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VHS Hi-Fi: The Mediocre, the Bad and the Crappy

It would be very interesting to see contemporary measurements of cassette decks and tapes.
@amirm tested a (very) good nakamichi deck.

I have... things... to say about VHS HiFi (and, by implication, at least, Beta HiFi, too) but, perhaps ironically, I don't have the bandwidth to do it right now.
As Arrrrrrrnold once said, though --
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:cool:
 
I'm a little sad everyone I know hopped off cassettes so fast. I don't know anyone with tapes or playback gear.
The tapes themselves deteriorated pretty fast and so do the internals of many tape decks so that's a factor. My tapes became mostly unlistenable and got binned years ago. I think I sold the tape deck for a nominal amount as it just became a waste of space.
 
I have to ask: your English is perfect, so have you spent a lot of time outside Россия?
Not at all, actually!
About 4 years ago I passed Cambridge FCE with 3 categories being in C1 level territory... Watching YT helps immensely, in terms of understanding "real-world" speaking and broadening your vocabulary (mine is quite scarce still). Unfortunately, it's all about practice :) Sometimes I don't even comprehend, whether I'm watching video in Russian or English, brain just automatically readjusts for it.
 
Send one of this VHS system to Danny. He will change the connectors, the internal wiring and probably some caps in the filter.
I'm working on Panasonic DVCPRO50 deck rn, I'd like to swap those pesky 200(?) smd caps with huge-ass Mundorf ones :p

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Thanks for this...interesting stuff. I still have a SAMSUNG VHS to DVD burner combo unit I picked up to preserve VHS home movies and videos that I wanted to save (early 90's bike EURO Classics bike races). I tried to get rid of it but it was suggested to keep it for bit longer...
 
In its time, VHS Hi-Fi was a revelation. It was far, far better than linear tracks they had used before.
That’s true—VHS linear audio sounded worse than cassette tapes.

I used HiFi VHS back in the day to record FM radio broadcast specials that were too long to fit on audio cassette. Had a TOTL Sony that had level controls and meters. I think it might have had Dolby B as well, although I am unsure (Dolby B might have been for recording linear audio tracks as opposed to HiFi audio). Worked well in that application!
 
In 1987 I purchased a Panasonic HIFI VCR. I used it to record end of the year countdown specials from the FM radio. It was cool technology for the time. Thank you for sharing.
 
If memory serves, at the slowest speed, "EP" (i.e., 6 hour for a T-120 VHS videocassette) the linear tape velocity is* 15/16 ips (umm... in the real world, that's something like 24 mm per second.
OK, it is apparently even worse than that. :facepalm:
Per a table at this page**, the length of a T-120 cassette is 811 feet***, and, at the EP (slowest) speed, the recording time is 371 minutes for NTSC*** video. Doing the arithmetic gives a linear velocity of about 0.44 inches per second or ca. 11.1 mm per second at EP speed. :rolleyes: Kind of leisurely.
Conversely, the (linear) velocity of a Philips standard cassette tape is* 1-7/8 inches per second (ca. 47.6 mm/sec).
Yes, the quality of linear audio on a VHS video tape is terrible.

It might be recalled (by those of us who are of a certain age) that there were a crop of "Stereo VHS" (i.e., non "HiFi") decks that recorded (only) linear stereo audio -- some of those even offered noise reduction, but, still, the attainable quality was abysmal (or even abyssal ;) ).
___________
* Note that I have decided, in the (contemporary) context of this thread, to use the present tense in this post to describe this decidedly antique format! :cool:
** https://videotape-formats.fandom.com/wiki/VHS#Tape_speed
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(I cannot vouch for the accuracy of the above!)
*** Sorry to go all American on y'all -- I do the best I can! ;)
 
It might be recalled (by those of us who are of a certain age) that there were a crop of "Stereo VHS" (i.e., non "HiFi") decks that recorded (only) linear stereo audio -- some of those even offered noise reduction, but, still, the attainable quality was abysmal (or even abyssal ;) ).
Some of decks allowed 2 track linear recording for audio dubbing
 
In the early 90s, it was not uncommon for me to hear from my friends' dads (I was a youngster at the time, with an interest in hifi) that Mitsubishi hifi VCRs were the cat's meow. The remotes had jog dials on them, which was enough to sell me, and I wish at least that still was a thing. Who knew people were still playing with these.

