Topping E30 II DAC Review

[Rottmannash]

Well, from what I know, seems the OG E30 is worse than the mk2. I’d assume you’d hear at least some difference … why would the D90SE be so expensive, then?

I suppose the rest of your system is also of good quality and you are listening through USB from a high quality source?

Would be interesting, if you could listen to the three songs I did.

yep. Bluesound Node 2i>D90SE>Schitt Freya+(passthrough)>Buckeye Purifi>Revel F208. I wanted all of the DAC's because I like buying them. I have 3 systems so rotate most of them through. The D70 usually is on a HP system, the D10Balanced usually another system w/ 2 channel + HP's, etc. I also have 2 DAP's which I will sometimes use as DAC to the main system and still can't hear a difference. I bought the D90SE because I could and wanted to see if there was an audible difference. It wasn't but like how it looked (silver), the many input options, its 5V performance and the fact it was on top of the SINAD board for awhile. But if I'm being honest they ALL SOUND THE SAME.

 

[CauliflowerEars]

Is there a difference in sound quality when you connect the E50 and E30II via toslink with wiim mini?

1) Can anyone recommend a WiFi audio streamer with a good USB output to utilise the E50's best quality (USB in)? Prefereably in the Wiim Mini price range or so ...
2) I didn't directly compare those DACs with the Toslink in. BUT, I do remember complaining that the E30 II sounds a bit muffled with the Wiim (somewhere on ASR).
I compared the E50's USB (Laptop) and Optical/Toslink (Wiim Mini). I'd say the Optical sounds maybe about 5% worse. BUT, in the careful 'critical listening' setting.
I do the 'critical' through USB anyway and Wiim mainly for background music, so not much of an issue.

Eva Cassidy - Ain't No Sunshine: https://tidal.com/browse/track/53262839
The guitar intro has some 'dirt' from how the strings have been touched/struck by the player.
a. USB - those 'dirts' sound more. I quite enjoy them as little 'treats'.
b. Opt - can't hear them that well. They are just some quiet dirts.

Daft Punk - Giorgio by Moroder: https://tidal.com/browse/track/20115559
The 4:40 min cosmic sound modulation has more detail through USB.

Respect for this! I am in it for the same reason, and that keeps me coming back here to check info and experiences on devices that I am considering buying.

However I no longer feel for discussing any (subjective) impression I might have on devices here, after I was put on my place for trying to discuss such matters in ASR. And it’s alright, no hard feelings, it is after all audio Science review, and the premise for what I was made to understand is that all DACs sound the same etc etc and if I happened to differ from that opinion I should rather keep it to myself. Which is what I do now. Once in a while though I am happy to read posts like yours knowing
I might be wrong but not alone

1. No, all DACs definitely do not sound the same.
2. I don't know how your discussions went, but if anybody is 'putting you on your place':
a. It seems they might be too extreme in terms of the purely technical approach and/or echoing the 'all DACs sound the same' without critical thinking, open mind and basic respect. After all, Amir does listen to the gear when testing. It often happened that the measurements differed from the subjective experience.
b. If you were told to keep your opinion to yourself, I'd say this already shows what sort of a person you're dealing with. (unless you were too pushy or stubborn about it ...)
3. I think sharing the subjective experience opens the discussion. But also, systems, rooms and most importantly, people differ. From my understanding, age alone can already make people hear things differently. Never mind the lifestyle, genetics, etc ...

I can't at all challenge your subjective views here BUT - Maybe a silly question but I ask anyway -

Are these the links you used when subjectively evaluating? Tidal is MQA hobbled now pretty much isn't it? if so, the E30 will be giving a thirteen bit reproduction (with much reduced S/N playing back the MQA files) and the E50 as well as having higher output potentially? will 'unfold' the MQA files with all that this entails..

Yes, I did use Tidal. BUT, I only have the HiFi tier, not the HiFi Plus, so no MQA.
I was curious, if maybe the MQA potential by itself already can mean a higher quality DAC sound quality ...

yep. Bluesound Node 2i>D90SE>Schitt Freya+(passthrough)>Buckeye Purifi>Revel F208. I wanted all of the DAC's because I like buying them. I have 3 systems so rotate most of them through. The D70 usually is on a HP system, the D10Balanced usually another system w/ 2 channel + HP's, etc. I also have 2 DAP's which I will sometimes use as DAC to the main system and still can't hear a difference. I bought the D90SE because I could and wanted to see if there was an audible difference. It wasn't but like how it looked (silver), the many input options, its 5V performance and the fact it was on top of the SINAD board for awhile. But if I'm being honest they ALL SOUND THE SAME.

