Topping E70 Velvet (AKM 4499EX)

[dlt123me]

So I've been thinking about my upcoming comparison between the E70 pair. I will start a separate thread when I have completed the comparison but wanted some help setting it up. Here are the relevant details and my questions...

The Setup

Components:

• PiCorePlayer with embedded LMS on 2GB Raspberry Pi 4
• USB A male to USB A female splitter cable
• Identical USB A to USB B cables
• Topping E70 & Topping E70 Velvet both set to DAC mode, 4V output and default filter
• Identical XLR cables
• Benchmark HPA-4 preamp / headphone amp
• Audeze LCD-3 headphones or ICEpower monoblock amps through Von Schweikert VR-5 Anniversary speakers

I will use oratory1990 headphone equalization and REW speaker equalization throughout. Equalization is performed on the LMS using SOX. Comparison will be performed with a set of songs I know well; I may use the same set I used for my headphone comparison.

Level Matched:
This is where I need help. I have a multimeter, a Radio Shack handheld sound level meter, and pink and white noise FLAC files. I was planning to check voltages on the USB cables and sound levels through my speakers. What is the best recommendation for level matching?

Blind:
I will have my son connect the DAC USB cables and XLR cables between the DACs and HPA-4. The DACs will not be visible to me, and I will switch between the two HPA-4 inputs. Switching should be nearly instantaneous. I will have control of the HPA-4 remote and will switch between the two inputs at will. Only after I have completed the comparison will I look to see which DAC is connected to which input. How many trials should I run?

Any other comments or recommendations?

Thanks,
Martin

Martin, I'm considering one of these units. Please post in this thread when you start the new thread... I'm new here and will keep this thread up till you start the new one.

Thanks,
Dennis

 

[Snoopy]

The SMSL DO300 could be interesting in comparison with the E70Velvet.
they both cost around 500 euro in the EU.

The DO300 uses the 1 x ESS9039 pro. Chip.

but the DO300 supports MQA for those that need it / want it.
The E70 Velvet doesn't seem to support MQA?

only downside to the E70 velvet seems to be the DSD cutoff frequency of 19khz. that's really low for DSD. so if you want more than that you have to upsample to higher DSD rates.

I wonder how the parts inside the dac used compare.. has one a better power supply, shielding op-amps and all that audiophile stuff.

 

[Burns]

The SMSL DO300 could be interesting in comparison with the E70Velvet.
they both cost around 500 euro in the EU.

The DO300 uses the 1 x ESS9039 pro. Chip.

but the DO300 supports MQA for those that need it / want it.
The E70 Velvet doesn't seem to support MQA?

only downside to the E70 velvet seems to be the DSD cutoff frequency of 19khz. that's really low for DSD. so if you want more than that you have to upsample to higher DSD rates.

I wonder how the parts inside the dac used compare.. has one a better power supply, shielding op-amps and all that audiophile stuff.

SMSL ( S.M.S.L ) DO300 DAC

I bought SMSL DO300 and I think I became its beta tester. - The device in the factory settings is +2dB by default, - the default filter is fast linear, but more importantly, when the filters are turned off, the volume increases drastically and the sound becomes hoarse (Is there jitter...

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[Music1969]

View attachment 262199

This is the answer that Topping for the DSD filters of the Topping E70 Velvet gave me:

Hi,

We have investigated clearly, is the preparation of the manual colleagues made a mistake, resulting in the manual is wrongly written, DSD filter only one, and not two as written in the manual.
Thank you very much for your feedback, we will arrange to amend the manual as soon as possible!

We are sorry for any inconvenience this may have caused you.

Best Regards


Hi,

Yes, you are right. DSD filter is only a fixed one, can not switch to choose, so there will be no DSD filter settings in the settings menu, when playing DSD press the remote filter button (FIR) will not respond, because there is only one DSD filter, does not provide a choice.

If you need it, I will send you the new manual when it comes out, but it is not much different from the previous one, only the DSD filter settings have been deleted.

Best Regards

For me the Topping E70 Velvet sounds very good and works very well and I have tried it with any type of audio file, and when switching frequencies there is no crackle, sadly Topping wrote the wrong manual on filters DSD, which would have been 2 filters, while it is only one and it is fixed.
Topping unfortunately did not notice this error and I made it clear to us through an email , and these you read above were the answers that Topping gave me .

I looked at the manual now and there is no mention of DSD filter settings.

Or even how to activate DSD Direct mode - is there even such a mode with E70V ?

 

[Snoopy]

I looked at the manual now and there is no mention of DSD filter settings.

Or even how to activate DSD Direct mode - is there even such a mode with E70V ?

There are no DSD filters.. the cutoff frequency depends on the the DSD samplerate (DSD64, 128, 256, 512).

For DSD to work you need to put the DAC into fixed volume mode anyway.

 

[bogi]

Or even how to activate DSD Direct mode - is there even such a mode with E70V ?

Like with DSD filter - if there is only one option, there is no reason for a setting. If it works only on fixed volume it indicates direct DSD as the only option.

 

[Music1969]

There are no DSD filters.. the cutoff frequency depends on the the DSD samplerate (DSD64, 128, 256, 512).

For DSD to work you need to put the DAC into fixed volume mode anyway.

I don't care too much about filters (upsampling to DSD256) but lack of DSD Direct mode is silly - it is right there on the chip

 

[Music1969]

Like with DSD filter - if there is only one option, there is no reason for a setting. If it works only on fixed volume it indicates direct DSD as the only option.

This is not the DSD Direct mode of the AKM chip. See block diagram in datasheet

 

[Snoopy]

This is not the DSD Direct mode of the AKM chip. See block diagram in datasheet

I got a suspicion that all new AKM chips will automatically support that DSD DM if you actually input a DSD file since it doesn't need to go through a pcm filter.