This was in the metro northeast, FWIW.
 
I also had two hi-fi video recorders that recorded sound using the helical track method. Both also had recording level controls for each channel. Unfortunately, I can't remember the type designations, only that the first was from Panasonic and the second from Mitsubishi. The Panasonic had a flap across its entire width, behind which many of the knobs and controls were concealed, including the recording level controls.

And yes, I also used this to record entire radio programmes in one go. And my ears really liked it.

Thank you for this piece of nostalgia. :)
 
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Back in the 1980's there was a lot of discussion about using VHS HiFi (the helical recorded tracks, not the standard stereo linear tracks) - as a high quality recording medium.

At the time JVC was considered the high end of VHS... and their machines were highly respected.

I don't know whether the current crop of machines are just far far lower quality (possible), or whether VHS HiFi was always a middling medium, and the hype was all snake oil marketing...

I vaguely recall that there were tests done that rated VHS HiFi highly - at least on a par or superior to the high end of cassette recording capabilities (which on Nakamichi, Revox, Tandberg, etc... was a pretty decent medium).
I'll stick with my Reel 2 Reels & my cassette decks, should I feel the urge to put something on tape (I actually plan to do the opposite: digitize my family events & historical tapes (things like the conversations between Houston & the Astronauts for the moon landings), hopefully in the upcoming year. We'll se what kind of new products are in the pipeline after March 2026 to do that with.
 
I also had two hi-fi video recorders that recorded sound using the helical track method. Both also had recording level controls for each channel. Unfortunately, I can't remember the type designations, only that the first was from Panasonic and the second from Mitsubishi. The Panasonic had a flap across its entire width, behind which many of the knobs and controls were concealed, including the recording level controls.

And yes, I also used this to record entire radio programmes in one go. And my ears really liked it.

Thank you for this piece of nostalgia. :)
Yes, you're talking about high-end decks like Panasonic NV-HS800/1000 or AG-4700. Unfortunately, most of affordable options didn't have any level controls(
digitize my family events & historical tapes (things like the conversations between Houston & the Astronauts for the moon landings), hopefully in the upcoming year
There's a lot of misinformation on the internet in regards to TBCs and frame synchronizers... That HR-S7700, for example, has the worst video FR out of all 4, despite having native Y/C output.
 
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For some reason this made me think of the Jethro Tull lyric...

It was a new day yesterday
It's an old day now
 
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We were fairly early adopters of VHS hi-fi, via a Zenith-branded (JVC) deck acquired ca. 1986 (memory is hazy!) at the big annual Stereo Discounters hifi show and sale at the Timonium Fairgrounds near Baltimore, MD. Stereo Discounters was a big deal in those days, and their big (truly huge) big sale at the fairgrounds was likewise a big deal.

VHS Hi-Fi (and Beta Hi-Fi before it) was a big deal.

Remember that recording even what y'all would consider low-definition NTSC color video onto magnetic tape was a significant technical achievement! Very early attempts used outrageous linear tape speeds to achieve the necessary bandwidth.

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ERA stored 405-line monochrome television as a linear recording on half-inch magnetic tape travelling at 200 inches (5.08m) per second. The 20½-inch diameter spools gave 15 minutes' recording time.

Clever engineers at Ampex (Ray Dolby, Fred Pfost, and other members of a small team) used rotating heads to achieve a practical format for (at the time, monochrome) video recording. This trick ;) gave high relative velocity, affording the required frequency response but with less outrageous linear tape speed. Remember, also, that all this was done using analog electronics... these were clever people.

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https://www.computerhistory.org/storageengine/rotary-head-delivers-high-quality-video/ (e.g.)

Pointless, egocentric aside: I worked, for a while, for Fred's son Dale, and spent a delightful afternoon with them both in Los Gatos, CA one fine day in 1995 when both Dale and I found ourselves between engagements, so to speak. :rolleyes:

The consumer video tape formats took this approach to its reasonable limits, in terms (I'd say) of tape width and linear velocity to yield affordable, practical, and (ultimately) inexpensive appliances for the masses to watch I Love Lucy and porn. ;)

At any rate, the notion of using rotating audio heads, too, recording not amplitude but frequency modulated analog audio was, I'd opine, likewise beastly clever and elegant.

