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Topping M62 thread

been messing with it for several days, works well and measures well. am confident enough to take it into the field this weekend. will report back with more data when i have time. its a clever interface with lots of tricks due to its good routing
 
outstanding results when compared with Benchmark ADC1 and RME Fireface UCXII. All measurements except loopback fed from a Topping D90SE. Loopback from the headphone out back to the 3.5mm aux in was excellent as well around 111dB. couldnt determine if the limiting factor was the output or the input, as when i tested the aux-in with the topping it was lower than it shoulda been, i guess I need better unbalanced cables in my apparently noisy room
 

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some battery test results
powering 2 mics with P48 and taking 2 line-in channels on aux in, dumping 4 ch to iphone and another 2 ch mix to separate iphone

the M62 went about 6.5 houirs
the iphone (brand new 16e) pulling 4 channels was still at 54% battery
other iphone taking the 2 OTG channels is an old beater and battery performance is not worth analyzing
 
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I bought one also. Seems pretty good. It would have been nice to have a Guitar DI input though, and digital i/o like optical or something as then it could be used as a standalone mic preamp or headphone output with a larger system.

Perhaps a desktop version like that could be a future idea. I had a Topping E8x8 but the analog mic preamp knobs and analog volume knobs for speakers and headphones I don't like on any interface - as there's gain bunching/can't match mics. (I'll also throw in I wish that it had the ability to control the volume of the adat output on the E8x8 for digital speakers - as there's a lack of interfaces that have that ability for speakers like Neumann KH120 II's)

I personally have no use for the OTG aspect - not sure how many people do - as it's not really a feature on other recording gear from other companies. (I was hoping I could hook up a DAC or something to that USB port for a digital output - but it didn't work)

The remote control - I think is a nice aspect: I really think all recording interfaces should have a remote or ability to use a remote.
 
i was hoping that i could gang two units together via OTG but i guess they both act as clients not hosts - no connectivity to be had
 
The M62 appears to be intended mainly for mobile use by musicians, streamers, and podcasters,[1] but I have been using it in a minimal home office setup for Zoom meetings for almost two months now:
  • Headphones with an external microphone connected to the HP input (TRRS), which acts as IN1
  • Charging/discharging disabled on both the OTG USB-C port and the data USB-C port, so only the dedicated "Charge" USB-C port is used for power
  • The USB-C data port is connected to a USB isolator, which feeds into a USB hub with individual on/off switches. This hub is connected to a KVM switch, which in turn is connected to both a laptop and a desktop computer. The "Charge" USB-C port is connected to an external AC/DC power adapter
  • The "Pro Audio Mode" is enabled
  • In M Control Center, all inputs are muted except IN1 and IN2 (IN2 is enabled only because otherwise an LED on the M62 would flash unnecessarily)
  • All mixers are removed
  • All loopbacks are routed to an empty mixer and muted
  • Bluetooth is disabled
  • The OTG output is still set to IN1; otherwise, no input level meters are shown on the M62 display
  • The HP output is configured with a 10-band PEQ (oratory1990) itself, because the laptop and desktop run different versions of PipeWire, and I only configured filter chains on the desktop. Nevertheless, I created these two virtual devices on both systems to simplify audio routing and avoid unnecessary channel remapping:
    Code:
        {                    
            name = libpipewire-module-loopback
            flags = [ nofail ]
            args = {
                node.name = "sink.topping_m62_stereo"
                node.description = "Topping M62 Stereo Output"
                media.name = "Topping M62 Stereo Output"
                audio.position = [ FL FR ]
                capture.props = {
                    media.class = Audio/Sink
                }
                playback.props = {
                    stream.dont-remix = true
                    node.passive = true
                    target.object = "alsa_output.usb-Topping_M62-00.multichannel-output"
                }
            }
        }
        {  
            name = libpipewire-module-loopback
            flags = [ nofail ]
            args = {
                node.name = "source.topping_m62_mono"
                node.description = "Topping M62 Mic (Mono)"
                media.name = "Topping M62 Mic (Mono)"
                capture.props = {
                    audio.position = [ AUX0 ]
                    stream.dont-remix = true
                    node.passive = true
                    target.object = "alsa_input.usb-Topping_M62-00.multichannel-input"
                }
                playback.props = {
                    media.class = Audio/Source
                    audio.position = [ MONO ]
                }
            }
        }
  • Zoom receives the dry input signal, while I leave DSP processing to Zoom
  • I mainly use the remote control standby/wake state, adjust headphone volume, and mute the microphone
What I like most is that the M62 takes up very little desk space and is very easy to set up and remove. The downside of my use case is that the M62 remains powered and connected to the power supply all day, which is probably not ideal for long-term battery health. The USB hub and KVM switch setup is also somewhat suboptimal in terms of simplicity and potential points of failure.

