Topping E70 Velvet (AKM 4499EX)

[Westsounds]

The velvet name suggests it'll sound smooth and silky. So suggestive bias creeps in before you hear it.

 

[Krit]

View attachment 474240Hello, do you mean 3pin like this? Isn't a 3-pin interface more universal? What are the benefits of 2 pins?

Usually more self noise/hiss on tweeters and even some subs. I never had issues on 2-pin connectors where 3-pin almost always has some issues with self noise.

 

[aka]

My pedestrian take: this is an impressive DAC.
Paired (COAX) with my WiiM Pro Plus (then RCAs to Outlaw RR 2150 and Axiom M80HPs).
Again, pedestrian.
I have convinced myself that I like it more than my DX5 (which has become my chair-side headphone DAC-Amp).
This may all be voodoo.
Not doing any A/B ESS/AKM. I am simply massively enjoying picking up what the AKM is beautifully laying down.
(All testing, so far, is by pushing local 24/192 DR13 or better files to the WiiM via LMS on my MacBook Pro)

My Velvet Crush!

 

[Panelhead]

Mine arrived yesterday. Had to read the manual twice to sort getting into PreAmp mode.
First 30 minutes was not impressed. Let it play for several hours.
The sound had blossomed. Tails on piano notes are longer. Sound is glorious. Hooked the RAW- MDA1 back up. Played some, then back to Velvet.
Putting on teflon coated asbestos lab coat. Turds and flame protection.
Can easily hear a difference on certain tracks. The end of notes is more gradual. May be distortion. But sounds pleasing.
BUT, having the Auto On Off and triggers alone is worth the price of admission.

 

[Purité Audio]

Just wait until you reach the 600 hour mark, the heavens will part and a ray of sunshine will illuminate the E70.
Keith

 

[Jarrett]

Mine arrived yesterday. Had to read the manual twice to sort getting into PreAmp mode.
First 30 minutes was not impressed. Let it play for several hours.
The sound had blossomed. Tails on piano notes are longer. Sound is glorious. Hooked the RAW- MDA1 back up. Played some, then back to Velvet.
Putting on teflon coated asbestos lab coat. Turds and flame protection.
Can easily hear a difference on certain tracks. The end of notes is more gradual. May be distortion. But sounds pleasing.
BUT, having the Auto On Off and triggers alone is worth the price of admission.

So the difference after break-in was greater than the difference of adding new hardware?

 

[JSmith]

Can easily hear a difference on certain tracks. The end of notes is more gradual. May be distortion. But sounds pleasing.

JSmith

 

[fritobugger]

Mine arrived yesterday. Had to read the manual twice to sort getting into PreAmp mode.
First 30 minutes was not impressed. Let it play for several hours.
The sound had blossomed. Tails on piano notes are longer. Sound is glorious. Hooked the RAW- MDA1 back up. Played some, then back to Velvet.
Putting on teflon coated asbestos lab coat. Turds and flame protection.
Can easily hear a difference on certain tracks. The end of notes is more gradual. May be distortion. But sounds pleasing.
BUT, having the Auto On Off and triggers alone is worth the price of admission.

The zealots are gonna love this comment!

 

[Panelhead]

I look to the multitone plots too. That is closer to music than a single tone benchmark. Used to like to see the -90.3dB comparison at 16 and 24 bit to see delivered resolution. But all are so good now that is like SINAD. Whether 118 or 125 it should not be audible.
The hash may be what I hear. The jitter plot indicates the RAW-MDA1 is the better dac also.
Why the Velvet sounded better after playing for a short period could be many items. I am running both dacs closer to 0dB than most users. Have the B100’s set on unity gain. Was listening yesterday with attenuators set at -15 to -17dB. Normally is -10 to -15dB, but that is when no one else is here.

 

[tyanlion]

Does buying the E70 velvet and L70 stack make sense anymore with the Fiio's K15 and K17 release?

 

[JSmith]

Does buying the E70 velvet and L70 stack make sense anymore with Fiio's K15 and K17 releasing?

What do you mean... what does Fiio releasing some DAC/HPA's got to do with Topping E70-V & L70?


JSmith

 

[Roland68]

Does buying the E70 velvet and L70 stack make sense anymore with Fiio's K15 and K17 releasing?

I don't quite understand that either.
There are plenty of examples where even 30-year-old devices have equally good or better measurements than current devices.

What would make the purchase no longer worthwhile for you?
The L70 has significantly more power than both FiiOs; only you can decide whether you need that, or whether the FiiO K19 might even be a viable alternative.
Just look at the measurements from the AP for all the devices; that should clear things up, because newer devices aren't necessarily better, even if the difference is probably inaudible.

And only you can decide on the features either.
The 31-band parametric EQ in the K17 is great, of course, if you use it.

