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Upgrading from my HD58x ? HD6xx or something else ?

solderdude

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#21
color and cable differs.
You might have to change the pads but you can use the HD58X pads.
When ordering new pads ... buy the originals.
 
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#23
I have the 6XX but have never heard the 58X so I don't know how different they are, but I absolutely love my 6XX. I have Modhouse Argons, Focal Elex's, Hifiman He-400i, and Sendy Aivas. By far my favorite are the Aiva's and the 6XX. I also have the JDS Labs Atom, and pairing that with the 6XX is perfect for me. I just can't tell you whether it is worth getting since you have the 58X. I am thinking of getting the hd600, haven't heard them either but I think they are worth a try.
 

JJB70

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#24
As an observation, for people in Europe it can work out pretty much the same price to buy the HD650 or 660 as the HD6xx after you pay shipping and VAT etc. Dealers often discount heavily and the Sennheiser outlet regularly has good offers on B stock.
 

MRC01

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#26
How similar is the Massdrop 58x to the original HD580? I still have mine, original owner from 1999. They've gone through several sets of ear & headband pads and cables but are otherwise original including drivers. They are virtually identical to the HD600, of which I also owned a pair. I would not recommend upgrading from HD580 to HD600, it's just too small a difference to be worthwhile. I eventually sold my HD600 because they were just an HD580 with nicer build materials. Even with the HD650, which actually do sound different from the 580/600, it's debatable whether they're "better". If you're going to upgrade, try a more significant difference, like the HD-800 or a planar magnetic.
I eventually did upgrade, but still kept the HD580 and still listen to them on my computer audio system.
 

solderdude

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#28
How similar is the Massdrop 58x to the original HD580?
The HD58X differs from the HD580 Precision. These are not direct replacements. The name HD58X is an 'hommage' to the old HD580 and indicates it is 'below' the current HD6** series.
The early HD580 has a plastic grille and different colors. The HD580 Jubilee (not the HD58X Jubilee) looks more like the, otherwise similar, HD600 but black with carbon-fiber look. HD580 also have different headband padding.
The HD580 is 'brighter' and has less bass extension than the HD58X.
 

MRC01

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#29
Love my HD650. Hated my HD800 and sold it within a month of getting it.
I don't like the HD800 either; to me it sounds artificially bright and tizzy. But it is a well engineered headphone with better measurements than the HD-6xx.
My point was if you're going to upgrade, try something that's quite a bit different, rather than something that is so similar. It's also worth listening to planars; the good ones have phenomenally low distortion and linear response, especially in the bass.
 

JohnYang1997

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#30
The answer is mod it.
Get a pair of akg earpads. Tear the nylon mesh down (dont break it). Also get some earbuds foam, those back stuff.
Remove the hd58x earpads, remove the foam. Place the mesh on, flat. Place the ring foam from akg. Then place the hd58x earpads back. This will remove the sennheiser veil(the foam sound) and clean up the texture for high frequencies. Suddenly it's two tier higher than before in terms of resolution and clarity.

Remove the back grill. Remove the foam. Put a thin layer of blutek around the hole, and place the earbuds foam on. This will reduce some of the bass. diyaudioheaven also suggested this mod.

Now you have super high performance headphones that sound twice as great.
 

JohnYang1997

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#31
A simple but expensive option is hd800s. They sounds pretty good but cost too much.
Also don't believe people who say elex is the direct upgrade from hd5xx 6xx. They are not remotely similar.
 

solderdude

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#32
Nope .. I did not suggest these mods nor using ear-bud foams.

And... the mods I suggest ONLY work well on the first drop HD58X and may well do something different to the later drop HD58X ... I still need to confirm the newer one I measured wasn't an outlier.

The 5kHz peak can only be removed by the passive filter. All acoustical modifications will also affect other frequencies.
 

JohnYang1997

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#33
Nope .. I did not suggest these mods nor using ear-bud foams.

And... the mods I suggest ONLY work well on the first drop HD58X and may well do something different to the later drop HD58X ... I still need to confirm the newer one I measured wasn't an outlier.

The 5kHz peak can only be removed by the passive filter. All acoustical modifications will also affect other frequencies.
The second mod is the one that's essentially the same as the one you suggested which reduces the bass. First mod is from myself. Also there isn't no 5k peak on the ear (at least the version I have and coupled to my ears).

You can use sine generator to identify peaks. The flat response should have loudness rising up after 1khz but there shouldn't be peaks.

Oh the "suggested" I mean actually meant "introduced" or "showed".
 

JohnYang1997

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#34
I have done critical listening tests, with er4 er2se and my yamaha hs7 speakers. I have proper equipment measurements for in ears and speakers but not over ear.
I need to confirm with my friends who have bk 4128c. I was still waiting for the extra akg earpads to try on hd650(of my another friend).
 

solderdude

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#35
All measurements from various measurement rigs say there is a 5kHz peak though and the sound becomes less 'edgy' with the filter.
Using different foam than the one tested isn't essentially the same. I tested various types of foam and densities (have plots in the article) and while all changed the amount of upper bass/lower mids they did so with different effect.

I don't recommend to use sinewaves and ears as a measurement replacement.

The foam discs are sold separately or you can buy Superlux foam discs.
No need to buy the pads at all even though they include the foam discs.
The effect the AKG foam discs have are described in my HD650 article.
 

JohnYang1997

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#36
All measurements from various measurement rigs say there is a 5kHz peak though and the sound becomes less 'edgy' with the filter.
Using different foam than the one tested isn't essentially the same. I tested various types of foam and densities (have plots in the article) and while all changed the amount of upper bass/lower mids they did so with different effect.

I don't recommend to use sinewaves and ears as a measurement replacement.

The foam discs are sold separately or you can buy Superlux foam discs.
No need to buy the pads at all even though they include the foam discs.
The effect the AKG foam discs have are described in my HD650 article.
It's not that hd58x has too much 5k but rather hd650 has recessed 5k region. It's not a peak. But rather a small hump. And when target applied (this is not even harman target but rather a combination of etymotic target which has less 5k and some other targets.) there is no excessed 5khz. This is measured on 4128c btw.
2f106770bc236205__02.jpg
 

solderdude

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#37
whatever you want it to be.. it is ;)
 

JohnYang1997

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#38
whatever you want it to be.. it is ;)
Btw, how do you know that flat on your measurement is "flat"? Most 58x measurements out there are not complied to the standard. (jude uses new hires head which has less 10k region which is a different issue I'm not talking about it here)
Here is what happens if I measure my 58x using non standard complied equipment.
58x.png

There is no 5k emphasis. I'm not saying this is accurate or not. Just to prove a point.
 

solderdude

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#39
There may not be a 5kHz on your test rig ... that does not mean there isn't any.
Your coupler may well attenuate 5kHz even though it is a 'real' and 'standard' method.
As you correctly stated ... the reference is all important here.

SBAF (sorry for not asking for permission):


Jude:
 

JohnYang1997

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#40
There may not be a 5kHz on your test rig ... that does not mean there isn't any.
Your coupler may well attenuate 5kHz even though it is a 'real' and 'standard' method.
As you correctly stated ... the reference is all important here.

SBAF (sorry for not asking for permission):


Jude:
I think sbaf uses similar setup as yours right?
And jude, I just briefly talked about last post it has a wide dip around 10khz comparing to our ears. (gras reduced the resonance of our ear canal, you can read 0db.kr for comparison between new gras hires head and old 4128c, new gras hires head's measurements are almost broken looking) And I think the picture here is prototype?
 
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