[1] See the "Core Positioning" section on https://www.topping.store/products/topping-professional-m62-next-gen-portable-audio-interface
 
my use case is completely different but ive found the same - you basically need to configure it specific to your needs and then save the config to the device so the settings are persisitent

i too enable 'pro audio mode' because it disables all effects which i dont need

my current setup is:
balanced inputs thru mic ins + stereo balanced input to aux
4 channels out thru USB-C to iphone (not OTG which only offers 2 channels)
charging/discharging disabled on both USB-C/OTG ports
OTG out is either ch 1/2 or ch 3/4 depending
aux out is a backup of 4 channels into 2 (1+2 summed to mono as left channel and 3+4 summed to mono as right) - not ideal but adequate for my purpose in the rare event i need to use the backup. a different strategy would be ch 1&2 as otg out and ch 3&4 as aux out. but that would require another phone

in general its a real solid device once i figured it out. sound is superb and with proper order of operations starting from a powered-off state it is 100% reliable. only failures in testing were self inflicted (phone ran out of space, files too large, airplane mode wasnt on and somebody called, etc). all are correctable and in practice im typically using a dedi phone that doesnt even have a sim installed
 
its in here by itself and with some dedicated preamps in front of it, can you find it?

 
the unit failed me in the field for the first time the other day. i was only running two channels instead of my usual four and wanted to change up the HP out routing from dual mono backups of CH1,2,3,4 to stereo backup of ch 1,2

so i booted into windows 10, hooked it up and downloaded what i thought was a good profile to the device. but i get in the field and boot it up and its acting weird. part of it could have been user error because it was full sun and LEDs were washed out. in any case it was locked up somehow and i couldn't get phantom on.

so i looked up on my phone how to do a 'factory reset'* (which isnt really a reset, more on that later). BUT this put it back into "mobile mode" and i forgot that sums all inputs and dumps out mono channels to usb and HP... so i walked away with a mono recording after lugging a stereo mic setup into the field. not a total loss but disappointing

so upon discovering this at home later on, i spent a few hours learning how to get it into a usable state from factory reset in the event this happens again

how to do it:
1. turn off device (if you can... longpress doesnt work when its frozen. in the field i was able to trick it out of its locked state by applying power to the charge port... have been unable to reproduce the bug at home)
2. wait at least 5 sec and hold down both HP volume buttons and boot. all 4 rows of level LEDs should light.**
3. let it boot thru, 10 sec or so
4. turn off and hold down SEL while booting. it should boot up with two lights on the level meter. this is 'mobile mode' so press SEL twice to get to six lights lit (pro mode). then hold down power button to fully boot in
5. in some cases behavior is still unpredictable (again not a real factory reset*), and you may need to boot through once or twice again

what this accomplishes
Good: MIC1, MIC2, and stereo aux in are correctly mapped to USB channels 1,2,3 and 4 and recordable via a phone
Bad: HP out is a mix of the four inputs, ch 1+3 on left and 2+4 on right. so if youre looking to route/back up something in a different manner, you are out of luck until you can get to a computer and correct the routing
Also bad (IMO/for my use case): USB-C power is reset to "charging". this makes my phone freak out because it cant provide enough power. clicking thru the error seems to clear it and it still records, but its unsettling.
Also bad, (IMO): display is reset from 'bright' to 'normal'
also bad (IMO): OTG is sent a mono mix of the channels, similar to the HP out

footnotes from above:
* 'factory reset' seems to be a misnomer as not all settings are rest, and often after a 'factory reset' teh unit is in an unpredictable state likely related to its state before reset. a true' factory reset' would restore th unit to a predictable state every time

**in some cases i saw only three rows of lights light up on reset, not sure if this is a bug or some hidden feature

below is a copy of the email i sent to topping support. If anyone here has an ear of actual topping engineers, please forward this to them. everytime i contact support i get the most useless first-level responses. like after sending the email copied below they literally sent me a picture from the manual showing the keys sequence for a factory reset, and claimed that the effects don't exist in pro mode by showing me a screen shot of the M control center where they are absent (I was talking about enabling the effects on the device itself)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

some bugs to report. Please forward to the engineer responsible for the device firmware:

-reverb and noise reduction are still selectable on device in pro audio mode when they should be disabled. too easy to accidentally turn them on with the buttons, they need to be permanently disabled in pro-audio mode

-factory reset doesnt reset all settings (testable by leaving P48 on or off on one or both channels)

-device hangs sometimes when not connected to computer, requiring reset

-in pro audio mode, device doesnt see mic input until usb-c is connected


feature requests:

1. better default operation for field use

why: many people wish to use device in the field without a computer. this is only really possible when device is configured via M Control Center. Device can be buggy and unpredictable and randomly become unresponsive in the field. It would be preferred to have the device be able to be factory reset in the field and usable without a computer. the 'mobile mode' is useless for stereo recording as it mixes all inputs to mono outputs on OTG and USB. Preferred default routing would have mic 1+2 output as a stereo pair on OTG, or USB out 1+2

