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Ultimate End Game Value Search (HIFIMAN HE1000 V2 vs. Dan Clark Expanse) [New or Used]

Lurrus

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Hi everyone. I've been doing a bunch of research and I believe I have finally come down to two high end headphones for my ultimate end game value search.

HIFIMAN HE1000 V2 & Dan Clark Audio Expanse

It looks like I can purchase the HIFIMAN for $2,000 new and the Dan Clark Audio Expanse used for about $3,000.


Current Audio Gear:

JDS Labs Element 3
Ascend Acoustics LX Bookshelf Speakers
Sennheiser HD 560S
Truthear Crinacle Zero IEM


What I am looking for:

A headphone that's true to the source as much as possible with little to no coloration. I would like a pair of headphones that sound as if I'm either there at the recording studio or at a live concert depending on the audio recording.


My Dilemma:

I'm not sure which one to purchase. I do take Amir's input and recommendations very seriously since he's able to provide extensive data to support his claims. If I'm not mistaken, I have not seen Amir mention any audio headphone or IEM that has given him "one of the most transformative experiences” with the exception of the Dan Clark Stealth headphone, giving his “highest praise and recommendation.” From the various reviews and online posts I've read so far, it seems like the Expanse is a minor improvement over the Stealth?

However, Amir has not reviewed the HIFIMAN HE1000 V2 headphones. I am concerned about putting down $2,000 for the HIFIMAN and then have Amir review the headphone and say that he doesn't like it or the headphone performance is mediocre for the price.

On the other hand, if the Dan Clark Expanse is marginally better than the HIFIMAN HE1000 V2, objectively and subjectively, I don't want to pay the extra $1,000.


My Humble Request:

Amir (@amirm) and anyone else here at Audio Science Review, please help me make the most informed decision regarding these two headphones. I've read and watched so many different reviews and I can't seem to pinpoint which headphone would be the ultimate end game value.


My Questions:

1) Someone mentioned that the Dan Clark Audio Expanse measurements are close or even better than the $60,000 Sennheiser HE-1. If that's the case, then the Dan Clark Audio Expanse should sound very similar to the HE-1?

2) Audio reviewer Crinacle gave the HIFIMAN HE1000 V2 an S- grade. His headphone list can be found here. Do you guys think that Crinacle's rating would be a good indicator that the HIFIMAN is a good headphone in comparison to the Dan Clark Expanse?

3) I've heard that the Dan Clark Audio customer support is great during warranty and out of warranty, even when someone bought their products used from another source. However, the reviews were about a couple of years ago. Does Dan Clark Audio (@Dan Clark) still provide great customer support to this day, in and out of warranty?

4) Are there other great alternatives that I missed that can be compared very close to the HE1000 V2 or Expanse, objectively and subjectively?

5) Anyone interested in selling their used Dan Clark Audio Expanse headphones?
 

asrUser

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The thing is the Expance is Harman tuned while Hifiman is not. But when you eq that Hifiman to Harman target, it will sound a lot livelier than every Dan Clark. DCA headphones seem to be very smooth and polite. If that's too boring for you, then you're not a DCA fanboy. If you really aim for an endgame, why not listen to a Hifiman Susvara first?

1) Probably no. You'd have to hear the HE-1 yourself to be sure about that.

2) Are you Crinacle?

3) HFM support should be ok

4) see above

5) I got none.

6) You need a more powerful amp than your current one and preferably balanced as well.
 
Last edited:

okok

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isn't that the he6se v2 deal can destroy everything up to $5000?
 

Leiker535

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1) Someone mentioned that the Dan Clark Audio Expanse measurements are close or even better than the $60,000 Sennheiser HE-1. If that's the case, then the Dan Clark Audio Expanse should sound very similar to the HE-1?
No, the Expanse is very Harman compliant, more so than the HE-1 (not by a lot though). They also use different driver technologies and have very different constructions (Expanse is very acoustically treated, much more so than most other headphones), and while the former may be extremely overemphasized in audio, the latter still might make them sound a tad different considering specific pinna interactions that are still not so well documented in HP usage.
2) Audio reviewer Crinacle gave the HIFIMAN HE1000 V2 an S- grade. His headphone list can be found here. Do you guys think that Crinacle's rating would be a good indicator that the HIFIMAN is a good headphone in comparison to the Dan Clark Expanse?
I've found that anything above B+ on Crinacle's ranking is highly subjective to his own ears (physical) and preferences; in other words, everything above B+ is already pretty good for the money and have (most of the time) pretty nice FR. Your mileage will vary. If you intend to spend that much money on headphones, you should most definately try them on first, specially as you already have a good pair with you (560s), you'll find that diminishing returns kick in hard, and so ponder more consciously if you are willing to spend 50x the price of your current set for more refinement and neat tricks.
3) I've heard that the Dan Clark Audio customer support is great during warranty and out of warranty, even when someone bought their products used from another source. However, the reviews were about a couple of years ago. Does Dan Clark Audio (@Dan Clark) still provide great customer support to this day, in and out of warranty?
While I've never bought stuff from them, it seems, from the feedback on this forum and elsewhere, that that indeed is the case. At DCA they also offer much better QC control than most other brands (looking at you Hifiman), with their TOTL like the Expanse and the Stealth being individually matched for channel balance and so on.
4) Are there other great alternatives that I missed that can be compared very close to the HE1000 V2 or Expanse, objectively and subjectively?
If for alternatives you mean top shelf headphones, yes. There are the HD800s, Audeze's line up (LCD4s and 5s are the direct competitors of Expanse and Stealth, but they do need EQ). Focal's Utopia etc.


