Topping E30 vs Shiit Modius, any notable differences?

[Dragonstreamline]

Dear forum-members,
I recently ordered the Topping E30 alongside the SMSL SP200, but I have seen anecdotal reports mentioning that the E30 is too clinical/boring. I have seen a forum where they actually bash the entire Topping line for being boring and too sterile of a DAC series where the Shiit Modius is pretty much hailed by any review I have seen so far. My question is, besides the balanced output on the Modius, will I hear a substantial difference in frequency response flavouring when moving from an E30 to the Modius?

 

[Hemi-Demon]

Both sound great, imo. The added remote on the E30 is nice. The Modius is a little noisier due to the USB connection design (your miles may vary, not every source is the same), balanced also tempers this a tad. The measurements don't show this of course, so maybe it is just my gear. I would recommend using a wall charger with both, though. Both options are so transparent, you won't gain much until you are interested spending a little more $$. You will have more fun working on your headphones, or amp, imo.

Welcome to ASR

 

[Dragonstreamline]

Both sound great, imo. The added remote on the E30 is nice. The Modius is a little noisier due to the USB connection design (your miles may vary, not every source is the same), balanced also tempers this a tad. The measurements don't show this of course, so maybe it is just my gear. I would recommend using a wall charger with both, though. Both options are so transparent, you won't gain much until you are interested spending a little more $$. You will have more fun working on your headphones, or amp, imo.

Welcome to ASR

Thank you for all the tips as my first reply ever on this forum I will be reviewing the E-MU Teak alongside the Bamboo, Rose, Purple Heart, Zebra and Mahogany cups. Chan from E-MU Creative send them to me so I am very excited to pair them with the E30 and SMSL-200 after your reassurance about the DAC.

 

[M00ndancer]

Both options are so transparent, you won't gain much until you are interested spending a little more $$.

Please, there are measurable differences between them but not audible. Both the E30 and the Modius are as transparent (not a perfect word for it, but it will do) as 90% of the DACS out there. The balanced output will give you more power and might cure some ground loops. Everything else is differences in features, build, manufacturer, warranty, looks and price. Choose the one that suits your usage. Happy headphone testing!

And welcome to ASR.

 

[ichonderoga]

Dear forum-members,
I recently ordered the Topping E30 alongside the SMSL SP200, but I have seen anecdotal reports mentioning that the E30 is too clinical/boring. I have seen a forum where they actually bash the entire Topping line for being boring and too sterile of a DAC series where the Shiit Modius is pretty much hailed by any review I have seen so far. My question is, besides the balanced output on the Modius, will I hear a substantial difference in frequency response flavouring when moving from an E30 to the Modius?

Don’t worry about it. Most modern DACs stay true to the source and adding anything is up to the rest of the components in the chain (speakers, amps, room, …).

 

[BDWoody]

My question is, besides the balanced output on the Modius, will I hear a substantial difference in frequency response flavouring when moving from an E30 to the Modius?

Easy question. Nope. Transparency is the threshold competence for SQ. Beyond that is about paying more for pretty much every reason other than SQ. Boutique DAC's all have their own story to tell...but there's no veil to be lifted with a 'higher end' DAC, just the money out of your wallet.

If there is a meaningful difference in sound, it is because they chose to *add* distortion (or, more likely, just got whatever they got based on some sub-optimal design choices...not conscious ones based on SQ) in order to differentiate themselves.

Spend money on your speakers and/or room.

Welcome to the forum!

 

[Sgt. Ear Ache]

Dear forum-members,
I recently ordered the Topping E30 alongside the SMSL SP200, but I have seen anecdotal reports mentioning that the E30 is too clinical/boring. I have seen a forum where they actually bash the entire Topping line for being boring and too sterile of a DAC series where the Shiit Modius is pretty much hailed by any review I have seen so far.

When I see one of these guys reliably (meaning in a way that isn't random chance) identify which is the "clinical/boring" dac in a blind test I'll pay attention. Until then it's all hogwash...

(assuming measurable transparency of course. If one of the dacs is doing something a dac shouldn't be doing then all bets are off)

 

[3125b]

seen a forum where they actually bash the entire Topping line for being boring and too sterile of a DAC series where the Shiit Modius is pretty much hailed by any review I have seen so far.

Let me guess, Super Best Audio Friends and head-fi?

besides the balanced output on the Modius, will I hear a substantial difference in frequency response flavouring when moving from an E30 to the Modius?

No, both are way more than transparent and have flat frequency response.

 

[Dragonstreamline]

Let me guess, Super Best Audio Friends and head-fi?

No, both are way more than transparent and have flat frequency response.

Good guess, SBAF indeed I was talking about, Head-Fi has always been a mixed crowd for me got, nothing against that site it has it's charms.
I just found it odd that Toppings was hated on so much by SBAF without them ever backing up their claims other than saying "be against Toppings or you don't belong to our group". They sure to represent their name then I'd say: Either you're in an in-group or you're an out-group member.

Anyhow, just received the E30 and SMSL SP200, what a beautiful combo it is indeed. My EMU-Teak and HE-500 spitting details like never before, a very organic and flat presentation it is indeed as well, true to the source as far as my ears can tell so far. Was going to compare the Teak to the other woods, but with this higher level of detail I need to totally relearn the E-MU Teak before I can even start to compare it to the other woodies. Cheers.

