full range music from speakers right now, I have been deprived of that for too long so I need something that would work in a few weeks. The Linkwitz project seems to be a great path since I have a 8-channel Crown amplifier. I have only read great things about the Linkwitz and its portrayal of music. I am in discussion with a local person who has a pir of Yamaha NS-1000M, somewhere and this person is local. I need to test and see the speakers to see in what state they are in. OTOH a Linkwitz project would be with current and available drivers.

This is not making my decision easy, I am tempted to get both if the NS-1000M comes at a good price... Going active with a super-clean signal path, say miniDSP-88 in front of 4 Purifi-based amplifers would be quite something and at a decent (for an audiophile) price with either the LX521.4 or an active-(ated) Yamaha NS-1000M.
...

 

[audiopile]

I'd go for the Linkwitz solution - remarkable system that simply sounds right. He did a pretty remarkable job of designing a speaker that doesn't fight with the room.

 

[dualazmak]

Hello FrantzM,

Well understood. Good luck for your multichannel project!

Just for your info, Purifi module amps are also candidates in my multichannel project. At preset, 4 (four) of Apollon E1T400A is at the top of my candidate list. Before to place my purchase order for Apollon E1T400A, I will soon try (for free) two of DENTEC DP-NC400-4, Hypex NC-400 based 4-Ch amp, as the representative of Hypex and Purifi Class-D amplifiers.

 

[restorer-john]

I'd go with the Yamaha NS-1000 first. They will always be valuable and become more so as time goes on. It will also complete the system your dad had, and that is an awesome thing.

Have the big Yamaha 2010 amp carefully restored or repaired by a sympathetic and skilled restorer- not some fly by night soldering iron jockey. Explain the significance of it and make them assure you it won't get damaged, lost screws, butchered boards, scratched cabinet etc.

 

[dualazmak]

I'd go with the Yamaha NS-1000 first. They will always be valuable and become more so as time goes on. It will also complete the system your dad had, and that is an awesome thing.

Have the big Yamaha 2010 amp carefully restored or repaired by a sympathetic and skilled restorer- not some fly by night soldering iron jockey. Explain the significance of it and make them assure you it won't get damaged, lost screws, butchered boards, scratched cabinet etc.

Myself, personally, agree with you, since I still am much fascinating with my NS-1000, and I repeatedly found they are really wonderful and valuable (as you pointed) through my current multichannel project.

I fully understand, on the other hand, FrantzM's current demand for "full range music from speakers right now"; I hope he would consider to take both paths steadily, and will compare the multichannel NS-1000 system with Linkwitz system, and will kindly share the comparison with us here in the near future.

 

[dualazmak]

Hello friends,

I assume you are also aware of these nice web pages;
https://liquidaudio.com.au/yamaha-ca-2010-amplifier-repair-restoration/
https://liquidaudio.com.au/legendary-yamaha-ns-1000m-loudspeaker-review/

Edited to add on July 5;
For other valuable links to review articles on NS-1000 and NS-1000M please visit my post here.
I described the outline of renovation of my NS-1000 at here.

 

[Igor Kirkwood]

Drivers are available, but only on the secondary market. Yamaha no longer sells individual drivers AFAIK. I remember buying one of the last NS-1000 Be tweeters back in around 2000 and it took forever to get from Japan. Back then it was about AU$195. We still have it as a NOS spare.

The Be mids and tweeters are fine if not touched, cleaned or generally messed with. Some mids fracture around the dome edge. They are, after all ranging in age from 46 years (the oldest) to 26 years (the youngest).

The NS1000 woofers are an ongoing problem in terms of corrosion of the adhesive (magnet/pole pieces). The only woofers that won't fail are the ones that have been pulled down, cleaned of corrosion and adhesive and professionally re positioned and affixed. It is not a job for the faint hearted.

It's a problem if your Yamaha's Beryllium loudspeakers are damaged !

