Topping E30 DAC Review

[odyo]

if you read for some time this forum, you will realize that all that you wrote is just the product of your imagination. Or in other words, your brain playing with you.
They both sound the same probably. And if you find difference, it is because one of them is faulty (noise or distortion).
dont pretend to be rude here, just I wish this forum will not mutate to headfi style

Nope. It's very obvious difference really. No worries. I'm objectivist kind of audiophile already. Difference is so damn huge at higher volumes. At lower volumes they are pretty close. Slam difference is super obvious. Depth and harshness differences are hard to put fingers on but yeah it's there.

AE5 already have lots of power and low output impedance so i wasn't expecting this much difference at high volumes. Output impedance doesn't matter with the Ananda anyway.

 

[Sgt. Ear Ache]

lol..."I'm an objectivist...except when I know what I'm hearing!"

 

[Tup3x]

Soundcore chip is bypassed in direct mode. I'm not sure if it really uses adc. There is a line in port and selection in the driver.

Direct mode doesn't have anything to do with recording. Recording is handled by the SoundCore3D ADC - there's no other ADC chip. Line in/mic goes straight to ADC like always (according to Creative it has 101dB SNR). It's not analogue in to amp plug. You can easily verify that with simple loopback test:

(Besides, this wouldn't be possible if it wouldn't go through the ADC.)

 

[odyo]

lol..."I'm an objectivist...except when I know what I'm hearing!"

Problem with objectivism is that it's in theory. When it comes to practice there are tons of variabilities that can affect the end result. I can only talk from my experience. I haven't listen lots of dacs and amps and i don't know if they sound same or different. In my case AE5 and E30+THX789 combo sounds different. I think it's easier to notice differences if you are familiar with one of them.

Direct mode doesn't have anything to do with recording. Recording is handled by the SoundCore3D ADC - there's no other ADC chip. Line in/mic goes straight to ADC like always (according to Creative it has 101dB SNR). It's not analogue in to amp plug. You can easily verify that with simple loopback test:
View attachment 75865
(Besides, this wouldn't be possible if it wouldn't go through the ADC.)

Appreciate the input. It was still ground loop issue though. Moving power cable from PC usb to cellphone charger helped but it was problematic and not worthy of hassle. AE5 line out to THX 789 have no issue though.

 

[mlilliman]

Hi all

New to this forum and new to the Topping E30, but needed to register so I could thank @amirm and this community for the quality of reviews and discussion.

I sat up to nearly 4am last night reading DAC review after review, comparing SINAD results, IMD graphs and multi-tone tests lol. All while listening to my much loved setup of Rega DAC and Brio amp with PMC Twenty.21 stand mounts. I sometimes swap out the Rega DAC for a Chord Mojo, as it sounds slightly smoother at higher frequencies and less fatiguing, but doesn't sound as dynamic. I know I've lost half my audience now by saying one DAC sounds different to another! But perhaps the audible differences I perceive are down to the handling of jitter or the implementation of the output stage - who knows.

My ears seem quite sensitive to "bright" sources, and I've tried ribbon tweeter speakers and different amps to get a presentation that I'm happy with. I'm aware the speakers I've settled on have a pronounced top end, but the PMC's produce such a sweet sound and dig deep when the occasion demands, that I think I'll only upgrade with a house move.

So long story short, I ordered the Topping E30 in the early hours of this morning and it was delivered tonight! Packaging and appearance exceeded my quite low expectations, and are ridiculously good at the price. Thanks to this forum, I knew to hold the power button down for a few seconds to switch from PRE to DAC mode, and I was up and running in a couple of minutes.

I use a raspberry pi with an allo digione s/pdif hat, and stream spotify premium - so by no means audiophile quality, but the sound I'm getting from the Topping E30 is ridiculously good! It's so crystal clear. Dynamic swings are present without sounding forced, and transients sound well, natural. I was apprehensive that the DAC would sound overly analytical, but there's body to the midrange without any trace of smudging and overhang. It's a very neutral sounding DAC.

I listened to an Audiolab M-DAC in the past when auditioning the Rega DAC, and immediately preferred the Rega. Perhaps the synergy with my Brio (the older version at the time), was the key, but I found the Audiolab very "thin" - for want of a better term. It may have been an early ESS Sabre chip.

Have just tried turning up the wick on the Brio and it's induced a big grin! There's so much headroom. When I've turned my system up to neighbour annoying levels before, there's always been a harshness or edginess to the sound. It's not that it's too loud; it hasn't sounded clean. I once read that you can play really good hifi loud and still have a conversation in the same room - it's the distortion/noise that makes it uncomfortable.

So, thanks again everyone! I'm so happy I took a punt on this fabulous little DAC.

 

[MKW]

Is anyone else finding the auto on/off doesn't work? I have the E30's set to A-O, but they won't automatically go into or out of standby.

There are 6 filters available, and after several listening attempts, I don't notice an obvious difference. So I'd like to choose a setting that most agrees with what I think is best. The manual uses terms like "sharp" and "delay" - I question their definition. Could someone explain these filter options more thoroughly:

1. Sharp rolloff/(no delay?)
2. Slow rolloff/(no delay?)
3. Sharp rolloff/Short delay
4. Slow rolloff/Short delay
5. Super slow rolloff/(no delay?)
6. Low dispersion/Short delay

Rolloff appears to have two possibilities, sharp or slow.
Delay appears to have two possibilities, short or (none).
Dispersion appears to have two possibilities, low or (none).

My interpretation of the above is:
Why would I want low despersion? 6 seems eliminated for me.
Why would I want sharp? That's the primary complaint of digital paths - no thank you on 1 and 3.
Why would I want delay? That would work against time alignment of bass - no thanks to 3, 4, 6.
That leaves 2 and 5, slow or super-slow rolloff. My guess is super-slow would sound least "digital".