And that's probably why there is no "DSD filter" in the DAC mode because you can't do volume control and EQ In that mode.

So if your input is DSD and your output is going to be DSD, why would U need a setting for DSD DM? There is no other option anyway in this scenario.

At least that's how I Understand the datasheet

1 bit DSD in... DSD filter (cut-off frequency) , bypass the DS modulator if there is no volume control.. to the analogue output stage.

 

[bogi]

This is not the DSD Direct mode of the AKM chip. See block diagram in datasheet

I know the datasheet. The chip allows both modes. It is on DAC device manufacturer which chip capabilities are used by a final product (like E70V).
I'm not owner of E70V. But if volume control is imposible with DSD input, then E70V has DSDD bit set to "1".

 

[Music1969]

I got a suspicion that all new AKM chips will automatically support that DSD DM if you actually input a DSD file since it doesn't need to go through a pcm filter.

And that's probably why there is no "DSD filter" in the DAC mode because you can't do volume control and EQ In that mode.

So if your input is DSD and your output is going to be DSD, why would U need a setting for DSD DM? There is no other option anyway in this scenario.

At least that's how I Understand the datasheet

1 bit DSD in... DSD filter (cut-off frequency) , bypass the DS modulator if there is no volume control.. to the analogue output stage.

It's actually the opposite

The DSD filters are only there when DSD Direct mode

Since we have no DSDD mode here, there are no DSD filters offered

 

[Music1969]

I know the datasheet. The chip allows both modes. It is on DAC device manufacturer which chip capabilities are used by a final product (like E70V).
I'm not owner of E70V. But if volume control is imposible with DSD input, then E70V has DSDD bit set to "1".

Exactly - like the SMSL model and Yulong who use this same chip.

 

[Snoopy]

Exactly - like the SMSL model and Yulong who use this same chip.

Well that would suck that means topping rushed a release again only to use the newest chip.

The new yulong Aquila 3 seems to support DSD1024 and PCM1536 (if the information are actually true.)

Does the SMSL D400EX support DSDD?
Edit: yeah the manual mentions a DSD bypass mode where the DSD signal is directly output.

And 2 DSD filters (wide and narrow)


Another DAC that doesn't mention enough is the SMSL D300 with ROHM chip.
That DAC is always In DSD direct mode.

 

[gjm]

The new yulong Aquila 3 seems to support DSD1024 and PCM1536 (if the information are actually true.)

But at twice the price of the E70V ?

It does seem that enabling additional existing function comes at a price!

 

[Snoopy]

But at twice the price of the E70V ?

It does seem that enabling additional existing function comes at a price!

To be fair the yulong has a headphone amp. And a more expensive power supply than the Topping.

And topping QC is probably worse as well.

The SMSL D1se2, Su-10, D400Es and D400EX cost a lot more as well.

 

[Music1969]

Well that would suck that means topping rushed a release again only to use the newest chip.

The new yulong Aquila 3 seems to support DSD1024 and PCM1536 (if the information are actually true.)

Does the SMSL D400EX support DSDD?
Edit: yeah the manual mentions a DSD bypass mode where the DSD signal is directly output.

And 2 DSD filters (wide and narrow)


Another DAC that doesn't mention enough is the SMSL D300 with ROHM chip.
That DAC is always In DSD direct mode.

On another forum someone asked Topping to release a firmware to enable DSDD mode.

He said Topping replied they will not enable DSDD mode lol

 

[Snoopy]

On another forum someone asked Topping to release a firmware to enable DSDD mode.

He said Topping replied they will not enable DSDD mode lol

Lol. Good that I never purchased something from topping or will ever do.

 

[gjm]

To be fair the yulong has a headphone amp. And a more expensive power supply than the Topping.

And topping QC is probably worse as well.

The SMSL D1se2, Su-10, D400Es and D400EX cost a lot more as well.

I don't need a headphone amp, but the better PSU wouldn't go amiss.

And I agree - Topping, SMSL (and others) doubtless rush product to market using the latest'n'greatest tech. Actually using the technology to it's fullest extent is (at that time) less important to them than being first.

 

[Burns]

The SMSL DO300 could be interesting in comparison with the E70Velvet.
they both cost around 500 euro in the EU.

The DO300 uses the 1 x ESS9039 pro. Chip.

but the DO300 supports MQA for those that need it / want it.
The E70 Velvet doesn't seem to support MQA?

only downside to the E70 velvet seems to be the DSD cutoff frequency of 19khz. that's really low for DSD. so if you want more than that you have to upsample to higher DSD rates.

I wonder how the parts inside the dac used compare.. has one a better power supply, shielding op-amps and all that audiophile stuff.

DO300 it's a bit weird for me

SMSL ( S.M.S.L ) DO300 DAC

I bought SMSL DO300 and I think I became its beta tester. - The device in the factory settings is +2dB by default, - the default filter is fast linear, but more importantly, when the filters are turned off, the volume increases drastically and the sound becomes hoarse (Is there jitter...

www.audiosciencereview.com

and probably not only for me

Warning for desktop users: SMSL stacks have issues without workarounds (PC/Mac)

Hi, I just acquired an SMSL stack for desktop use composed of: SMSL SH-9 desktop amp SMSL SU-9 Pro desktop DAC And after a day of configuring, testing and digging, I found out issues that will make me return the stack as it's an UX downgrade compared to my old Schiit stack Modi3+Magni3...

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[Veri]

Lol. Good that I never purchased something from topping or will ever do.

Bit drastic, no