But you can find in Japan old but good Yamaha NS-1000 Beryllium loudspeakers or woofer

You can ask to dualazmak help you for Japanese auction

 

[gene_stl]

I just bought a second pair of NS1000 locally and it was a "deal" because the woofer magnets had come undone. The seller had stripped the epoxy off the magnets but decided to sell rather than complete the project, even though we have a pretty good speaker guy here in St. Louis.

https://www.facebook.com/Hempopotamus-Loudspeakers-448440448554186/
This guy will completely rebuild them. For about $200 each. Including remove and replace all adhesives and remagnetize the magnet. He knows what he is doing.

There is also an ebay seller handled "magicmarksy" who rebuilds Be tweeters. He claims to have had a lot of correct voice coils made and redoes them. I think he charges $139 for the service on your dead tweeter. This would be second choice for me but might be better than nothing. I think the guy is an ER doc in real life. I don't think he does the midranges. He does traffic in Yamaha drivers on ebay though.

 

[SpaceMonkey]

Here is a project the guy did with a different scanspeak woofer in active implementation:
https://www.jkwynn.co.uk/YamRev_HTML/YamRev_Thumbs.html
Maybe worthwhile instead of woofer rebuild...

 

[SpaceMonkey]

Here is a project the guy did with a different scanspeak woofer in active implementation:
https://www.jkwynn.co.uk/YamRev_HTML/YamRev_Thumbs.html
Maybe worthwhile instead of woofer rebuild...

Ok, checked price on Scanspeak woofer...
Rebuilding is cheaper

 

[dualazmak]

So many 2nd market and auction sites are listing NS-1000, NS-1000M and their drivers; just e.g. Japan Yahoo Auction site searched by "NS-1000";
https://auctions.yahoo.co.jp/search...&aq=-1&oq=&sc_i=&fr=auc_top&p=NS-1000&x=0&y=0
https://auctions.yahoo.co.jp/search/search?p=NS-1000&va=NS-1000&exflg=1&b=51&n=50

I hope your web browser will properly translate these into English.
I do not know if you have similar 2nd market and/or auction sites dealing audio gears in the US, especially NS-1000 and related gears.

 

[gene_stl]

ScanSpeak stuff is usually expensive. Probably pretty good stuff but I have never owned any of it. How much wuz that woofer in the USA. If Madisound is the only source one knows the price is not reasonable. (edit $279)

LOTS of good speaker drivers available. Even Yamaha Be aren't that hard to find it seems.

https://page.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/s739080966
This is about what condition my woofs are in.

I like that guys project (JK Wynn) it is nice work. The successor to the NS 1000M was centered with rounded corners as he has done.
I will eventually bypass the crossovers and triamp but I don't feel the need to redo the enclosures which if not perfect, are very good.

There are yamaha speakers listed on AudioMart and I also got a pair on Facebook Marketplace.

 

[SpaceMonkey]

ScanSpeak stuff is usually expensive. Probably pretty good stuff but I have never owned any of it. How much wuz that woofer in the USA. If Madisound is the only source one knows the price is not reasonable.

LOTS of good speaker drivers available. Even Yamaha Be aren't that hard to find it seems.

https://page.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/s739080966
This is about what condition my woofs are in.

I like that guys project (JK Wynn) it is nice work. The successor to the NS 1000M was centered with rounded corners as he has done.
I will eventually bypass the crossovers and triamp but I don't feel the need to redo the enclosures which if not perfect, are very good.

There are yamaha speakers listed on AudioMart and I also got a pair on Facebook Marketplace.

SS driver is 200 eur and 300 $. In europe it makes sense.

Today i measured my pair (took me ages) . What a disappointment!
NOTHING TO FIX! And i have a digital eq that i wanted to integrate with them.
In their suboptimal position, one in corner, another next to the wall. And they are mostly ok.
Flat to 2 kHz, falling after slowly to around 10 kHz, faster after it.
So nothing really to do, just listen to music.