 

[tyanlion]

I don't quite understand that either.
There are plenty of examples where even 30-year-old devices have equally good or better measurements than current devices.

What would make the purchase no longer worthwhile for you?
The L70 has significantly more power than both FiiOs; only you can decide whether you need that, or whether the FiiO K19 might even be a viable alternative.
Just look at the measurements from the AP for all the devices; that should clear things up, because newer devices aren't necessarily better, even if the difference is probably inaudible.

And only you can decide on the features either.
The 31-band parametric EQ in the K17 is great, of course, if you use it.

In terms of the AKM type dacs. The K15 has two 4497svd and the k17 has two 4499EXs, the K15 is about the same price of the E70+L70 combo where I live and does pretty much the same in 1 package; I was wondering if that is the case is there any reason to buy topping's stack over the K15 or k17. The 4497svd seems to be very similar to 4499EX soundwise according to reviews.

This was kinda the answer I was hopping for: "The L70 has significantly more power than both FiiOs".

Does having dual 4497svd or 4499EX make any sound difference compared to the single 4499Ex the velvet has? or is it just for marketing purposes?

 

[Roland68]

In terms of the AKM type dacs. The K15 has two 4497svd and the k17 has two 4499EXs, the K15 is about the same price of the E70+L70 combo where I live and does pretty much the same in 1 package; I was wondering if that is the case is there any reason to buy topping's stack over the K15 or k17. The 4497svd seems to be very similar to 4499EX soundwise according to reviews.

This was kinda the answer I was hopping for: "The L70 has significantly more power than both FiiOs".

Does having dual 4497svd or 4499EX make any sound difference compared to the single 4499Ex the velvet has? or is it just for marketing purposes?

It's no secret that the L70 has twice the power of the K17. But if you don't need the extra power, it offers no added value.

You wouldn't even hear a difference compared to an ES9039Q2M or AK4493, as long as all the DAC chips are well-integrated, because that's the more important factor.
You could also save money with a combination of the L70 and the SMSL D1 DAC. I've been using the D1 in my desktop setup for months now, and sometimes the SU-1 or PO100AK, even though I have plenty of DACs here that are 5, 10, 20, or even 30 times more expensive and are from the last few months/years.

My work equipment is a Gustav A18, which is now 5 years old, and the DAC in my living room HiFi system is now over 30 years old.
I would focus more on features, functionality, and the power you actually need.

 

[tyanlion]

It's no secret that the L70 has twice the power of the K17. But if you don't need the extra power, it offers no added value.

You wouldn't even hear a difference compared to an ES9039Q2M or AK4493, as long as all the DAC chips are well-integrated, because that's the more important factor.
You could also save money with a combination of the L70 and the SMSL D1 DAC. I've been using the D1 in my desktop setup for months now, and sometimes the SU-1 or PO100AK, even though I have plenty of DACs here that are 5, 10, 20, or even 30 times more expensive and are from the last few months/years.

My work equipment is a Gustav A18, which is now 5 years old, and the DAC in my living room HiFi system is now over 30 years old.
I would focus more on features, functionality, and the power you actually need.

I need a DAC with XLR outs to the D1 would be off my list. I want to try the an AKM DAC since i have been using a SABRE DAC for quite sometime now. Well since the K15 has basically the same features, functionality and I don't really need the power should I choose the K15 in that case?

 

[Roland68]

I need a DAC with XLR outs to the D1 would be off my list. I want to try the an AKM DAC since i have been using a SABRE DAC for quite sometime now. Well since the K15 has basically the same features, functionality and I don't really need the power should I choose the K15 in that case?

You're expecting an answer here that only you can give.
Anyone who tells you to choose one device over another will be doing so from their own perspective, not yours.
Personally, I prefer dedicated devices, while others prefer an all-in-one system, but in both cases, it has absolutely nothing to do with you.

I can make it even worse for you.
The DX5 II would be significantly cheaper, performed exceptionally well in reviews, and has almost as much power as the L70 and considerably more than the K15 and K17.
The PEQ function is currently experiencing some issues, but it doesn't affect the DAC and HPA.
And all this for just €50 more than the L70.
The DX5 II will soon replace my SMSL DO400 and perhaps my L70 in the future.

 

[mocenigo]

Just wait until you reach the 600 hour mark, the heavens will part and a ray of sunshine will illuminate the E70.
Keith

This is disappointing, it only took 550 hours with my old D90 (first series, no MQA) before the heavens parted and a ray of sunshine illuminated it...

 

[Roland68]

This is disappointing, it only took 550 hours with my old D90 (first series, no MQA) before the heavens parted and a ray of sunshine illuminated it...

Just use a powerful laser; the "illuminating" will then be much faster....