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Trinnov Altitude 16 Review (AV Processor)

Golfx

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You can do that on your SDP-65/75? I know it is available from Trinnov, but when I got my SDP-75 remapping was not included, and I confess I have not looked for it since.
Sorry i have a trinnov
 

Zooqu1ko

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If I decide to buy then the production cost of the hardware is immaterial to me. I'll be paying for the Trinnov magic sauce, which is the software, and I'd be judging that the software is worth the cost, with the support and upgradeability and so forth being a good bonus.
It appears that the comparably low production cost of hardware Trinnov uses results in lower replacement part / repair and upgrade costs relative to AVPs that retail at similar prices, so it might be an advantage after the warranty has run out.
 

Adi777

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Sorry i have a trinnov
Haven't you thought about system with 9 speakers? For example, 9.2.4 or 9.2.6?
I am curious how much is lost using the 7 vs 9 system, as well as 4 Atmos vs 6 speakers.
I have room 4 meter x 6 meter, your is little bit bigger.
 
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hmt

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Good explanation but I expect tongue was in cheek. I can't see how an NFS is worth more than $97,569 myself
That was the intention. The value depends on the user. The Klippel is a tool. For some users the Trinnov also is and it can deliver functionalities you cant get at a lower price point.
 

Frank Dernie

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Far be it from me to debate @Frank Dernie on anything car related, but I understand it differently as well.

The S65 was derived from the S85 V10 used only in the M5, not from one of their 'regular' V8 engines.

"Unlike most other BMW M engines, the S65 and S85 are not related to a regular production BMW engine.[1]

The S65 won the International Engine of the Year award for the 3.0 to 4.0 L category in 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011 and 2012.[2]"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_S65#:~:text=Derived from the,2012.[2]
I stand corrected.
 

sarumbear

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Good explanation but I expect tongue was in cheek. I can't see how an NFS is worth more than $97,569 myself
I assume your definition of a devices value only concerns the cost of the materials it is made of?
 

GXAlan

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The paradox is that remapping is great. Rudimentary “Center Lift” where the front heights are used along with the center channel to create a phantom center at exactly the TV level is why I like Sony and Yamaha AV gear despite the limitations.

I think JBL Synthesis is correct in that remapping is not as good as proper speaker placement. I don’t think anyone with the budget for a SDP-75 is going to be home-brewing their home theater with a mix and match of various speakers and ill positioned speakers. Likewise, since off axis performance is never perfect, remapping can introduce new and different colorations.

Nevertheless, anyone who owned the Sherwood R972 can attest to the value of remapping in any sort of home brew environment. The Sony HT-A9 had gained a lot of positive press for a home theater in a box solution with its sound field, speaker position remapping.

The paradox is that the people who need remapping the most (family room/bedroom home theater setups) are the people least likely to be able to afford a Trinnov enabled product. Those who can afford a Trinnov enabled processor are most likely set up with physical speakers in appropriate locations.
 

sarumbear

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Those who can afford a Trinnov enabled processor are most likely set up with physical speakers in appropriate locations.
That means you will end up redundant speakers as each encoding standing requires different speaker positions.
 

Golfx

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Haven't you thought about system with 9 speakers? For example, 9.2.4 or 9.2.6?
I am curious how much is lost using the 7 vs 9 system, as well as 4 Atmos vs 6 speakers.
I have room 4 meter x 6 meter, your is little bit bigger.
I have ALWAYS thought of adding more of everything=the disease of this addiction.

There is an owners forum for the trinnov. Many posters have thousands of posts under their name and a larger number of speakers in dedicated LARGE home theaters in excess of 20 speakers. To summarize: multiple speakers is desired when there are many rows of seats at different heights to face the screen.

If it is a single home room with only one row of seats then 7.2.4 suffices. Indeed front wides (the +2 in 9) are not used in most codecs or upmixers but some of us cannot stand to NOT have them. I have resisted using a rare trait in our hobby called logic.

Regarding atmos most posters with one row of seats hear little gain from the back atmos (the +2 in 6) speakers. So they stick with top/front speakers and then top middle speakers.