Sony/Beta Hi-Fi came first, but, of course, JVC's competing VHS (Hi-Fi) format essentially won the day, although being (it is said) technically inferior.
Personally, I have far less experience with Beta, but I believe what I've read in that latter regard. :)

So... let me claw myself back on topic...
 
I remember hat in the past there have been so called PCM adapters that digitized audio to a signals to a signal that could be recorded on VSH. Way back the same from TV Signal to analog Audio like a DAC.

 
OK.
So, this is the aforementioned Zenith (JVC) VHS Hi-Fi Stere Audio-Video Recorder (so labeled!) that we bought.

holidaydubbing121209 by Mark Hardy, on Flickr
In the photo, the deck's being used to record (dub) an LP of "Christmas music" (see below for more gruesome details).
The photo above is from December 2012. :)

This relatively early VHS Hi-Fi deck has numerous interesting (and, in some cases, bizarre) features.
1) The tape mechanism is side-loading(?!?) -- i.e. the tape is inserted sideways into a slot located on the left-hand edit; right-hand side of the deck.
This reduces the deck's footprint considerably (see above) and gives it a cosmetic aspect that resembles nothing as much as a ludicrously advanced 8-track tape cartridge deck! ;)
2) The deck's rotating video heads allow recording at only two speeds (SP and EP), although medium speed (LP) playback is supported.
3) The deck has stereo rotating "hi-fi audio" heads, as well as a linear head (stereo, I think) for compatibility.
4) The deck features separate audio inputs and outputs, as well as a peak-reading fluorescent audio level display and input (record) level sliders for both audio channels.
5) When used as an "audio only" recorder, the video heads' signals are (if memory serves) suppressed or blanked, ostensibly to improve performance as an audio recorder.
6) The deck has switchable (i.e., defeatable) ALC for care-free audio recording when desired. :)
7) The deck offered a real time, and reasonably accurate display of tape time used or remaining (fairly uncommon in those days).

I used the deck to record and watch video tapes, of course, but over the years (decades!) we've used it to dub hours and hours of audio-only programming (dubbed from LP, analog tape, and CDs, too!). I've also used it to record live music performances (with a mixer) with pretty good results.

I guess my only other "point" would be to note that the audio quality of all recordings I've made with it have been excellent (by ear) with respect to the original source. The FM recording gives the best possible dynamic range and S/N ratio without requirement noise reduction. CD quality? Well... umm... not really... but generally superior to any AM analog recording in most respects.
There are all sorts of grumblings about head switching noise, dropouts, etc. to be found on the internet, but practically speaking the tapes sound very good compared to cassette or even pretty good (TASCAM, Otari, ReVox) reel to reel decks that live here.
The tapes have also held up very well.
We have an embarrassingly immense collection of Christmas music dubbed to VHS Hi-Fi audio. All were done at EP speed (no practical reason to record 'faster', unlike linear AM recording) on a wide spectrum of tape media (in terms of price/quality/provenance) and they have all held up well for up to three-plus decades. We listen to these virtually continuously* every year from the Friday after Thanksgiving (US holiday) until Epiphany (Jan. 6), so they've had plenty of hours of use.


(a couple of the tapes are T-160, so 8 hours of audio at EP speed :p)

In full disclosure, nowadays, for playback we use a very cheap "modern" DVD-VHS deck that I bought new back around 2000(??) from Tweeter, etc. in Massachusetts. It's also branded "Zenith", but by then Zenith was just a name and not an electronics company any more. :(



I also spent some time last year digitizing some of the dubbed :rolleyes: holiday VHS audio tapes for posterity, convenience... and for listening to in the car(s). :)



Summary: If I have any point to make at all ;) -- the early crop of Hi-Fi decks were superbly robustly constructed and in many cases designed with features to augment the production of very good quality audio tapes. The whole industry cheapened the decks into pretty generic appliances by the turn of the century, although I am sure that there were always a few good options.

Oh, and I do wish I had a functional Beta Hi-Fi deck to try... ;)
_____________
* don't judge me! ;) Mrs. H and I really enjoy this stuff at the holiday season.
 
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