Ah, much respect. The D90SE and Revel F208 are definitely on my shopping (bucket) list.
I myself am sure I can hear, but most importantly feel the difference. For me, the audio experience is better with E50.
I hope you don't mind this very, very, oh so very rude question, but ... would you say you have good hearing? I'm curious, maybe that's where the difference could be ...
APOLOGIES!

 

[Rottmannash]

1) Can anyone recommend a WiFi audio streamer with a good USB output to utilise the E50's best quality (USB in)? Prefereably in the Wiim Mini price range or so ...
2) I didn't directly compare those DACs with the Toslink in. BUT, I do remember complaining that the E30 II sounds a bit muffled with the Wiim (somewhere on ASR).
I compared the E50's USB (Laptop) and Optical/Toslink (Wiim Mini). I'd say the Optical sounds maybe about 5% worse. BUT, in the careful 'critical listening' setting.
I do the 'critical' through USB anyway and Wiim mainly for background music, so not much of an issue.

Eva Cassidy - Ain't No Sunshine: https://tidal.com/browse/track/53262839
The guitar intro has some 'dirt' from how the strings have been touched/struck by the player.
a. USB - those 'dirts' sound more. I quite enjoy them as little 'treats'.
b. Opt - can't hear them that well. They are just some quiet dirts.

Daft Punk - Giorgio by Moroder: https://tidal.com/browse/track/20115559
The 4:40 min cosmic sound modulation has more detail through USB.


1. No, all DACs definitely do not sound the same.
2. I don't know how your discussions went, but if anybody is 'putting you on your place':
a. It seems they might be too extreme in terms of the purely technical approach and/or echoing the 'all DACs sound the same' without critical thinking, open mind and basic respect. After all, Amir does listen to the gear when testing. It often happened that the measurements differed from the subjective experience.
b. If you were told to keep your opinion to yourself, I'd say this already shows what sort of a person you're dealing with. (unless you were too pushy or stubborn about it ...)
3. I think sharing the subjective experience opens the discussion. But also, systems, rooms and most importantly, people differ. From my understanding, age alone can already make people hear things differently. Never mind the lifestyle, genetics, etc ...


Yes, I did use Tidal. BUT, I only have the HiFi tier, not the HiFi Plus, so no MQA.
I was curious, if maybe the MQA potential by itself already can mean a higher quality DAC sound quality ...


Ah, much respect. The D90SE and Revel F208 are definitely on my shopping (bucket) list.
I myself am sure I can hear, but most importantly feel the difference. For me, the audio experience is better with E50.
I hope you don't mind this very, very, oh so very rude question, but ... would you say you have good hearing? I'm curious, maybe that's where the difference could be ...
APOLOGIES!

Can hear up to 16k.

 

[Rottmannash]

@amirm does NOT listen to the DACs he tests.

 

[Hapo]

 

[CauliflowerEars]

Can hear up to 16k.

According to this, I can hear 18k, but some of the sound differences probably aren’t in the higher ranges anyway. https://www.audiocheck.net/audiotests_frequencycheckhigh.php

@amirm does NOT listen to the DACs he tests.

You are right. I've been reading speakers' reviews and that's what I had in mind.

 

[Rottmannash]

According to this, I can hear 18k, but some of the sound differences probably aren’t in the higher ranges anyway. https://www.audiocheck.net/audiotests_frequencycheckhigh.php

You are right. I've been reading speakers' reviews and that's what I had in mind.

"a. It seems they might be too extreme in terms of the purely technical approach and/or echoing the 'all DACs sound the same' without critical thinking, open mind and basic respect. After all, Amir does listen to the gear when testing. It often happened that the measurements differed from the subjective experience."

I was responding to this quote from you which implied @amirm listened to the DACs he tests.

 

[CauliflowerEars]

"a. It seems they might be too extreme in terms of the purely technical approach and/or echoing the 'all DACs sound the same' without critical thinking, open mind and basic respect. After all, Amir does listen to the gear when testing. It often happened that the measurements differed from the subjective experience."

I was responding to this quote from you which implied @amirm listened to the DACs he tests.

Yes, I know. I still had the speaker reviews in my mind and ‘the purely technical approach’. Quite misleading with the DAC sentence, you are correct.

 

[Fahzz]

I'm looking at buying a standalone DAC to run from an Allo Digione w/SPDIF out to the DAC then into Denon 3700 AVR RCA analog inputs. I've read this thread.
Any members have any bad experiences with reliability or dissatisfied with the unit for any other reason? Thanks.

 

[Anderlfs]

Yes, I did use Tidal. BUT, I only have the HiFi tier, not the HiFi Plus, so no MQA.