If I was to add speakers right now, it would be another one or two subwoofers to get to a 7.4.4 system. But I would have to get creative in where to put the fourth sub. I’m holding out until Perlisten comes out with their ported subs though. Nothing satisfies like too many subs.
 

Unground

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I assume your definition of a devices value only concerns the cost of the materials it is made of?
No no, quite the contrary. That's the point isn't it? Raw materials or parts cost could be a small part of an item's value.
 

sarumbear

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No no, quite the contrary. That's the point isn't it? Raw materials or parts cost could be a small part of an item's value.
I’m confused. Why have you then said “I can't see how an NFS is worth more than $97,569 myself?”
 

Unground

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I’m confused. Why have you then said “I can't see how an NFS is worth more than $97,569 myself?”
That's less than $2.5k from list price isn't it? I was making the point that anyone can sit their armchair making arbitrary judgements about price and value. Clearly I didn't make the point well enough :). Ignore it.
 

apgood

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I demoed StormAudio but went with Trinnov. The main reason was video switching was slow and glitchy. The UI was excellent indeed but how often does one use it? Once set up I only use my Creston remote. Also, I liked that Trinnov process audio in software.
Yeah I heard the old HDMI board wasn't great. Luckily the current HDMI board is solid. No issues at all and the recently introduced HDMI matrix switching capability is great.
 
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DonH56

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The reason I was able to get a good deal on my refurb SDP-75 a few years ago was that Trinnov was replacing all the video cards. They got caught with other manufacturers in a run of bad video boards (at the time I was aware of the issue before I knew it applied to Trinnov, as it was in various EE trade articles, but do not recall who made the bad chip set now) Supposedly (no way for me to tell) mine was a NIB dealer unit returned just for the video board swap. They recently (end of last year) announced another video board upgrade, but I don't need it and have not bothered. I think there is also an audio board upgrade but again I am OK with my unit as-is. You do pay for HW upgrades and, while much cheaper than a new unit or even new TOTL AVR/AVP from another brand, the HW upgrades are not cheap. Fortunately if you can swap boards in a computer you can make the HW upgrades yourself.

That said, whilst video switching is more reliable than my previous AVP, it still glitches if one source turns off too soon. I need to tweak my Harmony remote settings but HDMI is in general a mess for handshaking (more like hand slapping and see who gets hurt). I have not looked in years now, but pulled the 2.1 spec (I think) and took a look, then pinged some folk who actually knew the spec and worked in the field, because interop was poorly defined and basically left to the users. No wonder so many components don't talk to each other. No idea if it has improved but on-going HDMI issues make me think not.
 

StuartC

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The paradox is that the people who need remapping the most (family room/bedroom home theater setups) are the people least likely to be able to afford a Trinnov enabled product. Those who can afford a Trinnov enabled processor are most likely set up with physical speakers in appropriate locations.
To counter this I would just point out that type and placement of screen could be a very valid reason for wanting to use the speaker remapping function. For instance, someone may be limited due to their residential location (expensive inner city location with no option to extend) and only have a single room for TV/ Films etc. So they may not want to use a projector onto a sonically transparent screen. Hence they go with an eleventy-five inch OLED or similar, but don't want to have the screen above the height of their floorstanders ( I don't particularly like looking upwards at a TV). So they have to use a typical centre speaker below the screen, and thus want to use the remapping function.
 

Fidji

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Haven't you thought about system with 9 speakers? For example, 9.2.4 or 9.2.6?
I am curious how much is lost using the 7 vs 9 system, as well as 4 Atmos vs 6 speakers.
I have room 4 meter x 6 meter, your is little bit bigger.

I have gone from 7.2.4 to 9.5.6 [step by step] - dedicated room 32sqm, 2 seats, 120 in screen.

