• WANTED: Happy members who like to discuss audio and other topics related to our interest. Desire to learn and share knowledge of science required. There are many reviews of audio hardware and expert members to help answer your questions. Click here to have your audio equipment measured for free!

USB audio interfaces interest

What USB audio interfaces do you want measurements made of?

  • Swissonic UA-2x2

    Votes: 27 9.2%
  • Midiplus Studio M

    Votes: 5 1.7%
  • Presonus AudioBox iOne

    Votes: 17 5.8%
  • Focusrite Scarlett Solo 3rd Gen

    Votes: 150 51.0%
  • Audient iD4

    Votes: 68 23.1%
  • Steinberg UR22 MK2

    Votes: 70 23.8%
  • Roland Rubix22

    Votes: 30 10.2%
  • Presonus Studio 24

    Votes: 32 10.9%
  • Mackie Onyx Artist 1.2

    Votes: 16 5.4%
  • Icon Cube 4nano

    Votes: 3 1.0%

  • Total voters
    294

ousi

Active Member
Joined
Jan 17, 2020
Messages
120
Likes
78
Location
California
Now that's I've seen the quite amazing official specs (-113 dB of THD+N and 123 dB(A) of dynamic range), I'm even more interested. Since the Duet has the same specs and half the price, this might be even useful.
On the other hand, I really dislike those complex devices with a screen or touch controls. Doesn't look UAC compliant and the 1 year warranty leaves me cold, too.
Yea, I bought mine used from a friend. I actually like the display when it sits on my desk making me look "professional" even when I was just watching Youtube or playing games. The reason why I wanted this instead of the Duet was because of the display and it has enough inputs for my modest collection of instruments - two Rode mics, a stereo synth, an electric violin. It's easy to adjust and monitor the level and switch instruments in and out with the display.
 

ousi

Active Member
Joined
Jan 17, 2020
Messages
120
Likes
78
Location
California
Speaking of the Focusrite, I used to have their rackmount version 2nd Gen. I found their preamp quite noisy, but other than that it worked pretty well. In terms of subjective sound quality, I would say it sounds really dry even compared to Apogee. It's lifeless and dry at the same time, caused me to notch up the treble or upper-mid too much sometimes in the end mix...
 

skyfly

Active Member
Joined
May 1, 2020
Messages
205
Likes
54
My guess:
Opera Snapshot_2020-05-04_084245_mackie.com.png

Mackie Onyx Artist 2.2 would be better than 1.2 for line measurement.

The 1.2 seems to have one low distortion pre-amp("boutique quality"), and that is for mic only.

The 2.2 seems to have two low distortion pre-amps for both channels. Each channel can be used for one of mic, guitar, and line.
 
Last edited:

jae

Major Contributor
Joined
Dec 2, 2019
Messages
1,208
Likes
1,508
I wish there was a minimalist, high performing product to connect a professional microphone and/or line in to PC via USB only, like some of the high performing amplifiers and dacs we see these days. No need for any other kinds of outputs- for me the only thing necessary on chassis would be 1-2 XLR combo jack input on the BACK of the unit, gain knob, and a switch/buttons to toggle phanton power on/off, maybe line in and mute as well. Meters would be nice or even just an LED to show clipping would suffice. It should ideally have 80-90 dB of clean gain but 60 should be a minimum.

If this product existed, it would probably satisfy most of the needs of those just wanting to use professional XLR mics on their PC for voice communications/podcasts/streaming etc or recording/archiving audio from instruments and other analog sources. Surely by omitting all those other features a good product could be made in the $100-200 range that performs as well as the MOTU/RME stuff.
 

LTig

Master Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Feb 27, 2019
Messages
5,760
Likes
9,442
Location
Europe
I wish there was a minimalist, high performing product to connect a professional microphone and/or line in to PC via USB only, like some of the high performing amplifiers and dacs we see these days. No need for any other kinds of outputs- for me the only thing necessary on chassis would be 1-2 XLR combo jack input on the BACK of the unit, gain knob, and a switch/buttons to toggle phanton power on/off, maybe line in and mute as well. Meters would be nice or even just an LED to show clipping would suffice. It should ideally have 80-90 dB of clean gain but 60 should be a minimum.

If this product existed, it would probably satisfy most of the needs of those just wanting to use professional XLR mics on their PC for voice communications/podcasts/streaming etc or recording/archiving audio from instruments and other analog sources. Surely by omitting all those other features a good product could be made in the $100-200 range that performs as well as the MOTU/RME stuff.
I haven't seen a USB interface with inputs only. However maybe the Yamaha AG06 for €150 matches your needs. Don't know how good it performs though.
 

Blumlein 88

Grand Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Feb 23, 2016
Messages
20,524
Likes
37,057
How about a Motu M2? Close to what you want and in budget. In the lower prices a less featured device will have a smaller market and therefore not be cheaper. The extra outputs of the M2 won't get in the way.
 

jfetter

Member
Forum Donor
Joined
Sep 19, 2019
Messages
51
Likes
13
The m2 headphone out is excellent. Something to consider.
 

jae

Major Contributor
Joined
Dec 2, 2019
Messages
1,208
Likes
1,508
The m2 headphone out is excellent. Something to consider.

