Tube Availability

[anmpr1]

Anyone have knowledge of vacuum tube availability, now that economic sanctions are in the mix? I hadn't thought about it, but Phil McNight brought up the issue in his weekly guitar podcast. Chinese tubes are an option, but who knows how it will go if that situation changes? I bought a couple of Russian Tung Sols last month, and now the price has gone up 20% in the last month. If supplies stop, the tube amp market is going to crash.

 

[Holmz]

... If supplies stop, the tube amp market is going to crash.

^That^ has a ring to it.

 

[mhardy6647]

If supplies stop, the tube amp market is going to crash.

Even I don't worry too much about that in the current climate.

 

[MattHooper]

Yup. I've already seen the price of tubes starting to sky rocket. For instance the commonly available (until now at least) Tungsol output tubes like KT120 and 6550 have shot up, closing on double the price I paid only months ago.

 

[MakeMineVinyl]

This is going to be a mess. I don't know how JJ tube prices are going to go, but I suspect up is the only direction. It would be nice to see a manufacturer establish manufacturing in the U.S. but maybe that's wishful thinking. Electro Harmonix, Tung-Sol, Gold Lion and other types made in Russia may never come back unless the manufacturing equipment can be transported to another country. Fortunately I already have spares to last me through the next Cold War.

 

[SIY]

I'm hoping this is true and I can rake in big bucks from eBay selling off my stock.

/looks up going price for CV1988s.

 

[dfuller]

If this goes on, JJ and Psvane are going to be the only manufacturers left. Who knows, maybe this will allow JJ to beef up their quality control.

It would be nice to see a manufacturer establish manufacturing in the U.S. but maybe that's wishful thinking.

They would be ludicrously expensive, but it would be nice.

 

[anmpr1]

Over at the Secrets of Hi Fi site, Sumit Chawla recently interviewed John Siau, who reported a supply chain problem with silicon. John indicated that several years ago the company had the foresight to stock up on parts, thus in their case parts are not a current problem. Tomorrow? Who knows about that?

FWIW, two years ago I bought their AHB amp and DAC3 preamp. In two years the amplifier price has remained the same. I think the DAC has gone up one hundred dollars. It was good value then, and even better value now, at the same price. I don't follow the new gear market much, so I don't know if other manufacturers have raised prices. Like the grocery store...

 

[anmpr1]

This is going to be a mess. I don't know how JJ tube prices are going to go, but I suspect up is the only direction. It would be nice to see a manufacturer establish manufacturing in the U.S. but maybe that's wishful thinking.

Tubes are really an odd ball thing, but if you need one there's not much else you can do. I've heard digital modeling amps that come pretty close to mimicking an overdriven tube, but no one is really happy about that. At least it's an option for guitarists. For hi-fi? It might be goodbye Charlie.

In any case, I don't ever see a tube factory coming to the US. But anyone's guess is as good as mine.

PS: On his podcast, Phil said he interviewed an amp manufacturer, who told him that before all this, almost half the tubes he sourced were substandard. Take that for what it's worth.

 

[Xulonn]

I just ordered from Vacuum Tube Values (the very same VTV than assemble Hypex amplifiers), a matched quad of the Electro-Harmonix 6CA7. They are an American-designed tetrode (Sylvania developed them in 1969) that was specifically designed to be a substitute for the EL34 pentode. The $75 price is less than the price I found a month ago at another supplier. As I shopped around earlier this evening, I did see that prices are going up at many dealers, and some are already sold out.

I also ordered a pair of Electro-Harmonix 6SN7s for $40 from an eBay seller with a 100% rating. With the stock Chinese tubes that came with my YarLand amplifier as a back-up, I should be o.k. If the Russian invasion of Ukraine settles with Russia backing off, supplies may return fairly soon. If Russia completes the takeover and sanctions continue, it could be quite a while before Russian tubes return to international markets.

(I already have two of NOS GE JAN 5670 tubes that I also bought on eBay - for about $8 each.)

In the meantime, after US inventory depletes, the best remaining options will be JJ from Slovakia, and Shuguang and PSVane from China. Owners with the big new high-power amps using the KT150 will be out of luck, because that is an exclusive TungSol product.