7.2.4 -> 7.3.4 - big improvement, no brainer [tried both sub-array and single subs calibration]
7.3.4 -> 7.4.4 - need to say - was not expecting to still see really substantial improvement, it was just my urge for symmetry, but I was pleasantly surprised - not that much of FR or whatever improvement - but headroom and this "kick in the stomach" feeling just makes it more enjoyable.
7.4.4 -> 7.4.6 - some improvement, not that big outlay for 2 speakers&Hypex amp, as I use Auromatic upmixer for 5.1 content, it helped and again symmetry improved, sound bubble got more bubblier
7.4.6 -> 7.5.6 - more like "why the f..k not" in the beginning, but after some teething period I have discovered benefits, that are possible with Trinnov Bass Management options, it was a step up. Definitely recommended. Adding headroom is very underrated, but definitely worth it.
7.5.6 -> 9.5.6 -if you have space, then why not. Not too much of native content, but with 3D remapping you can hear the change - screen side just gets bit bigger and "deeper"? for the lack of better description. Do you REALLY need it? No. But why you should leave last 2 channels unused?

I have done also some room treatments improvements during that period [getting it from "very good" to "even better"]

Can you hear 9.5.6 vs 7.2.4. YES. period. Now I can say - if I go to watch movies to the cinema, is not because I am getting better sound than at home.

If I would go further - probably adding more subs, which would require either extension by 8 channels or going MiniDsp route. Now I am putting this on ice, as I wait for the possible Bass Management upgrade. Maybe another 2 height speakers to round it up.
 

Fidji

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Not an apt comparison. Luxury automobile cost is related to the production cost. The Trinnov is not. Most people see value in the automobiles you listed above. On the other hand, most people have never heard of Trinnov. It’s not a Veblen/status symbol good. Plus, Trinnov isn’t pushing the state of the art. Not at $17,000.
Aaah, another one from “value”, “SINAD worse than Topping” brigade. Funny - you mention Trinnov as not being “status” - says more about you, if you consider “status” in any purchase.

But long story short - this and other places on internet are full of people, knowing exactly why they would NOT spend 25k ( in case of Alt32) on Trinnov and it is OK, as it obviously makes them feel better about themselves.

But you would need to search quite a lot, to find somebody actually regretting buying it. Figure that.
 

Billy Budapest

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Aaah, another one from “value”, “SINAD worse than Topping” brigade. Funny - you mention Trinnov as not being “status” - says more about you, if you consider “status” in any purchase.

But long story short - this and other places on internet are full of people, knowing exactly why they would NOT spend 25k ( in case of Alt32) on Trinnov and it is OK, as it obviously makes them feel better about themselves.

But you would need to search quite a lot, to find somebody actually regretting buying it. Figure that.
Not sure where all the defensiveness is coming from.

It seems that no one commenting in this thread has paid list price for their Trinnov units. I think that speaks volumes as to their perceived value at $17,000, or lack thereof.

I’ll be blunt. I make a $#!+ ton of money compared to most people. If *I* don’t see the value in a Trinnov unit, then it’s not about the absolute price. It’s about the utility. There simply isn’t $17,000 worth of utility there. As far as $40,000? Forget it. Like I said earlier, you could hire a live-in AV tech for that amount of cash.
 

Golfx

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Not sure where all the defensiveness is coming from.

It seems that no one commenting in this thread has paid list price for their Trinnov units. I think that speaks volumes as to their perceived value at $17,000, or lack thereof.

I’ll be blunt. I make a $#!+ ton of money compared to most people. If *I* don’t see the value in a Trinnov unit, then it’s not about the absolute price. It’s about the utility. There simply isn’t $17,000 worth of utility there. As far as $40,000? Forget it. Like I said earlier, you could hire a live-in AV tech for that amount of cash.
But you are the one trying to recruit others into thinking like you do? You should be happy that you are a self-contained monopoly of your wisdom.
 

Fidji

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Not sure where all the defensiveness is coming from.

It seems that no one commenting in this thread has paid list price for their Trinnov units. I think that speaks volumes as to their perceived value at $17,000, or lack thereof.

I’ll be blunt. I make a $#!+ ton of money compared to most people. If *I* don’t see the value in a Trinnov unit, then it’s not about the absolute price. It’s about the utility. There simply isn’t $17,000 worth of utility there. As far as $40,000? Forget it. Like I said earlier, you could hire a live-in AV tech for that amount of cash.
Good for you, I am happy for all the charities you give to generously. Although I always believed, that the urge to let the whole world know how much money you make, is somehow limited to guys with thick golden chains around their necks.

Trinnov is not about value, is about getting the best, that is out there. Simple as that. You know - Patek Philippe kind of purchase.
 
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