Topping PA5 Review (Amplifier)

[Ciobi69]

I run a Class A SET (2A3 tube) system into efficient speakers. I substituted a small class D amp to see what it would sound like and was very impressed. I would expect the PA5 to do an excellent job.

I should try it, i have an smsl sa300, i know the pa5 is infinitely better,but in the near feature i would like to change my tube amp Soo i could get some money,the only reason I like it because tubes are dope

 

[AudioArchitech]

@topping… (or anyone else) Would like to build a Passive Live Level Crossover filter. Could you provide Input impedance…and any other info needed for this please, thanks : )

 

[qec]

PA5 showed up tonight. Did a quick check of sound and realized that I need to readjust my subwoofer to get everything sounding right. I now have to dial in both my pre amp volume level and that of the PA5 along with the DSP controls on the sub. It was easier with the Adcom 555 amd... Sound measurement mic and software is not on my list of things to get.

 

[0bs3rv3r]

It was easier with the Adcom 555

Why? Because it had no volume control? If that's the problem just set the PA5 to max (or wherever) and ignore it from then on, surely.

 

[mdsimon2]

PA5 showed up tonight. Did a quick check of sound and realized that I need to readjust my subwoofer to get everything sounding right. I now have to dial in both my pre amp volume level and that of the PA5 along with the DSP controls on the sub. It was easier with the Adcom 555 amd... Sound measurement mic and software is not on my list of things to get.

Do you have a multimeter? Pretty easy to measure the gain of the Adcom and then make the necessary level adjustments on your sub DSP based on 19 dB gain of the PA5 at full volume knob position.

Based on specs looks the 555 has a gain of 27 dB so it should be as simple as adjusting your sub down in level by 27 - 19 = 8 dB (assuming PA5 at full volume knob position).

Michael

 

[visekop]

Hi!
I don't understand - does it have a standby mode (power saving)?
If yes, how does it turn on? Without a signal, it warms up all night just like at maximum volume.

 

[gomar]

Hi guys,

my KEF LS50 wireless speakers broke 1 month after the warranty expired.. I'm never buying active speakers again!
Just ordered their Q950 towers to get some more bass for home cinema.

Would this amplifier be powerful enough to get a good bass sound out of a tower?
Their specified sensitivity is 91dB (2.83V/1m).

I'm in love with my D90/A90 stack for headphone use, and this looks to be another gem from Topping.
Would be incredible to not have to repair the pot on my old 30kg 1993 Yamaha DSP A-1000, that monster doesn't even fit in my media console.

 

[Gio]

Hi!
I don't understand - does it have a standby mode (power saving)?
If yes, how does it turn on? Without a signal, it warms up all night just like at maximum volume.

Why would you want to leave it on stand-by? turning it off is that simple, you save energy and the equipment lasts longer

 

[SaltyCDogg]

Hi guys,

my KEF LS50 wireless speakers broke 1 month after the warranty expired.. I'm never buying active speakers again!
Just ordered their Q950 towers to get some more bass for home cinema.

Would this amplifier be powerful enough to get a good bass sound out of a tower?
Their specified sensitivity is 91dB (2.83V/1m).

I'm in love with my D90/A90 stack for headphone use, and this looks to be another gem from Topping.
Would be incredible to not have to repair the pot on my old 30kg 1993 Yamaha DSP A-1000, that monster doesn't even fit in my media console.

It should be, assuming your listening room isn't very large and you don't like to drive them to deafening levels.

 

[IPunchCholla]

Sorry. I was just going off you statement “Now go out to clipping, which we'll just call 80W. THD+N has risen to about .08%. It's impossible to tell whether that is THD or N, since if there is distortion which is not harmonic, it would show up as N.”

And I fully grant your knowledge of this is greater than mine. But if I understand this correctly, that measurement is a 15kHZ tone across power. Meaning the distortion is measured for a 15kHZ tone at 80 watts? I get pursuit of perfection. And I will grant this amp isn’t perfect. What it is, is very clean under the conditions it was designed to function under.

