Hypnotoad
Active Member
So that's why I have to look after him, who looks after you and isn't it way past your bed time? We always say if complaining was an Olympic event he would have more gold than Phelps and Spitz combined.
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Turntables - help me understand the appeal?
- Thread starter dkinric
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So that's why I have to look after him, who looks after you and isn't it way past your bed time? We always say if complaining was an Olympic event he would have more gold than Phelps and Spitz combined.
They fell of the hipster kool fad
They'll grow out of it as their intellectual development progresses and they are less susceptible to peer pressure.
Don't throw a temper tantrum now little guy.So that's why I have to look after him, who looks after you and isn't it way past your bed time? We always say if complaining was an Olympic event he would have more gold than Phelps and Spitz combined.
Hypnotoad
Active Member
You mean like this? I actually don't look at all like Yosemite Sam, I'm much shorter and my mustache is much bigger. It's all good, I'm enjoying the banter.
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https://www.billboard.com/articles/...ord-store-day-historic-week-vinyl-album-sales
"The 12th annual indie music retailer celebration, staged on April 13, helped yield 827,000 vinyl albums sold in the U.S. in the week ending April 18, according to Nielsen Music — a record for Record Store Day week, and the third-largest sales week for vinyl albums since Nielsen Music started tracking sales in 1991."
Go vinyl!
"The 12th annual indie music retailer celebration, staged on April 13, helped yield 827,000 vinyl albums sold in the U.S. in the week ending April 18, according to Nielsen Music — a record for Record Store Day week, and the third-largest sales week for vinyl albums since Nielsen Music started tracking sales in 1991."
Go vinyl!
See link below from the host of a subjectivist forum. He makes the point that it is about the music and it does not make sense to limit one's self to one format as you will be giving up a lot of music choice if you do so. I agree.
https://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/folks-no-need-to-be-so-absolute-regarding-cds-vs-vinyl.62725/
https://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/folks-no-need-to-be-so-absolute-regarding-cds-vs-vinyl.62725/
Hypnotoad
Active Member
That's a common sense approach, but won't appeal to the "I only listen to the best" brigade. To each his own.
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Well, I can see in one sense, yeah, someone who really loves music may want to avail themselves of both formats. But many people's needs are well met by the catalogue on digital. Mine were quite satisfied for decades.
As it happens I've recently done a deep dive in to some obscure stuff only available on vinyl. But it's not like you have to be in to such obscure stuff to be a "real music lover."
While "real music lover" was meant to stir the pot I think if you are a " recorded music enthusiast" there is a lot to be said for having access to digital and "vinyl" formats
For me since I have hundreds of LPs and 4 turntables already the situation is simple, unless I downsize my living space I am fine.
For somebody starting listening to music at a higher quality than little bluetooth speakers/headphones allow it is very expensive to start an LP collection and buy the playing paraphernalia now that it has become a bit of a fashion item. Long gone are the days of 5 LPs for £1.
I am a music lover who likes gadgets and I have a lot of recordings I enjoy for the performance which are not high quality recordings. I have multiple versions of many favourite pieces of music and I would say I tend to listen to the ones of preferred performance more often that the best quality recordings, so the SQ of an LP are not at issue for me, it is adequate to very good in practice.
For me it still seems pointlessly expensive to start buying LPs if you haven't already got a good record player and whilst I still buy the odd second hand LP I have probably only bought 2 new ones in the last 30 years.
For somebody starting listening to music at a higher quality than little bluetooth speakers/headphones allow it is very expensive to start an LP collection and buy the playing paraphernalia now that it has become a bit of a fashion item. Long gone are the days of 5 LPs for £1.
I am a music lover who likes gadgets and I have a lot of recordings I enjoy for the performance which are not high quality recordings. I have multiple versions of many favourite pieces of music and I would say I tend to listen to the ones of preferred performance more often that the best quality recordings, so the SQ of an LP are not at issue for me, it is adequate to very good in practice.
For me it still seems pointlessly expensive to start buying LPs if you haven't already got a good record player and whilst I still buy the odd second hand LP I have probably only bought 2 new ones in the last 30 years.
Hypnotoad
Active Member
I agree, and it also seems pointless to start buying CD's as well if you haven't got a good player when you can cheaply buy a good DAC and get digital downloads. I have only bought a few new LP's over the years, most of what I have I got for a few dollars each used.
I see your point but for me personally there are a couple of reasons I stick to CDs now I have retired. I was an early adopter of digital music files because as a music lover who was travelling somewhere different in the world most weeks the original iPod, which I pre-ordered as soon as I heard about it, was a big step up from a portable player and a case full of recordings (first cassette, later CDs).
