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Video Called "Hear Sound Loss in Speaker Cable"

kongwee

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Yes, 2400 W. At 600 V. What is the voltage and current at your systems max. transients is what's relevant.

To each their own I guess. I would definetely use a much thicker cable.

Much thicker cable at 2400W for outdoor flood light with armoured shield. I did own that kind of thick cable but cable core is not easy to do RCA, TRS connectors. Slim, low inductance, high power handling, fit all kind of audio connectors, 85% shield, CHEAP! Of course, you can get $50 cable to meet just nice at audio spec.

Sure. Do what you want. Just don't think you can convince people here that it is any better or is a logical choice. I wonder if you buy reference standard grade sugar for baking your cookies too :facepalm:

I'm not a baker. I don't come ASR for bakery science.:)
 
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Much thicker cable at 2400W for outdoor flood light with armoured shield. I did own that kind of thick cable but cable core is not easy to do RCA, TRS connectors. Slim, low inductance, high power handling, fit all kind of audio connectors, 85% shield, CHEAP! Of course, you can get $50 cable to meet just nice at audio spec.


I'm not a baker. I don't come ASR for bakery science.:)
Just edited my former post at the same time you replied. I'll paste it here:

Edit: 60 W RMS at 4 ohms is 3,9 A and you are at your cables rated current limit and will have power lost in it together with deviations in the frequency response due to voltage loss. Of course if you don't ever drive your system at more than 20 W it's not a problem. There are dynamics in music though.
 
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Rushes of to plug in his HGA silver in teflon IC's and give them a vicious rubbing with my Pre set to max volume to see if I can 'rustle up' any noise.


Nope, sweet f-ck all, another one bites the dust.
Did you do it bare feet? Please wear your electrical rubber gloves and stand on your arc flash mat and repeat the experiment.
 

kongwee

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Edit: 60 W RMS at 4 ohms is 3,9 A and you are at your cables rated current limit and will have power lost in it together with deviations in the frequency response due to voltage loss. Of course if you don't ever drive your system at more than 20 W it's not a problem. There are dynamics in music though.
I said before inductance and resistance you can plot the exact FR, and people in ASR can do so. You can even calculates the I2R lose when the give resistance. With 2400watt with 230V, the current is 10+ amp. 115V at 20+ amp, You won't run at kind of current, unless you have Class A 300watt at 8ohm heater or AVR with high channel count with 300watt. Other than that, all the amp out hardly reach at 10amp at the fuse. You can use stock electric kettle power cord to make audio cable provide it can fit all kind of connectors and don't mind the high inductance value. Actually you can bulk me this way. lol However, you know I will say CHEAP as all the attributes I given. You know there are many cable out there with even pro use will not give your that price. It is just like I can get PCM512 at CD level price.
 
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I said before inductance and resistance you can plot the exact FR, and people in ASR can do so. You can even calculates the I2R lose when the give resistance. With 2400watt with 230V, the current is 10+ amp. 115V at 20+ amp, You won't run at kind of current, unless you have Class A 300watt at 8ohm heater or AVR with high channel count with 300watt. Other that, all the amp out hardly reach at 10amp at the fuse. You can use stock electric kettle power cord to make audio cable provide it can fit all kind of connectors and don't mind the high inductance value. Actually you can bulk me this way. lol However, you know I will say CHEAP as all the attributes I given. You know there are many cable out there with even pro use will not give your that price.
The cable in question is rated 600 V and 4 A, right? Then you compare with 230 V and > 10 A. The cable in question will not handle that. You can't just convert you power to current this way. Take a look under the hood of your car, locate the 12 V battery and take a guess to why the cable going from it are so heavy when it surely would be enough with a 22 AWG 600 V 4 A cable capable of 2400 W.. Current is the main decider of gauge, voltage is the main decider of the insulation.

The reason for the main fuse being 10 A is because the mains can supply sufficient power at a lower current because of the higher voltage. On the secondary side of your amplifiers transformer the voltage is lower and the current is (can be) higher, thus the (plausible) need for heavier gauge cables than the mains wire.

I'm not here to offend you but there seems to be a fundamental lack of electrical understanding and that's okay. Just don't act like you're right then. :)
 

Speedskater

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Again, in speaker cables the only thing that matters is: the end-to-end resistance of the cable in relationship to the impedance curve of the loudspeaker. So short thin cables work just the same as long thick cables.
 

kongwee

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The cable in question is rated 600 V and 4 A, right? Then you compare with 230 V and > 10 A. The cable in question will not handle that. You can't just convert you power to current this way. Take a look under the hood of your car, locate the 12 V battery and take a guess to why the cable going from it are so heavy when it surely would be enough with a 22 AWG 600 V 4 A cable capable of 2400 W.. Current is the main decider of gauge, voltage is the main decider of the insulation.