Most people don't realize it, but a lot of tubes are still being made in the 21st century. In 2005, the American owned Electro-Harmonix company in Russia was said to be manufacturing 170,000 tubes per month under about five brand names

 

[Tom C]

300B

Pricey, but it’s the genuine article, made in USA. Head of the present company was Western Electric General Manager of the Kansas City plant back in the day.

 

[anmpr1]

I just ordered from Vacuum Tube Values (the very same VTV than assemble Hypex amplifiers), a matched quad of the Electro-Harmonix 6CA7.

Good news for you. I just checked Tube Depot and they have the following posted:

Sorry, but this product is currently not for sale.​

I surfed over to Mesa Boogie's site, and their 'Premium Mesa' tubes (made in Russia) are listed as 'out of stock'.

I remember Peter Aczel telling Julius Futterman that one of the biggest problems with tube amps is the continued availability of legacy televisions, and the needs of the Russian aerospace industry. Of course he was joking. In a way.

 

[anmpr1]

With the stock Chinese tubes that came with my YarLand amplifier as a back-up, I should be o.k.

I have four 6V6GT Shuguang (I think), but for hi-fi they don't look cool because they use black glass. Upside down in the back of a guitar amp it's not a problem. Tube Depot still has Genalex for sale (with limits on number of purchases). I believe Genalex is a Russian brand. Mullard and Electro, are listed as 'not for sale'. JJ is available with limits on numbers. JJ is Slovak made.

For the hard core, TD sells a '66 NOS 6V6GT Bendix for two hundred and fifty dollars.

Tubes may turn into the next graphics cards. LOL

 

[egellings]

If tube prices get stupid, I'll just get out of audio and find some other affordable interest. My tube amplifiers are home-brew, so they have no resale value at all. I'll gut 'em and sell the transformers.

 

[DonR]

Glad I just received a replacement set from Latvia for my headphone amp. Seems to still be some NOS floating around in the Baltics. When they die I will probably buy some Chinese tubes and then sell it.

 

[MattHooper]

Prices going up almost everywhere, suggestions of availability getting more limited. I just grabbed 8 Tung sol KT120s from an on-line store that hadn't raised it's prices yet. I think I got the last ones. Also grabbed a couple spare NOS Winged C 6550s as back up (as I also NOS Winged Cs in my tube amps).

This is certainly the expensive part in owning monoblocks that take 4 tubes a side!

I've been using a Benchmark LA4 preamp in place of my usual CJ Premier 16 preamp for a while now. I think the tubes issue may help push me towards the decision of keeping the Benchmark and selling the CJ preamp. The darned thing takes 6 tubes so it's really expensive to re-tube, so I wouldn't mind getting that burden off my back.

I also wonder what a dearth of tubes will do to the tube amp market itself as well as second hand market.

big new high-power amps using the KT150 will be out of luck, because that is an exclusive TungSol product.

That would be pretty significant. Many of the newer tube amps, including "flagship" amps from companies like CJ, have been designed around the newer KT150 tubes. They have been the "New Big Thing."

 

[anmpr1]

I also wonder what a dearth of tubes will do to the tube amp market itself as well as second hand market.

The immediate thing will be no 'new' products destined for the pipeline. Why think about marketing a new product, if you can't get the parts to support existing kit? A company like McIntosh can fall back on their SS designs. Not sure about CJ, ARC, and some of the other tube only operations.

The second hand market is already insane. So just expect more of that.

 

[MattHooper]

.

The second hand market is already insane. So just expect more of that.

That's the thing though: If tubes become super scarce I can imagine it scaring people off tube amps, making them harder to sell even in the second hand market.

Would you agree, or do you think somehow the opposite might happen and tube amp prices would go up?

 

[Tom C]

Given the mystique is part of the allure, they will just become more desirable because they are just that much more out of reach.

 

[MattHooper]

Given the mystique is part of the allure, they will just become more desirable because they are just that much more out of reach.

I don't know how they'll have more allure if people are thinking "I can't even get tubes for these things" when I have to replace tubes.