UpTone Audio EtherREGEN Switch Review

[Deleted member 65]

Correct for the most part. I just wanted people to realize that prioritization is a thing on modern networks. Time delay sensitive data is managed.

Quality of Service

 

[Jinjuku]

Quality of Service

Q/CoS at Layer 2, DSCP at layer 3.

 

[SoundsGood]

I got my EtherREGEN in the first batch so I have had about a month of listening. My impression is it definitely improved the sound quality of my system, in my room with my ears. After reading this review I went back and took it out of my system and did more extensive comparisons with and without the device. Final impression is still positive for the EtherREGEN - more relaxed, musical, better attach and longer decays. So it stays in the system. The measurements do not show a difference but the actual sound reproduced with the EtherREGEN was improved. Also, using an optical input on the "A" side was better than a copper Ethernet input.

 

[Soniclife]

The measurements do not show a difference but the actual sound reproduced with the EtherREGEN was improved.

How did you control for sighted bias in your tests?

 

[thefsb]

Q/CoS at Layer 2, DSCP at layer 3.

That OSI terminology is decades past its expiration date.

 

[SoundsGood]

How did you control for sighted bias in your tests?

I am by myself so I did not conduct a blind test. I swapped the device in and out, listened to same track for one minute, repeat with a different track. Did one round in the AM and another round in the PM. Results were confirmed each time that the ER made it better.

I was still in the 30 day audition period and was actually hoping to not find an improvement so I could send it back, save money and reduce my box count but no. After hearing the improvement I could not listen without it so it stays.

 

[amirm]

Can you do the switching as I did? Get a cheap upstream switch and connect one output to ER and then to your streamer. While it is playing, pull out that cable and connect another feed from the switch to your streamer. That way switching is happening a lot faster.

You can also test simpler by pulling the ER connection in and out of your streamer while music is playing. If you do this fast enough, the streamers should not stop and you can instantly tell the effect.

 

[amirm]

I was still in the 30 day audition period and was actually hoping to not find an improvement so I could send it back, save money and reduce my box count but no. After hearing the improvement I could not listen without it so it stays.

We could have many debates about audio gear performance. In this case though, no argument even rises to the point of debate. This device cannot, and will not make an audible difference. I will bet you any amount of money that the sound has not improved.

I implore you to perform the above test I suggested blind. Have a loved one switch the cables for you when you are turned away. At stake is $640 and lifetime of new outlook on audio performance. Please don't let the opportunity pass you buy. It doesn't get simpler and easier than this scenario.

 

[SoundsGood]

We could have many debates about audio gear performance. In this case though, no argument even rises to the point of debate. This device cannot, and will not make an audible difference. I will bet you any amount of money that the sound has not improved.

I implore you to perform the above test I suggested blind. Have a loved one switch the cables for you when you are turned away. At stake is $640 and lifetime of new outlook on audio performance. Please don't let the opportunity pass you buy. It doesn't get simpler and easier than this scenario.

I called my audiophile friend and he is coming over tomorrow. We will conduct the blind test on each-other and let you know the results.

 

[amirm]

Most excellent. Thank you very much.

 

[garbulky]

Most excellent. Thank you very much.

I haven't heard these ethernet transports, But I always thought the concept was a little silly - in terms of things sounding better. Ethernet packets transmissions are simply immune to jitter. Otherwise we wouldn't be able to have 4k streaming video or pretty much the entire internet. I think you very thoroughly explained that there could not possibly be any kind of measurable difference as there literally isn't any.
They claimed jitter reduction and you showed there was no jitter reduction. Etc. All in all it was a very thorough review.

Do you think you could perform some sort of measurements on Roon's new certified transport mechanism I think it's called RAAT. Also Roon's transport in general compared to a regular software player. Roon has garnered a large following by people that claim it simply sounds better. I would be interested to know if this is true in terms of measurements.

 

[jasonk]

2. He says some of us don't listen. I listened. I heard no improvement.

Don't you people understand anything

The improvement is quantum and only happens when a listener with high quantum gullibility is listening. That is why your fancy analysis equipment can't detect the difference.

Have you never heard of Schrödinger's cat5 cable ?

 

[DonH56]

Have you never heard of Schrödinger's cat5 cable ?

My cat shredded mine then disappeared.

 

[jasonk]

My cat shredded mine then disappeared.

But you can not be sure it has disappeared until we all look

 

[amirm]

Do you think you could perform some sort of measurements on Roon's new certified transport mechanism I think it's called RAAT.

That is the native Roon streaming protocol. That is what I used in this review to stream to Matrix DAC. I have also used it with other streamers in other reviews. It is one of the best streaming protocols I have seen as far as reliability.

