Ultimate 1ET400A Purifi Amplifier sonic shootout - €820 to €8,344

[tmtomh]

For those that listen.......not just measure......I perform mods to Purifi based amps. Every mod I do makes the sound better (believe it or not). For the adventurous: The best Voodoo......I do.

http://tweakaudio.com/EVS-2/Purifi_amp_mods.html

http://tweakaudio.com/EVS-2/Ruminations_on_Class_D.html

Cool. Would be great if you could mod an amp of the same model that Amir has tested and send him your modded version to measure.

 

[Matias]

Cool. Would be great if you could mod an amp of the same model that Amir has tested and send him your modded version to measure.

Yes, would be interesting to see a fully modded Purifi on the APx555. Plus it is a lot of exposure for the product.

 

[Ric Schultz]

None of the mods I do have anything to do with measurements. The amp will measure the same before and after the mods. However, it will be way, way better sounding. I understand that most people who post on this forum don't believe this is possible.

Back in the late 1970s I did a straight wire bypass test on 4 different 7 inch pieces of wire versus a one half inch wire (done in stereo using a master tape of myself playing music). None of the 7 inch wires were even close to the "straight wire"....the results would still be the same today but today's wires are much better so the difference would be much smaller. Of course, this was a listening test......none of the wires would measure anything.

The best measuring instrument for audio is our ears. We hear things that machines just don't register. Maybe over time we will make a machine that can detect all that we hear.

"The first and most basic goal of science is to describe. This goal is achieved by making careful observations." The best way to observe audio is to use your ears.......listen. Once you realize you can trust what you hear......you are in for a fun infinite ride.

 

[vitalii427]

None of the mods I do have anything to do with measurements. The amp will measure the same before and after the mods. However, it will be way, way better sounding. I understand that most people who post on this forum don't believe this is possible.

Back in the late 1970s I did a straight wire bypass test on 4 different 7 inch pieces of wire versus a one half inch wire (done in stereo using a master tape of myself playing music). None of the 7 inch wires were even close to the "straight wire"....the results would still be the same today but today's wires are much better so the difference would be much smaller. Of course, this was a listening test......none of the wires would measure anything.

The best measuring instrument for audio is our ears. We hear things that machines just don't register. Maybe over time we will make a machine that can detect all that we hear.

"The first and most basic goal of science is to describe. This goal is achieved by making careful observations." The best way to observe audio is to use your ears.......listen. Once you realize you can trust what you hear......you are in for a fun infinite ride.

 

[tmtomh]

None of the mods I do have anything to do with measurements.

You do realize that those of us who've been commenting in this thread knew that, right?

Maybe over time we will make a machine that can detect all that we hear.

For the sake of your enterprise, you'd better hope that never happens.

At any rate, I'd recommend you spend your time posting somewhere else because I don't know that you'll get many buyers here, for reasons that appear to be obvious to you already.

 

[March Audio]

None of the mods I do have anything to do with measurements. The amp will measure the same before and after the mods. However, it will be way, way better sounding. I understand that most people who post on this forum don't believe this is possible.

Back in the late 1970s I did a straight wire bypass test on 4 different 7 inch pieces of wire versus a one half inch wire (done in stereo using a master tape of myself playing music). None of the 7 inch wires were even close to the "straight wire"....the results would still be the same today but today's wires are much better so the difference would be much smaller. Of course, this was a listening test......none of the wires would measure anything.

The best measuring instrument for audio is our ears. We hear things that machines just don't register. Maybe over time we will make a machine that can detect all that we hear.

"The first and most basic goal of science is to describe. This goal is achieved by making careful observations." The best way to observe audio is to use your ears.......listen. Once you realize you can trust what you hear......you are in for a fun infinite ride.

 

[March Audio]

None of the mods I do have anything to do with measurements. The amp will measure the same before and after the mods. However, it will be way, way better sounding. I understand that most people who post on this forum don't believe this is possible.

Back in the late 1970s I did a straight wire bypass test on 4 different 7 inch pieces of wire versus a one half inch wire (done in stereo using a master tape of myself playing music). None of the 7 inch wires were even close to the "straight wire"....the results would still be the same today but today's wires are much better so the difference would be much smaller. Of course, this was a listening test......none of the wires would measure anything.

The best measuring instrument for audio is our ears. We hear things that machines just don't register. Maybe over time we will make a machine that can detect all that we hear.

"The first and most basic goal of science is to describe. This goal is achieved by making careful observations." The best way to observe audio is to use your ears.......listen. Once you realize you can trust what you hear......you are in for a fun infinite ride.