2. default charging state for usb-c should be 'off' upon factory reset

why: when resetting the device in field the default is 'charging', and connecting a phone causes an error 'Cannot use accessory this device uses too much power'

3. touch lock indication is indeterminate

touch lock on and touch lock off are both indicated by a double blink, so a user never knows if it is on or off


------------------------------------
addl thoughts since i first sent that email:
-a useful feature would be to change the battery indication to numerically indicate the battery level on the multi-segment meters instead of the vague ring LED where you really cant distinguish 30% from 70% for example

-figure out a way to hard code keypress sequences for the missing functions that don't exist on the device itself (brightness, USB-C power state, OTG power state, etc). Yes i do realize these are programmable for the multi-function power button, but again, they are wiped if the device is 'factory reset' in the field, with no way to reset absent a remote or computer

-change blue indication on IN1/2 to actually indicate low level signal, say -40dB or whatever. As of now it indicates "something is plugged in" which isnt really useful at all

-some way to load profiles/device configuration from a phone and not requiring a separate windows computer. these profiles are apparently backup/exportable from M Contol Center so put them in a phone app or allow them to be loaded from an OTG thumb drive or something

-a phone app itself would solve many of the problems above and make the device more usable

all of the above should be correctable in firmware, the following suggestions are hardware suggestions for the next generation of the unit:

-add switchable 5V power to the aux in. the 2.5V on mic3.5 in doesnt power many mics adequately (and is only one channel)
-make OTG port configurable to be full USB out, with multichannel, not just 2 channel OTG in/out
-make BT input LDAC
-ability to take 2-channel SPDIF/AES input. "Mic-3.5" input could be switchable to take spdif in as you only need 2 terminals
-ability to gang two units (via OTG to OTG or USB-C to OTG) to allow for more channels out of the free USB-C port, all synched to same clock
-more generally, allow OTG input to be a host and actually use OTG/native USB audio devices for input (like a second M62 as described above, or other mobile native usb devices like for example Rode AI-micro or DPA MMA-A)
 
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my newest preferred setup is
mic 1/2 input routed directly to OTG out
mic 3/4 input routed directly to HP out

advantages:
either or both stereo pair can be recorded USB out to a phone in which case the OTG out and HP out are effectively backup routes if needed
routing the mic in to OTG allows full use of level meters on the left
routing the aux in allows full use of the segmented level meters on the right

it would be an easy swap in config to send the mic 1/2 input to HP out (and aux in to OTG) if that was preferable for a backup
 
I was doing some more measurements to try to optimize my gain staging and discovered that the unit switches/pads internally between +18 and +19dB gain on the mic input. see the attached pdf which is the RMAA results from -12 to -9dBU input, each at +18 and +19 dB of gain on the mic-in

so if you are one of the fortunate people who can get away with running gain just over +19 dB instead of under, you gain up to 10 dB of headroom.

this is kinda similar to the zoom units which have a max input of +4dBU and put a 20 dB pad on top when switched to 'line in'

unfortunately for me my schoeps CMC1 mics are kinda hot and Ive exceeded the +10 dBU max input level with as little as +15dB of gain on the mic -in in some cases

its still putting up really respectable numbers, but im kinda stuck in the 'elbow' with that setup. but i have other mics that have slightly less output i can maybe switch around

one thing i did suspect, apart from that switch between +18/+19dB, like many modern recorders, gain staging isn't really doing anything to buy headroom. See the attached jpg of RMAA results with -32dB input. notice that the results are identical with gain set to any number below 19, and also essentailly identical for any number set above 19. In this case the 39/29/19/9/0 "vol" is just the amount of dB i had to normalize in post to get RMAA to analyze the file. so riding levels isnt really doing anything
 

Attachments

  • M62PreampShelf.pdf
    M62PreampShelf.pdf
    1 MB · Views: 12
  • 32dbu.jpg
    32dbu.jpg
    59.5 KB · Views: 15
unbalanced measurements were stellar. This is what i was talking about in this thread

118 dB dynamic range at 1V / +2 dBu makes this input essentially as clean as any for people with mic/ low level line signals. Eliminates the need for a mic preamp stage in many cases
 

Attachments

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outstanding results when compared with Benchmark ADC1 and RME Fireface UCXII. All measurements except loopback fed from a Topping D90SE. Loopback from the headphone out back to the 3.5mm aux in was excellent as well around 111dB. couldnt determine if the limiting factor was the output or the input, as when i tested the aux-in with the topping it was lower than it shoulda been, i guess I need better unbalanced cables in my apparently noisy room
unbalanced measurements suffered in my case by using two USB devices (D90SE on the DAC and M62 as ADC) connected to the same computer which created ground noise with the unbalanced connection. The excellent unbalanced measurements above were achieved by recording from the M62 to a separate phone instead of back to the computer. The 111dB dynamic range measured in the older loopback tests was a result of the +16dBu HP output needing to be reduced to +2dBu to not overload the aux in
 
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