I feel like most of us would probably have better than what the motu stuff provides as far as dac/headphone out goes. It basically has the best headphone out of (at least) all the sub $800-1000 interfaces, but even the cheapest ~$100 dedicated amps and dacs perform better these days, but it is undoubtedly a great all in one package and definitely unthrones the scarlett offerings as the best valued products.

How about a Motu M2? Close to what you want and in budget. In the lower prices a less featured device will have a smaller market and therefore not be cheaper. The extra outputs of the M2 won't get in the way.

I'm more or less already decided and will likely be getting the M2/M4 and an upgrade to my Behringer UMC204HD since it is the best performing in the price range before the RME Babyface pro I think, and they also cost 3-4x less. I only really use it for voice chatting with XLR mics, recording my voice, and very rarely recording other audio sources so I thought a minimal product could be a good idea. I feel like a product like that would be great for the growing live streaming/podcast/youtube market. I believe new products like the Audient Evo 4 ($130) are focused on that market and while it foregoes line outputs it still has a headphone output, which ironically isn't ideal for most modern headphones because of its high output impedance. That interface also comes with some gimmicky software/automatic gain features that most people who know what they are doing would never use. Another problem is it only has 58 dB of gain on the mic pres so it is not good enough for the more insensitive dynamic mics, needing a $150 cloudlifter or similar if you want transparent gain. Pretty sure I would still need a cloudlifter with with one of the MOTUs (60 dB) to properly drive my Shure SM7B.

There is definitely a need for the 'JDS Atom' or 'Magni Heresy' of interfaces- something lean and simple but with very high performance and specs in a smaller form factor, with a low manufacturing cost. If audient could do it for $130, surely it is possible to keep everything at a low price by removing costs for the software, removing the 1/4" in/out and amplifier circuitry, and improving the actual analogue inputs since that is the chief thing people want to use these products for anyway.

A bit beyond the scope of this thread but does anyone know of any cheaper alternatives to the CL-1 preamp/activator that have similar transparency? Surprised I have not seen any chinese clones of this for $30-50 yet.
 

Attachments

  • TB238dmbXXXXXcIXpXXXXXXXXXX_!!1094243595.jpg
    TB238dmbXXXXXcIXpXXXXXXXXXX_!!1094243595.jpg
    157.4 KB · Views: 1,145
Last edited:

Be.

Member
Joined
May 13, 2020
Messages
8
Likes
2
Location
Chicago, USA
I would be curious to see how the Apollo Twin and Apogee Duet compare to the RME Babyface Pro and MOTU audio interfaces. I have seen lots of musicians use the Apollo Twin on stage.
 

Blumlein 88

Grand Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Feb 23, 2016
Messages
20,524
Likes
37,057
I feel like most of us would probably have better than what the motu stuff provides as far as dac/headphone out goes. It basically has the best headphone out of (at least) all the sub $800-1000 interfaces, but even the cheapest ~$100 dedicated amps and dacs perform better these days, but it is undoubtedly a great all in one package and definitely unthrones the scarlett offerings as the best valued products.

A bit beyond the scope of this thread but does anyone know of any cheaper alternatives to the CL-1 preamp/activator that have similar transparency? Surprised I have not seen any chinese clones of this for $30-50 yet.

One trick you can use for the Shure SM7B if you are only using that one microphone. Send it thru one pre with a small amount of gain, go line out and feed that into the other microphone input. Essentially going thru two microphone pres to get additional gain. That in principal is no different than what a Cloudlifter does. I've not done it with an SM7B myself, but have read of those who have. BTW, Shure suggests a minimum mic pre gain of 60 db for that microphone. 60 db gain is what the owner's manual for the M2 and M4 claim.

This is a little cheaper than a Cloudlifter. I don't know anything much about it, but people say they use it with the SM7B. $99
https://www.sweetwater.com/store/de...s-dm1-dynamite-1-channel-active-inline-preamp
 

pkane

Master Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Aug 18, 2017
Messages
5,632
Likes
10,206
Location
North-East
I would be curious to see how the Apollo Twin and Apogee Duet compare to the RME Babyface Pro and MOTU audio interfaces. I have seen lots of musicians use the Apollo Twin on stage.

I have an Apollo Twin Duo and can do some measurements if you have something specific you'd want to see. Some very quick ones were posted here a while ago.
 

Madao

Member
Joined
Apr 23, 2020
Messages
18
Likes
6
Was there ever measurements done on any of the Focusrite Scarletts? I have a strong inclination that it won't do as well as others like Presonus and Steinberg. From personal experience I find their range overrated to the point I wonder if it's actually shilled. The truth if you look deep enough is that they suffer from a plethora of issues, poor quality control and bad driver support. Thankfully I got a full refund for my Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 and my microphone works via USB as well which I had much better results with than via the Scarlett which I find a bit sad.

What I think doesn't really matter though. Only the measurements.
 