Sadly the original standard file structure iTunes introduced was really for pop music, tracks were called "songs" and files sorted by "artist" rather than composer. It didn't make finding stuff I wanted to listen to easy. I ended up putting works into playlists called things like "Mahler 5th Inbal" so I could find them. Re-tagging all the rips, which some patient enthusiasts have done, was beyond my tolerance threshold, so when I retired I largely stopped ripping CDs and whilst I have bought a few recordings as downloadable files not that many.
That is the second reason. I own the CDs, files can't legally be handed to anybody else, though I know that is a law many people break...
I don't like using a phone or tablet as part of my hifi anyway, so CD or LP it is for me most of the time. Thinking about it I probably play LPs and stored music files about equally often. I do stream from Qobuz a bit but since the old computer I run it on isn't within reach it is no more convenient than getting up, choosing a CD and putting it in the player.
TerryO
Member
The Pacific Northwest Audio Society in Seattle has conducted many comparisons over the last 20+ years and Vinyl has always done very well. The CDs have never bested LPs, although digital files have nearly equaled analog LP's. However, R2R Tape such as The Tape Project products (and others) remain well ahead of digital recordings.
restorer-john
Grand Contributor
The differences between CD players are minuscule compared to the yawning performance chasms in vinyl playback systems.
Has anyone investigated the effect of Vinyl vs Polycarbonate on hair follicles?
I bet that guy on the middle right has a (follicle) killer system!
Or maybe it's CDs that do it.
I'd fit right in with the average tonsorial defliction there.
restorer-john
Grand Contributor
Welcome Terry.
I get it. In this thread, you have made it clear (by repeating 3 times) that you think vinyl playback is better than CD or digital. Personally, I believe that is ludicrous.
You are conflating the performance (classical standout performances of old that never made it to CD) with the format available for distribution at the time. My father has around 4000 classical records from the dawn of recording through to modern (1980s) digitally mastered PCM masters and maybe another 2000 CDs from the first releases in 1982 onwards. There is no comparison between a modern digital vs a vinyl record. Across any number of turntables, any cartridge combination you can dream up.
Pick a few standout performances and I'll see if I can borrow the vinyl from him. I'll give you a list of turntables and cartridges I can use, along with a selection of preamplifers and I'll do a careful needle drop recording and provide a link to the wav file. Then perhaps an equivalent CD recording to compare.
As Karajan famously exclaimed when hearing an early demonstration of CD, "All else is gaslight"
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Hypnotoad
Active Member
What about comparing the price of a good CD player that gives similar performance to a much much cheaper DAC?
Also the difference in price of a cheap Cd player and a decent one is huge as well (Ayon CD-35 HF), albeit not as great as some high end turntable/cartridge combinations but then again some spend $50,000.00 on a pair of speaker cables.
The point is it's much cheaper to get into digital files if you don't have either a vinyl or Cd collection.
They wouldn't let me in, I have way too much hair. And maybe their systems are so loud it's blowing their hair away?
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restorer-john
Grand Contributor
The CD player is a complete playback system, a D/A converter is just the back end of it. I've got CD players here that will obliterate many separate D/A converters on the bench on 16/44 content.
The trouble is, there are no longer large ranges of excellent CD players from the majors. There are entry level machines (cheap plastic junk on the whole) and obscenely priced aspirational models (where it all about aesthetics and audiophile buzz words). The high performance, value machines are gone.
The entire market has moved on, not for performance and technical reasons, but for perceived convenience and digital file compatibility from multiple sources. It is unlikely it will ever go back.
Absolutely true. Depending on the content you are buying. It's a bit hard to beat 50c entire classic album CDs at thrift stores however, isn't it?
My issue is, you don't own the files, they can be lost, erased and don't physically exist. CDs by their very nature offer a bulletproof distributed file storage, where if one fails, you don't lose the lot. They are not a target for thieves like your phone/laptop or NAS might be. They are ubiquitous and playable on a billion players across the world. The rights on the discs cannot be rescinded. You can sell them, will them, or give them away- something you cannot do with digital files (apparently legally).
Hypnotoad
Active Member
I wish we had thrift stores around here that sold them for that, even the Salvo's have gone overboard with their pricing and they usually only have some old Barbra Striesand.
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restorer-john
Grand Contributor
They (Salvos/Lifeline/Vinnies etc) sure have gone crazy with prices. Ratty old, mildewed and moth-eaten 1001 strings and German Polka vinyl for $5.
I'm lucky, there is one local church Op-Shop which sells CDs at $1 or half price at 50c. And another that sells them 3 for $2 and sometimes half price. Staffed by volunteer old ladies and all the money goes to local schools and the underprivileged. They price it to move, not to sit on the shelf.
The days of bargain CDs at the big three are gone, all that's left are garos (garage sales) and car boot sales.