EDIT: If you liked Crinacle's ranking, try on Resolve's. I find it more complete and useful cosnidering the ability to EQ:

6) You need a more powerful amp than your current one and preferably balanced as well.
It might do in a pinch I think, but since he is prone to spend that much for a top shelf, it indeed wouldn't hurt getting something like the A90D.
 
Last edited:

srkbear

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The Hifiman HE1000V2 is brilliant (Crinacle ranks them third from the top), but you should wait for the Stealth version to be released stateside—right now it’s only available in Germany and Poland. I’ve auditioned the Dan Clark Expanse, along with the original V2 and the HEKse, the latter of which is HFM’s true TOTL in their oval pad line.

I ended up keeping the HEKse, although I adored the HEKV2 and only passed it by because the HEKse was more resolving—the V2 has a massive soundstage, a very physical sub bass and impeccable highs—for the rock genres I prefer I chose it almost immediately over the DCA. I also bought a pair of Meze Elites over the DCA.

The HEKse is the most detailed headphone I’ve ever heard—the only reason I’m still interested in the V2 is because the HEKse has a slight elevation in the 5-8,000 hz range that might become fatiguing for some.

I said at the time I tried both that if a version of the V2 existed that was anywhere near as detailed as the HEKse, it would be my perfect set of cans without a doubt—and this new Stealth version might actually be that headphone. I’m waiting for it to launch stateside before I give it a listen.

I know that DCA is revered on this site (although I’m not sure how many folks have actually heard them). But I’m a firm believer in auditioning headphones myself before drawing any conclusions, and I had no trouble opting for the HEKse and Meze Elites handily over the Expanse. I can’t speak for the Stealths, but from all I’ve heard they’re tuned very similarly.

Regardless, I would encourage you to find a dealer with a liberal return policy (such as Amazon or Headphones.com) and try them both out for yourself. The one that is right for you should be evident almost immediately, without any squinting to decide if it hits the spot for you. Good luck!
 

oleg87

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Right now you can get a pair of HE6se V2s for $399 at Adorama (normally $1,799).
Beware, this is not the bargain it appears to be, you can very often find them on sale between $550-650.

Though I wouldn't even pay $400 for them myself. Ridiculously inefficient, all sorts of QC horror stories, and nothing about the sound to justify it to my ears. Meh.
 

muslhead

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I have owned the 1kv2's, stealth and currently own the susvara.
i have not owned, nor tried the expanse.
In my subjective opinion, the best value (performance/price) of the 3 i owned, is the 1kv2's (no EQ)
 

Snoopy

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Beware, this is not the bargain it appears to be, you can very often find them on sale between $550-650.

Though I wouldn't even pay $400 for them myself. Ridiculously inefficient, all sorts of QC horror stories, and nothing about the sound to justify it to my ears. Meh.
Exactly the reason why I wouldn't buy a Hifiman headphone to begin with.

OT should get the expanse
 

Rthomas

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Hi everyone. I've been doing a bunch of research and I believe I have finally come down to two high end headphones for my ultimate end game value search.

HIFIMAN HE1000 V2 & Dan Clark Audio Expanse

It looks like I can purchase the HIFIMAN for $2,000 new and the Dan Clark Audio Expanse used for about $3,000.


Current Audio Gear:

JDS Labs Element 3
Ascend Acoustics LX Bookshelf Speakers
Sennheiser HD 560S
Truthear Crinacle Zero IEM


What I am looking for:

A headphone that's true to the source as much as possible with little to no coloration. I would like a pair of headphones that sound as if I'm either there at the recording studio or at a live concert depending on the audio recording.


