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Triangle Borea BRO9 vs Elac Debut Reference DFR52

sebdhaese

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Hi, I am new here and I am planning on getting my first stereo system in 15 years. (I had a Luxman amp + Marantz speakers when I was a kid, from an uncle in the music business) I have decided to build myself a stereo/double Hypex NC400 and probably use one of the new Denon AVR's or Topping E30 as a source. The only thing I can not come to a conclusion to is the speakers. First I was thinking the Klipsch RP-8000F, but because I am from Belgium I would actually prefer a European brand (smaller cabinet). The question remains though: French or German?

BRO9's:
- Heavier and slightly larger cabinet
- tweeter, mid and 3 bass drivers
- FQ: 35Hz - 22 KHz (could go without a sub)
- Impedance: min 3.3ohm / average 8ohm (easier to drive)
- Pretty good measurements, going by measurements of BRO3 and BRO8
- Only great reviews
- € 599 (edit)

DFR52's:
- tweeter, mid and 2 bass drivers
- FQ: 42Hz - 35KHz (would need a sub)
- Impedance: min +-2ohm / average 6 ohm (more difficult)
- Very good measurements, going by measurements of DBR62
- Mediocre to super reviews
- € 599 (edit)

I can't really decide and don't have any place close to audition them.
 
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richard12511

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But I would really need sub with the Elacs, that is + €999 and the E30 is also of the table, because I need the AVR to run the sub.

You might be right. Looking at the BRO3 measurements, they look decent, though probably a little less so than the Elacs. The extra 7Hz of extension may be enough to push them ahead without sub support.

Crutchfield has the ELACs, and they have an awesome 60 trial period where you just have to pay for shipping to ship them back($10 for bookshelves and $75 for towers). Would be great to have them both in your room at the same time to compare. Might cost you a little more money, but might be worth it to ensure you're 100% satisfied.

In my opinion, though, both of those arguably need sub support for true full range sound. How likely is it that you'll want to upgrade later by adding subs? If you're likely to get subs in a year or so anyway, it might make sense to go with the speaker that has better mids and highs, even if the bass is a little less satisfying in the meantime. If not, then the Triangles might make sense here.
 

Beave

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You might be right. Looking at the BRO3 measurements, they look decent, though probably a little less so than the Elacs. The extra 7Hz of extension may be enough to push them ahead without sub support.

Crutchfield has the ELACs, and they have an awesome 60 trial period where you just have to pay for shipping to ship them back($10 for bookshelves and $75 for towers). Would be great to have them both in your room at the same time to compare. Might cost you a little more money, but might be worth it to ensure you're 100% satisfied.

In my opinion, though, both of those arguably need sub support for true full range sound. How likely is it that you'll want to upgrade later by adding subs? If you're likely to get subs in a year or so anyway, it might make sense to go with the speaker that has better mids and highs, even if the bass is a little less satisfying in the meantime. If not, then the Triangles might make sense here.

I don't think the $10 return shipping to Crutchfield applies to persons living in Belgium, but I could be wrong. ;)
 
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sebdhaese

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You might be right. Looking at the BRO3 measurements, they look decent, though probably a little less so than the Elacs. The extra 7Hz of extension may be enough to push them ahead without sub support.

Crutchfield has the ELACs, and they have an awesome 60 trial period where you just have to pay for shipping to ship them back($10 for bookshelves and $75 for towers). Would be great to have them both in your room at the same time to compare. Might cost you a little more money, but might be worth it to ensure you're 100% satisfied.

In my opinion, though, both of those arguably need sub support for true full range sound. How likely is it that you'll want to upgrade later by adding subs? If you're likely to get subs in a year or so anyway, it might make sense to go with the speaker that has better mids and highs, even if the bass is a little less satisfying in the meantime. If not, then the Triangles might make sense here.

I am planning to eventually have a surround/atmos system build around those speakers. So the AVR and subs are coming at some point. In that way it makes sense to go for the best mids and highs, as you say.
 