We don't know what you're getting with Tidal, some people believe It's mqa compressed audio in flac container with or without mqa metadata. We also don´t know for sure how the filters are being triggered. Try to redo the test with a known source and you can try to convert pcm to dsd with Foobar's DSD Processor to induce and play with F-1 and F-2 filters in E30-II, for comparisons purpose.

The implementation of these two DACs, from the same manufacturer, and in the same price range, should not be that different. The higher price comes from more functionality implemented. I don't doubt that you are hearing some difference, but I think you may be surprised how the E30-II can please you If you investigate further. As suggested in another topic, you can also experiment with increasing frequencies between 100-600hz, or narrow the range to 200-400khz, or tilting the frequency response around 1khz.

 

[blues66]

Hi hello, I noticed one thing, during the listening tests between Fioo Q1mark Il and Topping E30 II. that by adjusting the volume of the FiiO Q1 mark II to the ear, the sound seems better, more musical than the Topping E30 II that I bought. even the volume control with the FiiO seems to have less listening effort . I don't think it's psychoacoustic.
I'm tempted to sell the Topping
I use Yamaha HS 80M active speakers .
tell me the volume of the wire is analog? this is perhaps the reason for better control . sorry but I'm tempted, but I'm confused, since they speak well of this Topping DAC.

 

[Anderlfs]

however I use Yamaha HS 80M active speakers

You nailed It. Your HS 80M are dead flat studio monitors made to mix and master music. E30-II is a dead linear dac, much more than your FiiO and other DACs people usually compare to. It can be perceived as too revealing or uninteresting If not paired correctly. If you pair It with a cheap Edifier, you’ll get the best out of the speakers, with good musically, at low cost. But synergy is something you’ll hardly get some advice here. You can try to equalize as I suggested in the previous post.

EDIT: citations.
Yamaha HS80M: precise reference possible, providing an ideal sonic platform to build on throughout the mixing process, sound is very revealing of detail.
E30-II: very linear and revealing (headphonia), slight harshness or glare to the sound (headphonenesty).
E50: less revealing, when compared to other 9068AS dacs (headphonia).
Note: I used E50 as an example. Objectively, in the ASR/E30-II and the ASR/E50, I have not identified any aspect that justifies the differences reported by users. Then It's necessary to look for other sources.

 

[Veri]

You nailed It. Your HS 80M are dead flat studio monitors made to mix and master music. E30-II is a dead linear dac, much more than your FiiO and other DACs people usually compare to.

Citation needed..

 

[blues66]

@Anderlfs
hello, forgive me but maybe I expressed myself badly, I think there was no need to post the reviews of the yammys, I know what I got, and what sound I went against!

I think there is a big difference between cheap speakers (( Edifier ... even if some have said, in other sites that for the cost they sound good )) with something more concrete, I think I'm not wrong

Anyway back to us...

I meant that the volume of the Fioo seems to have more volume than the Topping, that for now I'm using it as a Preamp, as a pure DAC I tried it but I can't tell how I can make it work / go in pairs, like the engines

Request
,

you say that

should i try with a preamp?
Hello and thanks .

for this I have / there is the indecision to move on to something else , however ... , there is always a however !!

 

[Anderlfs]

You really expressed badly.. you said "the sound seems better, more musical", so I went that way. Since you asked, you should forget about the preamps on these Dacs and use the Yamaha HS 80M gain, as it should be much better quality. Fiio Q1 says that their product have a Innovative ADC volume adjustment technology, and the difference you noticed may be there. This must be objectively tested however.

 

[Piere]

There are reviews indicating the missing details from E30, such as this one https://soundnews.net/sources/dacs/topping-e30-dac-review-entry-level-overachiever/

"The only thing that I could complain about compared to a high-end DAC was the detail retrieval that was not its best trait, I would spot some micro-details but only with my eyes closed. They are still there, but are not screaming for attention and prime time. Treble lovers would be slightly disappointed to know that E30 is playing the safe game, rendering it natural and clear but without the over sharpening some DACs are doing nowadays."

And that is exactly what I like of it. It makes it sounding very relaxing, never fatiguing! I also own the D30Pro which is a tad more precise and resolving a little bit more fine detail. But for daily background and HP listening I favour the E30 L30-II combo.

 

[frki16]

after 6 months my e30 II passed away. not good...

 

[Veri]

after 6 months my e30 II passed away. not good...

rest in peace/pieces

 

[Miika]

after 6 months my e30 II passed away. not good...

What happened?
My e30 ran flawlessly and my e30 II continues that streak

 

[Toku]

after 6 months my e30 II passed away. not good...

Please tell me what kind of symptoms it broke.
Your information will be helpful for users with E30ll/E30.