My Dilemma:

I'm not sure which one to purchase. I do take Amir's input and recommendations very seriously since he's able to provide extensive data to support his claims. If I'm not mistaken, I have not seen Amir mention any audio headphone or IEM that has given him "one of the most transformative experiences” with the exception of the Dan Clark Stealth headphone, giving his “highest praise and recommendation.” From the various reviews and online posts I've read so far, it seems like the Expanse is a minor improvement over the Stealth?

However, Amir has not reviewed the HIFIMAN HE1000 V2 headphones. I am concerned about putting down $2,000 for the HIFIMAN and then have Amir review the headphone and say that he doesn't like it or the headphone performance is mediocre for the price.

On the other hand, if the Dan Clark Expanse is marginally better than the HIFIMAN HE1000 V2, objectively and subjectively, I don't want to pay the extra $1,000.


My Humble Request:

Amir (@amirm) and anyone else here at Audio Science Review, please help me make the most informed decision regarding these two headphones. I've read and watched so many different reviews and I can't seem to pinpoint which headphone would be the ultimate end game value.


My Questions:

1) Someone mentioned that the Dan Clark Audio Expanse measurements are close or even better than the $60,000 Sennheiser HE-1. If that's the case, then the Dan Clark Audio Expanse should sound very similar to the HE-1?

2) Audio reviewer Crinacle gave the HIFIMAN HE1000 V2 an S- grade. His headphone list can be found here. Do you guys think that Crinacle's rating would be a good indicator that the HIFIMAN is a good headphone in comparison to the Dan Clark Expanse?

3) I've heard that the Dan Clark Audio customer support is great during warranty and out of warranty, even when someone bought their products used from another source. However, the reviews were about a couple of years ago. Does Dan Clark Audio (@Dan Clark) still provide great customer support to this day, in and out of warranty?

4) Are there other great alternatives that I missed that can be compared very close to the HE1000 V2 or Expanse, objectively and subjectively?

5) Anyone interested in selling their used Dan Clark Audio Expanse headphones?


I've owned pretty much every flagship except Hifiman so I won't comment on them. I refuse to buy their headphones as I think they're manufactured as cheaply as possible.

Live music is punchy, dynamic and makes you want to tap your toes.

The DCA Stealth loaner that I had at home was a very polite, damped sounding affair. Inoffensive, pleasant and well tuned but boring. Bass simply was not competitive at all with other flagships despite what the measurements say.

My advice to you for ''end game value''

1. Used Sennheiser HD800S - $1000 - Excellent value unless you prioritise bass heavy modern music.
2. Used Focal Utopia with transferable 5 year warranty - Approx $2000 to $2500 - A fun, dynamic, well tuned headphone. Far better than any DCA headphone for enjoying music IMHO.
 

paudio

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I've owned pretty much every flagship except Hifiman so I won't comment on them. I refuse to buy their headphones as I think they're manufactured as cheaply as possible.

Live music is punchy, dynamic and makes you want to tap your toes.

The DCA Stealth loaner that I had at home was a very polite, damped sounding affair. Inoffensive, pleasant and well tuned but boring. Bass simply was not competitive at all with other flagships despite what the measurements say.

My advice to you for ''end game value''

1. Used Sennheiser HD800S - $1000 - Excellent value unless you prioritise bass heavy modern music.
2. Used Focal Utopia with transferable 5 year warranty - Approx $2000 to $2500 - A fun, dynamic, well tuned headphone. Far better than any DCA headphone for enjoying music IMHO.
I live dynamic drivers and have headphones with quite a bit of bass. Despite that one of the standouts for me when auditioning the DCA Aeon Noire was the bass. It was running balanced off a Fiio K7. Is the Stealth that much more polite?
 

oscar_dziki

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Hi mate. After my online purchase of DC expanse, I had some doubts about it and went to a stationary shop and had a long comparison session, especially with HIFIMAN HE1000 V2 in MP3store in Warsaw having the possibility to return expanses. At first glance, HIFIMANS seem airier. Maybe they are. That's about it. Everything else is superior on expanses. No contest. I compared expanses with many high-end headphones that day <- again- no contest. Expanses blew out of the water all the competition. Their speed, dynamics, and tonal accuracy is out of this world. And I bet there are some tracks, where other cans can sound better - those are badly mastered tracks:). Buy Expanses if you can afford it. You will not look back. Even if the future brings something better to the market - I can't imagine Expanses stopping being a quality listen. I'm done. No more buying. I'm happy. And again -> HIFIMAN HE1000 V2 is a good headphone, although in my opinion overpriced because it doesn't sound so much better than some cheaper planars and DCA expanse is just flawless, and jaw-dropping for me time and time again. Especially in A/B testing, and high volumes. God, it loves high volumes....
 