 

[FrantzM]

Hi

After much debate and research and such ... I am going with the Yamaha solution.
I will use 3 subs in a Geddes-arrangement , likely 3 SVS SB-2000 in a 5 x 6 x 3 meters room.
The CA-2010 will be sent for repair, in the interim, I'll use a Rotel preamp + Amp

I still am dreaming of going Okto Research Dac 8 + some kind of fully digital DSP + Hypex or Purifi-based amplifiers + the 3 powered subs .. Could be the end game for for a while ..or ..not

Thanks all!

Now a question. Should I think about changing the condensers in the crossover?

 

[SpaceMonkey]

Hi

After much debate and research and such ... I am going with the Yamaha solution.
I will use 3 subs in a Geddes-arrangement , likely 3 SVS SB-2000 in a 5 x 6 x 3 meters room.
The CA-2010 will be sent for repair, in the interim, I'll use a Rotel preamp + Amp

I still am dreaming of going Okto Research Dac 8 + some kind of fully digital DSP + Hypex or Purifi-based amplifiers + the 3 powered subs .. Could be the end game for for a while ..or ..not

Thanks all!

Now a question. Should I think about changing the condensers in the crossover?

If you want to do it, just create crossover from scratch and keep the old one for historic purposes. But i doubt you will see/hear much difference between old/new (maybe at first yes, but then you will get used to it)

 

[SpaceMonkey]

Btw, this will easily satisfy all your multichannel amplifier needs :
http://totallyshould.com/?p=926

 

[dualazmak]

Hello FranzM,

Very nice to hear your decision, and you are much welcome again to visit my multichannel project with NS-1000.

I highly recommend you to change all the capacitors (condensers) and coils, and fully overhaul the attenuators, and put them in a outer network box;
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ssover-and-multichannel-dac.12489/post-369475
and
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ssover-and-multichannel-dac.12489/post-371694

The improvement of sound quality was really amazing. If needed, I will inform you the details of the capacitors and air-core coils I used in my renovation.

As for the overhaul of attenuators, this link would be informative for you;
http://audio-summit.co.jp/2019/04/04/ns-1000mのメンテナンス後編（アッテネーター洗浄）/
Since this procedure needs very careful and skillful disassemble - cleaning - reassemble steps, you may better to ask some professional repair shop to do the attenuator overhaul. (I, myself, did it successfully, though.)

 

[SpaceMonkey]

Hello FranzM,

Very nice to hear your decision, and you are much welcome again to visit my multichannel project with NS-1000.

I highly recommend you to change all the capacitors (condensers) and coils, and fully overhaul the attenuators, and put them in a outer network box;
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ssover-and-multichannel-dac.12489/post-369475
and
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ssover-and-multichannel-dac.12489/post-371694

The improvement of sound quality was really amazing. If needed, I will inform you the details of the capacitors and air-core coils I used in my renovation.

As for the overhaul of attenuators, this link would be informative for you;
http://audio-summit.co.jp/2019/04/04/ns-1000mのメンテナンス後編（アッテネーター洗浄）/
Since this procedure needs very careful and skillful disassemble - cleaning - reassemble steps, you may better to ask some professional repair shop to do the attenuator overhaul. (I, myself, did it successfully, though.)

Quick question. Cant one rebuild attenuators with multiposition switches? Much higher precision should be possible.

 

[dualazmak]

Quick question. Cant one rebuild attenuators with multiposition switches? Much higher precision should be possible.

If you like to upgrade the attenuators to be placed in outer box, I highly recommend to use this Fostex R100T2 transformer-type precision step attenuator;
https://www.fostex.jp/products/r80br82br100t/
https://www.amazon.com/Fostex-R100T2-Attenuator/dp/B00LH3ODSY/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8
https://www.biccamera.com.e.lj.hp.transer.com/bc/item/3541088/

Rather expensive one, but really nice attenuator for mid-range (Be-squawkers) and Be-tweeters.