 

[SoundsGood]

I called my audiophile friend and he is coming over tomorrow. We will conduct the blind test on each-other and let you know the results.

That was interesting.
Blind testing the ER against a "generic" Netgear switch.....two of us were not able to consistently pick one switch over the other but there was a slight preference for the ER in the overall results. We just could not reliably pick the ER out each time. Doing a "sighted" test I did have a preference for the ER each time.

I have Kii Three DSP active speakers that up-sample the incoming data and process it with proprietary DACs / DSP modules. They sound very good with just about any input. The built-in power filtering renders the Kii immune to external conditioning and cable swaps.

Bottom line: The "sighted bias" is a real phenomenon that must be addressed when testing. Also, audiophiles like to tweak their systems which explains the availability of all the gadgets to try - some more effective than others. It's a hobby that we enjoy.

 

[amirm]

Thanks for trying and reporting back. Much appreciated.

 

[Soniclife]

That was interesting.
Blind testing the ER against a "generic" Netgear switch.....two of us were not able to consistently pick one switch over the other but there was a slight preference for the ER in the overall results. We just could not reliably pick the ER out each time. Doing a "sighted" test I did have a preference for the ER each time.

I have Kii Three DSP active speakers that up-sample the incoming data and process it with proprietary DACs / DSP modules. They sound very good with just about any input. The built-in power filtering renders the Kii immune to external conditioning and cable swaps.

Bottom line: The "sighted bias" is a real phenomenon that must be addressed when testing. Also, audiophiles like to tweak their systems which explains the availability of all the gadgets to try - some more effective than others. It's a hobby that we enjoy.

Good report.
Extra credit question, was it single or double blind?

 

[Figuy1017]

When you make a change to your system, if you think there is going to be a difference, you will hear it. Your brain hyper focuses on the music and now digs deep to hear note decays, silent background, etc. All of a sudden a "veil" is removed. Detail becomes luscious and more "analog like." More lifelike.

Now being assured that the change made a sonic difference, you go back to the old setting assuming it is going to sound worse. And worse it will sound.

This has happened to me countless times. I too can swear there is an improvement and a big one. Then I realize that what I thought could not have been there as often, I realize I had not made any changes!

Play a piece of music once. Then go back and play it again without changing anything. But now focus on it to hear more detail. And more detail you will hear. You will hear it even though I just explained, and you know there can't be a change. Yet there will be.

The common retort is that people hear these differences when they are enjoying gear, not testing it. Problem is, they make the initial assessment when comparing gear, not enjoying music in a laid back position.

With the effect not being real, it will wear off. Then comes the next tweak/"upgrade" that triggers the cycle over again. Take notice that the people who "hear" such impossible things, have tried and swear by many impossible tweaks. The ethernet cable. The power cable. The stand. The footers. The tweaks to the OS. The special media player. Heck, even what SATA cable is in the computer!

They are living an illusion and simulation and not able to step out of it to see the reality. They could if they just listened to us once. Just once perform the same test blind. Alas, just like the movie matrix, they don't want to know. Knowing means eating crow. And eating crow is not what folks rather do with online reputation.

I made a comment on a danafrip review that with DACs ranging in price from 1.00 to 200,000 you’d think there is 200,000 steps of incremental increases in sq because there is a correlated review for each one. Its pretty sad when that 3250 dac
is better than that 3225 one lol

 

[firedog]

That was interesting.
Blind testing the ER against a "generic" Netgear switch.....two of us were not able to consistently pick one switch over the other but there was a slight preference for the ER in the overall results. We just could not reliably pick the ER out each time. Doing a "sighted" test I did have a preference for the ER each time.

I have Kii Three DSP active speakers that up-sample the incoming data and process it with proprietary DACs / DSP modules. They sound very good with just about any input. The built-in power filtering renders the Kii immune to external conditioning and cable swaps.

Bottom line: The "sighted bias" is a real phenomenon that must be addressed when testing. Also, audiophiles like to tweak their systems which explains the availability of all the gadgets to try - some more effective than others. It's a hobby that we enjoy.

I also have the Kiis and the Kii Control. The Kiis are one of the things that have helped me realize that many of these audiophile "truths" aren't true. The Kii control is galvanically isolated and seems pretty immune to source. The system is extremely revealing, so any difference can be heard. I'm now running the system without any add on devices (just USB direct from server) because I found they made no difference - at least not one I could consistently pick out unsighted. And guess what: It's much more fun just to listen to music and stop worrying about how to tweak your setup.

Although the truth is I might add in a streamer again - not for SQ, but for networking and convenience reasons.