Rthomas

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Please take this hyperbole back to Headfi where it belongs

These kinds of ridiculously over the top statements don’t help anyone.

I’m glad you like your 4000 euro toy , you never need to buy headphones again , congrats
 

oscar_dziki

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Please take this hyperbole back to Headfi where it belongs

These kinds of ridiculously over the top statements don’t help anyone.

I’m glad you like your 4000 euro toy , you never need to buy headphones again , congrats
Bro, thats my subjective impressions from A/B testing. In my 'hyperbole' i said many times 'for me'. There's no reason to be asshole about it.
 

IAtaman

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HIFIMAN HE1000 V2 is a good headphone, although in my opinion overpriced because it doesn't sound so much better than some cheaper planars and DCA expanse is just flawless, and jaw-dropping for me time and time again.
which planars you had in mind when you said HE1000v2 does bot sound so much better?
 

Snoopy

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Bro, thats my subjective impressions from A/B testing. In my 'hyperbole' i said many times 'for me'. There's no reason to be asshole about it.

I think it's a reasonable purchase. You want a headphone that follows the Harman curve, good quality and support costs money.
If Im going to spend over 1-2k on a headphone I won't buy it from a company that I need to publicity shame on Facebook go get some support.
 

luft262

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Hi everyone. I've been doing a bunch of research and I believe I have finally come down to two high end headphones for my ultimate end game value search.

HIFIMAN HE1000 V2 & Dan Clark Audio Expanse

It looks like I can purchase the HIFIMAN for $2,000 new and the Dan Clark Audio Expanse used for about $3,000.


Current Audio Gear:

JDS Labs Element 3
Ascend Acoustics LX Bookshelf Speakers
Sennheiser HD 560S
Truthear Crinacle Zero IEM


What I am looking for:

A headphone that's true to the source as much as possible with little to no coloration. I would like a pair of headphones that sound as if I'm either there at the recording studio or at a live concert depending on the audio recording.


My Dilemma:

I'm not sure which one to purchase. I do take Amir's input and recommendations very seriously since he's able to provide extensive data to support his claims. If I'm not mistaken, I have not seen Amir mention any audio headphone or IEM that has given him "one of the most transformative experiences” with the exception of the Dan Clark Stealth headphone, giving his “highest praise and recommendation.” From the various reviews and online posts I've read so far, it seems like the Expanse is a minor improvement over the Stealth?

However, Amir has not reviewed the HIFIMAN HE1000 V2 headphones. I am concerned about putting down $2,000 for the HIFIMAN and then have Amir review the headphone and say that he doesn't like it or the headphone performance is mediocre for the price.

On the other hand, if the Dan Clark Expanse is marginally better than the HIFIMAN HE1000 V2, objectively and subjectively, I don't want to pay the extra $1,000.


My Humble Request:

Amir (@amirm) and anyone else here at Audio Science Review, please help me make the most informed decision regarding these two headphones. I've read and watched so many different reviews and I can't seem to pinpoint which headphone would be the ultimate end game value.


My Questions:

1) Someone mentioned that the Dan Clark Audio Expanse measurements are close or even better than the $60,000 Sennheiser HE-1. If that's the case, then the Dan Clark Audio Expanse should sound very similar to the HE-1?

2) Audio reviewer Crinacle gave the HIFIMAN HE1000 V2 an S- grade. His headphone list can be found here. Do you guys think that Crinacle's rating would be a good indicator that the HIFIMAN is a good headphone in comparison to the Dan Clark Expanse?

3) I've heard that the Dan Clark Audio customer support is great during warranty and out of warranty, even when someone bought their products used from another source. However, the reviews were about a couple of years ago. Does Dan Clark Audio (@Dan Clark) still provide great customer support to this day, in and out of warranty?

4) Are there other great alternatives that I missed that can be compared very close to the HE1000 V2 or Expanse, objectively and subjectively?

5) Anyone interested in selling their used Dan Clark Audio Expanse headphones?
Based on your other audio purchases it looks like you value spionramas, the Harmon curve, Amir's opinion, etc. So I'd probably just get the Dan Clark's. They are your "end game" headphones after all. If you can't find credible measurements for the HiFiMan's you'd be buying them blind. I'm sure you can EQ them to preference, but you know the Dan Clark's won't need EQ to hit Harmon Curve, for that's worth.
 

asrUser

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