Given my 1kHZ tone max for my loud listening levels was 2.3 volts, I can’t imagine any music I listen to having even 15 kHZ transients that came anywhere close to the 25+ volts need to get 80 watts on my speakers (especially since maxed out I could only get the amp to produce 24 volts). Given the two tone tests now posted I’m even less worried. Any issues this amp displays for my current listening situation are dwarfed by my speaker and room issues, so I’ll go back to working on those. And try not to listen to tracks of just cymbals with the amp maxed out.

When those are fixed. I’ll worry about 15kHZ distortion that I would likely to both need the amp maxed out and for me to be listening for flaws in transients.

 

[ryanmh1]

Ok so at this point despite pma or restorer john or ryanmh1 bringing the same point up, we don't need 5w+ testing at 19+20khz for pa5. This is settled? Can we agree and move on and not randomly bring it up a week later?

Settled? No. Something is never settled unless its tested.

I can understand the reservations about 20kHz harmonics being inaudible. They are. And the concerns about high power 19kHZ+20kHz being realistic to program. It isn't. But to prove the known flags for IMD do not actually cause IMD, just test more! Admittedly, we know a lot more about what bad 20kHz signals with standard AB amps than we do with various Class D designs. So, do a twin tone test using a 9kHz and and 11kHz tone or 7kHz and 13kHz at 5W and 50W and see what 2nd/3rd/4th order stuff pops up (thus avoiding the gripes about the 19kHz/20kHZ twin tone putting all the hash in the "inaudible" range). Better yet, do a power sweep. Restrict test bandwidth to 20kHz. Fine. Topping could do this and post it. If it is without fault, case closed. If not, test a purifi, benchmark, an aiyima, and a class AB with two pole compensation, and another standard Miller compensation AB. If Topping wins the whole thing, I would not be surprised to see 100 more orders get placed, since literally everything just got hammered by Topping's little Class D composite amp, or whatever the thing is.

If you really want subjectivists or objectivist skeptics to shut up, you need to deal with the problems that have already been measured, or stop making claims about how much better an amp with .1% measured THD at 20kHz is since we know that can cause problems. It's on Topping to prove it doesn't. Or you can just ignore the technical insights of the people on this forum who understand enough to raise these questions. Ignoring it isn't exactly "sciencey" and all. I suppose it does work for a lot of the subjectivist rags, though, so why not...

(Fair question: Is this too high a standard? Arguably. But when Benchmark did what they did, the product got tested heavily as well...)

 

[antcollinet]

Jesus - give it a rest.

 

[BoredErica]

This is an obsession and not healthy. You will never be satisfied.

 

[ModDIY]

Ha ha !!!

 

[whazzup]

Settled? No. Something is never settled unless its tested.

I can understand the reservations about 20kHz harmonics being inaudible. They are. And the concerns about high power 19kHZ+20kHz being realistic to program. It isn't. But to prove the known flags for IMD do not actually cause IMD, just test more! Admittedly, we know a lot more about what bad 20kHz signals with standard AB amps than we do with various Class D designs. So, do a twin tone test using a 9kHz and and 11kHz tone or 7kHz and 13kHz at 5W and 50W and see what 2nd/3rd/4th order stuff pops up (thus avoiding the gripes about the 19kHz/20kHZ twin tone putting all the hash in the "inaudible" range). Better yet, do a power sweep. Restrict test bandwidth to 20kHz. Fine. Topping could do this and post it. If it is without fault, case closed. If not, test a purifi, benchmark, an aiyima, and a class AB with two pole compensation, and another standard Miller compensation AB. If Topping wins the whole thing, I would not be surprised to see 100 more orders get placed, since literally everything just got hammered by Topping's little Class D composite amp, or whatever the thing is.

If you really want subjectivists or objectivist skeptics to shut up, you need to deal with the problems that have already been measured, or stop making claims about how much better an amp with .1% measured THD at 20kHz is since we know that can cause problems. It's on Topping to prove it doesn't. Or you can just ignore the technical insights of the people on this forum who understand enough to raise these questions. Ignoring it isn't exactly "sciencey" and all. I suppose it does work for a lot of the subjectivist rags, though, so why not...