The reason for the main fuse being 10 A is because the mains can supply sufficient power at a lower current because of the higher voltage. On the secondary side of your amplifiers transformer the voltage is lower and the current is (can be) higher, thus the (plausible) need for heavier gauge cables than the mains wire.

I'm not here to offend you but there seems to be a fundamental lack of electrical understanding and that's okay. Just don't act like you're right then. :)
Of course you can covert 230V or 115V because it is Ohm law. Take 83319E 14.6ohm at 1000ft with 4 amp to maintain 25 degree temperature. These are the normal for the cable to perform in spec. You have to keep keep at eye in internal resistance so the the cable will perform. Over current in internal resistance will start melting the cable. Finally it is power in internal resistance you can calculate before it melt. Max power in internal resistance is current square x resistance. 4 x 4 x 14.6 = 852 watt at 1000ft. All you have to do is not to go over 852watt. Let say I make a 10ft cable. My resistance is 0.146 ohm. I pump in 20 amp at 115V. I don't need voltage in the equation. I get 20 x 20 x 0.146. I get 58.2 watt way far away from 852watt. Love Beldon for giving spec make very calculation very easy.
 
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NTK

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4 x 4 x 14.6 = 852 watt at 1000ft.
4 x 4 x 14.6 = 233.6 W, not 852 W. You have 1000 ft of cable to dissipate the heat, therefore, the per ft power dissipation is 0.234 W.

I get 20 x 20 x 0.146. I get 58.2 watt way far away from 852watt.
In your second case, you have only 10 ft of cable to dissipate 58.2 W. Which mean 5.8 W per ft, and is 25 times higher -- and what a coincidence, 25 = (20/4)^2!

Love Beldon for giving spec make very calculation very easy.
Belden is a great company, but you still need to do your calculations correctly and understand what the results mean.
 
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Of course you can covert 230V or 115V because it is Ohm law. Take 83319E 14.6ohm at 1000ft with 4 amp to maintain 25 degree temperature. These are the normal for the cable to perform in spec. You have to keep keep at eye in internal resistance so the the cable will perform. Over current in internal resistance will start melting the cable. Finally it is power in internal resistance you can calculate before it melt. Max power in internal resistance is current square x resistance. 4 x 4 x 14.6 = 852 watt at 1000ft. All you have to do is not to go over 852watt. Let say I make a 10ft cable. My resistance is 0.146 ohm. I pump in 20 amp at 115V. I don't need voltage in the equation. I get 20 x 20 x 0.146. I get 58.2 watt way far away from 852watt. Love Beldon for giving spec make very calculation very easy.

NKT has covered your mistakes.

As I stated earlier; lack of basic electrical understanding. It's not a problem as long as you not stubbornly think you are right but gets dangerous real quick if you do.

I hope you don't burn your house down and if you do, don't show this thread to your insurance company.
 

kongwee

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4 x 4 x 14.6 = 233.6 W, not 852 W. You have 1000 ft of cable to dissipate the heat, therefore, the per ft power dissipation is 0.234 W.


In your second case, you have only 10 ft of cable to dissipate 58.2 W. Which mean 5.8 W per ft, and is 25 times higher -- and what a coincidence, 25 = (20/4)^2!


Belden is a great company, but you still need to do your calculations correctly and understand what the results mean.
Ok, I made the first mistake at 4 x 4 x 14.6 = 233.6W. You can 0.234w per ft. I go to your logic. But this cable is Teflon coated. It is spec to 200 degree, not PVC at 70. Of course I don't know the science that you can use that same power linear relationship to cook this cable. . But I do know 2400 max whether it is 1 ft or 1000ft. Teflon is high temperature and high voltage resistance. You can keep the profile slim unlike PVC thick and heavy.
 
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What does any of this 'Electricity 101' arithmetic have to do with speaker cables?
Disregarding the misunderstandings and miscalculations, why is voltage drop and loss in speaker cables not relevant?
 
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It's relevant, but has nothing to do with all that arithmetic.
Well, deltaU is I x R and what I and NKT tried to point out is that the 600 V 4 A cable can be too small a gauge and lossy. The cause was a lossy one as well, I'm afraid.
 
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