Please, please, please send one of your modified amps to Amir for review and test. I would love to see the pictures and the measurements and Amirs subjective opinions.

 

[March Audio]

.

"The first and most basic goal of science is to describe. This goal is achieved by making careful observations." .

OK, in that case can you describe your change to the output inductor. How big an air core inductor have you fitted to match the inductance value and dc resistance of the original? Coil wire csa and physical dimensions.

 

[Ric Schultz]

The inductance is the same as the original...10uh (the same in all the Ncore amps, as well).....so the filter remains the same. The DC resistance of the coil is not so much an issue with Class D and especially Bruno's designs as he has a ton of feedback around the coil.....thus lowering the output impedance mucho. For now, I will let the competition guess as to what I am doing. I may reveal more later. I will say that all coils sound different...no matter what their DC resistance is. Whether it is regular copper, OFC, cryoed, stranded litz, solid core or whatever gauge..and what insulating material is used, damping, etc..........basically everything makes a sonic difference.....including whether you go into the inside of the coil or the outside. You experiment and listen and you will know. The coil is the last thing in the signal path.......the amp will never sound any better than the coil you use. All Class D amps until now used distortion producing (audible but not measurable) ferrite core coils........not good!

 

[PaulD]

distortion producing (audible but not measurable) ferrite core coils........not good!

Provably untrue - EVERYTHING audible can be measured. We can measure to beyond the limits of audibility. This has been referenced so many times on this forum, I am not going to repeat the obvious and proven.

The ONLY hope you have to prove audibility is to conduct a level-matched double blind test. If not, then you are just confirming your biases. It is up to you to prove that this is audible - I say it is not unless the test above is done by a third party.

I would also accept a unit sent to Amir for testing, if it is better then measurements would show it.

 

[March Audio]

The inductance is the same as the original...10uh (the same in all the Ncore amps, as well).....so the filter remains the same. The DC resistance of the coil is not so much an issue with Class D and especially Bruno's designs as he has a ton of feedback around the coil.....thus lowering the output impedance mucho. For now, I will let the competition guess as to what I am doing. I may reveal more later. I will say that all coils sound different...no matter what their DC resistance is. Whether it is regular copper, OFC, cryoed, stranded litz, solid core or whatever gauge..and what insulating material is used, damping, etc..........basically everything makes a sonic difference.....including whether you go into the inside of the coil or the outside. You experiment and listen and you will know. The coil is the last thing in the signal path.......the amp will never sound any better than the coil you use. All Class D amps until now used distortion producing (audible but not measurable) ferrite core coils........not good!

So you have put a much higher DC resistance coil in. OK.

So why didnt Bruno do this if its that simple to improve the sound and DCR doesnt matter?

As i said, please send your modified unit into Amir to be evaluated.

"5. Clean up the power amp output wiring. "Normally" the output power comes off the output coil on the Purifi board and then through the edge connector (what? that silly thing again!?) "

You do realise the feedback sense is after the connector?

"For those that want something even more transparent and dynamic: I just talked to VTV Audio today (8-8-2020) and we discussed using the 3000 watt Hypex power supply for both the Purifi mono blocks and NC1200 mono blocks"

Why would you do that????? Why would you use 3kW PSU with a module that might require 500-600 watts at most?

"No one in the world has ever made an Ncore 500, 1200 or Purifi amp using the 3000 watt supply."

Yeah, there is a good reason for that.

 

[boXem]

For now, I will let the competition guess as to what I am doing.

Guesses? Cool!

Selling hot air?
BSing?
Not having any engineering basis?
Fooling other people?
Fooling yourself?
Trying to guess yourself what you are doing?

Did I get it?

You would have taken a few seconds to actually understand why Bruno uses iron core coils although he knows they have negative effect on sound (easily measurable btw), you would know that air core inductors is a very bad idea for a class d amplifier. Needless to say that the extremely high level of feedback is used to override the drawbacks of iron core.

 

[March Audio]

WTF?????

I have done 9 more mods to the IceEdge molule and added 2 Dark Matter Technologies Cubes to the amp. The sound is really amazing.
https://www.audiogon.com/listings/lis92a1a-dark-matter-technologies-dmt-qube-introductory-pricing-tweaks

This guy is a comedy genius.


To compete we have just implemented the "Stock Cube Enhancer" which provides an instant improvement to any amplifier, a much "beefier" sound

 

[March Audio]

OMG it gets better

You just cannot imagine what this simple inexpensive tweak can do! Our new EVS Ground Enhancers will make any stereo or multichannel system better......I mean much better.....in almost every way. These "accessories" mount on the negative terminal of the speakers, amps and can be used on line level grounds too.