 

[NDRQ]

Good guess, SBAF indeed I was talking about, Head-Fi has always been a mixed crowd for me got, nothing against that site it has it's charms.
I just found it odd that Toppings was hated on so much by SBAF without them ever backing up their claims other than saying "be against Toppings or you don't belong to our group". They sure to represent their name then I'd say: Either you're in an in-group or you're an out-group member.

View attachment 85417

Anyhow, just received the E30 and SMSL SP200, what a beautiful combo it is indeed. My EMU-Teak and HE-500 spitting details like never before, a very organic and flat presentation it is indeed as well, true to the source as far as my ears can tell so far. Was going to compare the Teak to the other woods, but with this higher level of detail I need to totally relearn the E-MU Teak before I can even start to compare it to the other woodies. Cheers.

They have everything from China, so not much surprise.
Recently they started to talk about how AKM chips are bad ( probably because many chinese dac built on that) and said that even though not so good chips, Schiit still doing good DACs using AKM chips.

On the other hand, SBAF is not a bad site, the headphone measurements, impressions and a big part of the forum is good and informative, but the dac and amp reviews are heavily biased, so im usually ignoring those parts.

 

[MajorMajorMajorMajor]

I have owned both and greatly prefer the Modius. I barely know what a soundstage was until i heard my music on it. It’s beautiful.

 

[Veri]

I have owned both and greatly prefer the Modius. I barely know what a soundstage was until i heard my music on it. It’s beautiful.

New toy syndrome? Let me guess you just have it a couple of days?

 

[Ellie]

I have owned both and greatly prefer the Modius. I barely know what a soundstage was until i heard my music on it. It’s beautiful.

Both DACs sound the same, so that's definitely just placebo. There's no audible difference between the two.

I actually sold my Modius because the audio interface I do my VO work with sounded exactly the same on its output. I even level-matched it with my Modius and swapped back and forth between the two inputs, and.. yeah. There was no difference at all.

Modius is a great little DAC, so I'm obviously not saying you can't like it, but it's not better to the human ear than an E30. It's the same.

Also, a DAC can't affect "soundstage" and "imaging," that's.. not a thing. Unless it had a non-flat frequency response I guess, but neither of them do. They're totally flat.

 

[MajorMajorMajorMajor]

Both DACs sound the same, so that's definitely just placebo. There's no audible difference between the two.

I actually sold my Modius because the audio interface I do my VO work with sounded exactly the same on its output. I even level-matched it with my Modius and swapped back and forth between the two inputs, and.. yeah. There was no difference at all.

Modius is a great little DAC, so I'm obviously not saying you can't like it, but it's not better to the human ear than an E30. It's the same.

Also, a DAC can't affect "soundstage" and "imaging," that's.. not a thing. Unless it had a non-flat frequency response I guess, but neither of them do. They're totally flat.

Maybe... and in theory, I'd agree with you... it's hard to argue with my ears, though.

 

[Jmudrick]

Maybe... and in theory, I'd agree with you... it's hard to argue with my ears, though.

It's your brain thats doing the work. Not really hard to argue.

I love my Modius, it's lack of features make it a true set and forget situation.

 

[MajorMajorMajorMajor]

It's your brain thats doing the work. Not really hard to argue.

I love my Modius, it's lack of features make it a true set and forget situation.

Hmm. All I can say is I was predisposed to think the DAC wouldn't make a difference. Then I plugged it in and immediately noticed a huge difference. I get what you're saying about frequency response, my point is that I had the E30 and I had the Modius. I didn't care for spending the extra money, but I did, and I noticed a big difference in how my music sounded. Maybe it depends on the rest of the system, how much of a difference it makes.

 

[M00ndancer]

Welcome to ASR!

Maybe it depends on the rest of the system, how much of a difference it makes.

Short answer: No, if the only thing that you changed was the DAC it's not

Hmm. All I can say is I was predisposed to think the DAC wouldn't make a difference. Then I plugged it in and immediately noticed a huge difference.

I have the same "problem". Depending on my mood, time of day, I find my speakers sound different, but since all my DACs are good enough to not be heard, it's all in my brain. Different headphones and speakers do sound different.
Perception bias, it's all in your brain.

Read this: Bias in Auditory Perception

Longer answers from ASR:

Audibility thresholds of amp and DAC measurements
Psychoacoustics Fundamentals

 

[SWL3600]

Both DACs sound the same, so that's definitely just placebo.

I have the Modius and the E30. They definitely do not sound the same in my system.

It sure would be nice/easy if all DACs sounded the same......but they don't. Not in my system.

 

[Shazb0t]

I have the Modius and the E30. They definitely do not sound the same in my system.

It sure would be nice/easy if all DACs sounded the same......but they don't. Not in my system.

Have you tried performing a properly level matched blind listening test? I think you'd be surprised.

 

[Maki]

I have the Modius and the E30. They definitely do not sound the same in my system.

It sure would be nice/easy if all DACs sounded the same......but they don't. Not in my system.

What do you mean by "sound"? If you mean your brain's response to auditory stimulus, sure. If you mean the waveform generated by the device, no, they are the same beyond human limits of perception.