(Fair question: Is this too high a standard? Arguably. But when Benchmark did what they did, the product got tested heavily as well...)

Cool~~

You should really discuss with Amir how much you'll be donating to get these important tests done. Seems to mean a lot to you.

Similarly, while Topping probably has achieved their product design and marketing goals with the current measurement data, I'm sure they'll talk to you if you want to pay them for additional tests.

 

[Walter]

This is an obsession and not healthy. You will never be satisfied.

"The path to my fixed purpose is laid with iron rails, whereon my soul is grooved to run."

 

[gfinlays]

Settled? No. Something is never settled unless its tested.

I can understand the reservations about 20kHz harmonics being inaudible. They are. And the concerns about high power 19kHZ+20kHz being realistic to program. It isn't. But to prove the known flags for IMD do not actually cause IMD, just test more! Admittedly, we know a lot more about what bad 20kHz signals with standard AB amps than we do with various Class D designs. So, do a twin tone test using a 9kHz and and 11kHz tone or 7kHz and 13kHz at 5W and 50W and see what 2nd/3rd/4th order stuff pops up (thus avoiding the gripes about the 19kHz/20kHZ twin tone putting all the hash in the "inaudible" range). Better yet, do a power sweep. Restrict test bandwidth to 20kHz. Fine. Topping could do this and post it. If it is without fault, case closed. If not, test a purifi, benchmark, an aiyima, and a class AB with two pole compensation, and another standard Miller compensation AB. If Topping wins the whole thing, I would not be surprised to see 100 more orders get placed, since literally everything just got hammered by Topping's little Class D composite amp, or whatever the thing is.

If you really want subjectivists or objectivist skeptics to shut up, you need to deal with the problems that have already been measured, or stop making claims about how much better an amp with .1% measured THD at 20kHz is since we know that can cause problems. It's on Topping to prove it doesn't. Or you can just ignore the technical insights of the people on this forum who understand enough to raise these questions. Ignoring it isn't exactly "sciencey" and all. I suppose it does work for a lot of the subjectivist rags, though, so why not...

(Fair question: Is this too high a standard? Arguably. But when Benchmark did what they did, the product got tested heavily as well...)

Yup, the Benchmark AHB2 costs > 10x the cost of the PA5 and is aimed at a different market (primarily pro-audio which is why they offer 19" rack mount options), so yes, it was heavily tested.

If you're so perturbed by your perceived potential performance issues with the PA5, then why not buy one and test it yourself?

I, like many of the others here, am satisfied with mine. Not had a chance to listen to it back to back with my AHB2 - need to make up some XLR/TRS cables, so I can listen to them both with the same DAC (Topping DX7Pro). I'm also putting together a mahoossive dummy load (225W/8 ohm, 300W/6ohm, 450W/4 ohm) to test them both with REW and to properly test my DK VS.1 Signature MK3 (which is why I need such a hefty dummy load).

 

[Fritz]

Hi there,
I have a simple question. I ordered a PA5 and an E50. Not yet arrived, but once hooked up together should I run the E50 in preamp-mode and dial it down so the PA5 gets an input maximum of 2.5 volt (and not 4 volt) input? Does that matter?

 

[gfinlays]

Hi there,
I have a simple question. I ordered a PA5 and an E50. Not yet arrived, but once hooked up together should I run the E50 in preamp-mode and dial it down so the PA5 gets an input maximum of 2.5 volt (and not 4 volt) input? Does that matter?

The best thing to do is run the E50 in fixed output mode and feed a balanced 4V to the PA5. The E50's SINAD will be optimised this way and you also avoid digital attenuation of the signal going to the PA5.

 

[Fritz]

Thanks for the quick answer. On the side of the PA5 that would only mean it doesn't have to work as hard (eg volume knob at 11am not at 3pm)?