JohnYang1997

Master Contributor
Technical Expert
Audio Company
Joined
Dec 28, 2018
Messages
7,175
Likes
18,292
Location
China
Was there ever measurements done on any of the Focusrite Scarletts? I have a strong inclination that it won't do as well as others like Presonus and Steinberg. From personal experience I find their range overrated to the point I wonder if it's actually shilled. The truth if you look deep enough is that they suffer from a plethora of issues, poor quality control and bad driver support. Thankfully I got a full refund for my Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 and my microphone works via USB as well which I had much better results with than via the Scarlett which I find a bit sad.

What I think doesn't really matter though. Only the measurements.
It's the other way around. Focusrite does consistently better than presonus and steinberg.
 

Blumlein 88

Grand Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Feb 23, 2016
Messages
20,524
Likes
37,057
You could try these 8th generation copies and see if you can hear them vs the original file. I used a Scarlett 1st gen interface for the ADC on these.

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...dac-loop-vs-the-original-can-you-hear-it.448/

Disclaimer: In case you fear prejudice I do own a Focusrite interface. Scarlett 18i20.

I do think the Motu M2 and M4 are the better device in that price range now. It is what I suggest to people.

@Madao

I've got some measurements here if you are interested. Mine is the 1st gen, and they used the same chips in 2nd gen units. Not sure about 3rd gen.
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/focusrite-18i20-dac-measurements.2128/

I know they've got a bad rep for drivers and stuff. I've never had a minutes trouble from the two Focusrite units I've owned with Windows or Mac. I know some people do.
 

thefsb

Addicted to Fun and Learning
Joined
Nov 2, 2019
Messages
796
Likes
657
I know they've got a bad rep for drivers and stuff. I've never had a minutes trouble from the two Focusrite units I've owned with Windows or Mac. I know some people do.
I suspect this is more a problem with how Windows does audio than a device or driver problem. I have to turn my Motu M4 off and on several times a day. I've never known anything like this on Mac. WASAPI, ASIO, buffers, exclusive, direct sound... huh?
 

jfetter

Member
Forum Donor
Joined
Sep 19, 2019
Messages
51
Likes
13
I suspect this is more a problem with how Windows does audio than a device or driver problem. I have to turn my Motu M4 off and on several times a day. I've never known anything like this on Mac. WASAPI, ASIO, buffers, exclusive, direct sound... huh?
I'm not an expert on Windows but my newer intel w10 laptop has had zero issues with the m4. I have not ever installed free trials or other similar software. I think system driver(s) are replaced during some installs that permanently ruin the pc, requiring a re-install of the Os. There are utilities around that but they have issues too. So I keep one clean pc with just minimum software needed for CAD, ripping, playing and audio test.
The other computers are used as throw down testers.
 

hyperplanar

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 31, 2020
Messages
301
Likes
581
Location
Los Angeles
I suspect this is more a problem with how Windows does audio than a device or driver problem. I have to turn my Motu M4 off and on several times a day. I've never known anything like this on Mac. WASAPI, ASIO, buffers, exclusive, direct sound... huh?
Maybe it's harder to produce a well-behaved Windows driver compared to a Mac driver due to the additional complexities you suggested compared to just supporting CoreAudio, but some manufacturers manage to do so just fine, like RME... In my personal experience the Focusrite Windows drivers caused all kinds of weird behavior. You never knew what was going to be fixed and what new problems would arise with each driver update. Thankfully no driver was necessary to operate the Scarlett under macOS!
 

insane

Member
Joined
Jun 1, 2020
Messages
10
Likes
0
How does this one compare to the ones on similar price range?

https://www.thomann.de/gb/steinberg_ur24c.htm

Im going to be plugin my monitors and my Magni 3 amp for the headphone and that's about it. Some extra ins and outs are good if I ever buy some hardware or something but that's unlikely. My brother has an Eventide H9000 and sometimes he doesn't use it, could I be able to plug it in there and use it as an VST effect on my DAW?

I don't understand what this means:

  • 4 Line outputs: RCA
  • 2 Main outputs: 6.3 mm jack
What is the difference between main and line outputs? Main is the one that has the knob and controls all other outputs? (except phones)

And what is that "input-DAW" knob for?

I also considered the Focusrite 4i4 but honestly I like how that one looks better and they are basically the same from what I can tell.

Currently I have the Audio Kontrol 1 which is a mess. Has discontinued drivers, somehow works in Windows 10 but freezes randomly and I have to plug and unplug it. Sounds great tho but the buttons are cheap plastic that screw up with the audio when you move them. Time to replace it.

Another question is, I see the UR24C uses RCA for the 2 non main line outputs... do you lose quality compared to 6,3mm?

Where should I plug my monitors and the Magni 3 at? I suppose main would be for the monitors so I can control both speakers with the big know, so I already have the XLR to RCA cables.

Then for the Magni 3 I put it in L1 and 1R so I would need a RCA to RCA cable (currently using RCA to 6,3mm for the Audio Kontrol 1). Like this one?

https://www.thomann.de/gb/sommer_cable_basic_hba_6m_06m.htm
 
Last edited:
Top Bottom