 

[AudioJester]

Ok, iam going to bite. Sury this is an epic gag right?

 

[boXem]

WTF?????

View attachment 78163

I have done 9 more mods to the IceEdge molule and added 2 Dark Matter Technologies Cubes to the amp. The sound is really amazing.
https://www.audiogon.com/listings/l...nologies-dmt-qube-introductory-pricing-tweaks

View attachment 78164

View attachment 78166

This guy is a comedy genius.




To compete we have just implemented the "Stock Cube Enhancer" which provides an instant improvement to any amplifier, a much "beefier" sound

View attachment 78168

s I still have a lot to learn /s

 

[March Audio]

Ok, iam going to bite. Sury this is an epic gag right?

Nope, available at VTV audio

https://vtvamplifier.com/product/mo...ifi-1et400a-module-with-input-buffer-options/

 

[nck045]

To compete we have just implemented the "Stock Cube Enhancer" which provides an instant improvement to any amplifier, a much "beefier" sound

A beef jerky cube that provides a 'meatier' sound.. makes perfect sense to me!

 

[Ric Schultz]

We have on one side of the line the objectivists.....who think that everything can be measured and do not do listening tests (unless they are blind, double blind and of course done by people who have no expectation bias) On the other end of the spectrum you have the complete subjectivists....who listen to everything and believe everything makes a sonic difference......and then there are those in between.....who believe some stuff you can hear but discount some other things they think are too way out there. This is the old game of audio......old as Edison himself. This forum is the "total objectivists" forum. From what I can gather I would say the total objectivists are about maybe 15% of serious audiophiles. However, you guys make a lot of noise for such a minority party. Diyaudio.....has lots of objectivists too....not as many as here. But, if you look at most of all the other forums and online and printed audio magazines.....they are almost entirely subjectivist oriented. Why is this? Are 85% of the people just sheep.....buying voodoo things that make no sonic difference?

What if the subjectivists are correct and you can hear every tiny thing you do? That would be weird, eh?

It really does not matter what anyone believes........I really want everyone to be happy. So, if it makes you happy to believe that only measurements mean something about sound.......then I am happy for you. For your happiness makes me happy......and my happiness makes you happy. That is how the game is set up. Every thought you think and every feeling you have effects the entire planet. Can you dig it?

Enjoy the dance. The evolution of the soul is to go from critic/make wrong/separateness/unhappiness to the sweet make right/accepting/enjoying/togetherness of love and joy. When you point your finger at someone.....three are pointing back at you. You only see your own self in everything. If you totally love yourself.....you love EVERYONE. If you live your life as if every person is your son or daughter......your mother or father......you brother or sister......your lover........WOW!.....what joy and upliftment this gives to everyone.

 

[March Audio]

We have on one side of the line the objectivists.....who think that everything can be measured and do not do listening tests (unless they are blind, double blind and of course done by people who have no expectation bias) On the other end of the spectrum you have the complete subjectivists....who listen to everything and believe everything makes a sonic difference......and then there are those in between.....who believe some stuff you can hear but discount some other things they think are too way out there. This is the old game of audio......old as Edison himself. This forum is the "total objectivists" forum. From what I can gather I would say the total objectivists are about maybe 15% of serious audiophiles. However, you guys make a lot of noise for such a minority party. Diyaudio.....has lots of objectivists too....not as many as here. But, if you look at most of all the other forums and online and printed audio magazines.....they are almost entirely subjectivist oriented. Why is this? Are 85% of the people just sheep.....buying voodoo things that make no sonic difference?

What if the subjectivists are correct and you can hear every tiny thing you do? That would be weird, eh?

It really does not matter what anyone believes........I really want everyone to be happy. So, if it makes you happy to believe that only measurements mean something about sound.......then I am happy for you. For your happiness makes me happy......and my happiness makes you happy. That is how the game is set up. Every thought you think and every feeling you have effects the entire planet. Can you dig it?

Enjoy the dance. The evolution of the soul is to go from critic/make wrong/separateness/unhappiness to the sweet make right/accepting/enjoying/togetherness of love and joy. When you point your finger at someone.....three are pointing back at you. You only see your own self in everything. If you totally love yourself.....you love EVERYONE. If you live your life as if every person is your son or daughter......your mother or father......you brother or sister......your lover........WOW!.....what joy and upliftment this gives to everyone.

Its not about measurements or objectivist or subjectivist. You clearly have no electrical/electronics knowledge and you believe in fairies.

You believe placing a "dark matter" cube on an amp makes it sound better. This is nothing short of "magic crystals" territory.

You are delusional or a con artist.