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Don't buy triangle. A guy advertising for the Borea literally said in youtube review that Triangle is paying him so that they can get deeper to the US Market.
 

valerianf

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Triangle is an old speaker brand that has a very good reputation for its speaker.
Triangle has a custom design for the tweeter.
Before choosing between Elac and Triangle you need to go listening to them.
 

Totoro

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I had the Celius 202 for 5 years or so. They had a similar configuration to the Borea. It was a good sound, imho, but I got a decent subwoofer early on, because i felt they needed it.

hope this is at least somewhat helpful.
 
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sebdhaese

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Triangle is an old speaker brand that has a very good reputation for its speaker.
Triangle has a custom design for the tweeter.
Before choosing between Elac and Triangle you need to go listening to them.

The closest place to audition them is over an hour and a half away. It is not really an option for me.
 

Beershaun

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I'm really surprised that the Elacs low frequency extension cuts off at 42hz. I wonder what the measurement parameters were for that (what -DB and % distoration?) The bookshelf little brother DB62 is spec'd down to 44hz and it is a 2-way with one woofer and one port. The Floorstander is a 3 way with 2 bass drivers and 3 ports! So I suspect something is up with those measurements. The bass output on my little DB62's is really good. I can't image that all that extra cabinet, drivers, ports, and crossover only gets you 2hz lower...Anyone seen measurements on the Elac floorstanders?
 

paulraphael

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I'd love to see some Triangle measurements on this site. I have a pair in storage right now (some lower priced tower speakers from 2002). I suspect if I'd known how to eq speakers back then they would have sounded amazing. In practice they were too bright on much of my music. But the dynamics and the soundstaging were like a drug.
 

krott5333

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I'm really surprised that the Elacs low frequency extension cuts off at 42hz. I wonder what the measurement parameters were for that (what -DB and % distoration?) The bookshelf little brother DB62 is spec'd down to 44hz and it is a 2-way with one woofer and one port. The Floorstander is a 3 way with 2 bass drivers and 3 ports! So I suspect something is up with those measurements. The bass output on my little DB62's is really good. I can't image that all that extra cabinet, drivers, ports, and crossover only gets you 2hz lower...Anyone seen measurements on the Elac floorstanders?

Dbr62 uses a 6.5" woofer, dfr52 uses 5.25" woofers.
 

Beershaun

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Dbr62 uses a 6.5" woofer, dfr52 uses 5.25" woofers.
Sure but there are 2 of them handling bass duty and 2 additional ports. It seems like it should be more capable with the additional surface area generating sound.
 

krott5333

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Sure but there are 2 of them handling bass duty and 2 additional ports. It seems like it should be more capable with the additional surface area generating sound.
Wouldn't that just increase output, not how low it can go?
 

Beershaun

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Wouldn't that just increase output, not how low it can go?
Good question on the dual woofers. I don’t know how the low frequency performance is determined for a dual woofer system. I thought the total surface area would indicate the low frequency performance. For the ports they generally increase the spl for a given tuned frequency to extend the response curve lower. So the ports do increase output at a given frequency effectively making the speaker capable of delivering sound at that level without distorting or bottoming out.
 

Overseas

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Just testing a pair of BR09 with Yamaha RN803D, in a 60 sqm, 2.8 m high open living. My objective is to upgrade from 3050i, so looking for 3 ways, even lower but more controlled bass than 3050i, also being the adept of a more 'quantitative' approach on the no & size of woofers (sorry), looking for a 'front port (I have some difficult positions here), high sensitivity, rather 'open' highs but not sibilant. At eur 1k a pair, could not spot any other contender with the same gear, price, badge level, EISA prize, also quite new range launched by Triangle which is an 'assurance' of owning a modern product for the next few years. Overall worth the price, I would say superb sound that grows on you, kind of organic sound that radiates naturally.

Attached my gear, nothing fancy or very advanced.
 

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Overseas

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As for the bass of Borea BR09, these speakers are very critical with poor sources. However, feed them gold and they will deliver diamonds. E. g. JM Jarre, Waiting for Cousteau cd album, Calypso pt. 2 will deliver nothing else than thundering bass right at your feet, controlled and targeted.
 
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