Hopefully someone can shed more light on the filter feature.

 

[Robbo99999]

Is anyone else finding the auto on/off doesn't work? I have the E30's set to A-O, but they won't automatically go into or out of standby.

There are 6 filters available, and after several listening attempts, I don't notice an obvious difference. So I'd like to choose a setting that most agrees with what I think is best. The manual uses terms like "sharp" and "delay" - I question their definition. Could someone explain these filter options more thoroughly:

1. Sharp rolloff/(no delay?)
2. Slow rolloff/(no delay?)
3. Sharp rolloff/Short delay
4. Slow rolloff/Short delay
5. Super slow rolloff/(no delay?)
6. Low dispersion/Short delay

Rolloff appears to have two possibilities, sharp or slow.
Delay appears to have two possibilities, short or (none).
Dispersion appears to have two possibilities, low or (none).

My interpretation of the above is:
Why would I want low despersion? 6 seems eliminated for me.
Why would I want sharp? That's the primary complaint of digital paths - no thank you on 1 and 3.
Why would I want delay? That would work against time alignment of bass - no thanks to 3, 4, 6.
That leaves 2 and 5, slow or super-slow rolloff. My guess is super-slow would sound least "digital".

Hopefully someone can shed more light on the filter feature.

I can't really tell you much about all the filters on a detailed technical level, but Filter #1 seems to be generally preferred by most people "in the know" from an intellectual perspective in terms of how it functions, but recognising differences in sound is another question altogether. On my other DAC (Soundblaster G6) I tested different filter options and I preferred the "Fast Roll Off/Linear Phase" filter from listening tests (not blind, etc), which I think is also the equivalent of Filter #1 on the E30 (or at least closest to it), so I use Filter #1 on the E30.

Auto off is working OK for me on the E30, connected to my laptop.

 

[MKW]

Auto on/off seems to be defeated by me leaving the miniDSP nanoDIGI on always. If I pull the power plug from the nanoDIGI, the E30's power down after flashing "Err" (and coax) for about a minute. So apparently, this is not a music signal switch (which is the marketing claim), but more of an active connection switch - doesn't really work for my application. Next best option is to leave them on continuously.

Do any measurements exist for the 6 filter settings? I'm interested to know specifically what is the difference.

• What is sharpened?
• What is delayed?
• What is dispersed?

What I notice most using filter #1 is more sibilance. That could mean I have the LXmini crossover filters set a little too bright - they are tweaked to match voicing of Tekton Double Impact (which did include bumping-up the highs a bit). So while filter #1 isn't my first choice, if there are benefits of filter #1, the DSP speaker crossover could be adjusted to compensate.

 

[voodooless]

Just look up the data sheet, all details of the filters are in there.

 

[samsa]

Auto on/off seems to be defeated by me leaving the miniDSP nanoDIGI on always. If I pull the power plug from the nanoDIGI, the E30's power down after flashing "Err" (and coax) for about a minute. So apparently, this is not a music signal switch (which is the marketing claim), but more of an active connection switch - doesn't really work for my application.

More precisely, this feature operates by detecting +5V on USB pin 1. The host device is responsible for cutting power to the USB bus when not in use. I've already posted instructions for getting this to work under Linux (e.g. on Raspberry Pi's). Dunno about the nanoDIGI.

As with your question about the filters on the E30, the search box in the upper right hand corner of this window is your friend.

 

[MKW]

@voodooless that link doesn't work for me, but I take your comment to mean check the datasheet that came with the E30. What I find there is the filters effect nothing below 20kHz (human upper audible limit) - no wonder I don't hear much difference.

@samsa maybe it operates that way when using the USB input. I'm using the 5v barrel power connector and coax signal input (no USB). Apparently, if there is any power on the coax source - E30's "think" its active. This auto feature should have been equipped with an input threshold above 0dB... like every other device (I've used) with similar auto-off feature (Denon, Marantz, NAD, Grace, Toshiba, VIZIO, Sony, Xbox, etc.). Seems Topping took a shortcut. That's ok, they don't use much power, so they can stay always on - or when it becomes annoying, I can find the remote.

 

[samsa]

I'm using the 5v barrel power connector and coax signal input (no USB). Apparently, if there is any power on the coax source - E30's "think" its active.

Ah. Sorry. Reports I've read indicate that auto/off works as expected for the optical input. I had not seen any reports (before yours) of trouble on the coax input. There are are lots of reports of auto/off not working on the USB interface (and the fix is always the same).

 

[yejun]

@voodooless that link doesn't work for me, but I take your comment to mean check the datasheet that came with the E30. What I find there is the filters effect nothing below 20kHz (human upper audible limit) - no wonder I don't hear much difference.

@samsa maybe it operates that way when using the USB input. I'm using the 5v barrel power connector and coax signal input (no USB). Apparently, if there is any power on the coax source - E30's "think" its active. This auto feature should have been equipped with an input threshold above 0dB... like every other device (I've used) with similar auto-off feature (Denon, Marantz, NAD, Grace, Toshiba, VIZIO, Sony, Xbox, etc.). Seems Topping took a shortcut. That's ok, they don't use much power, so they can stay always on - or when it becomes annoying, I can find the remote.

It works with my Bluetooth recceiver's spdif and coax output. But with my TV, it is always one. My guess it detects clock signal.

 

[Toku]

Is anyone else finding the auto on/off doesn't work? I have the E30's set to A-O, but they won't automatically go into or out of standby.

It's a problem with the USB port settings on your PC.
This is because the 5V power supply continues even if the PC sleeps.
The auto sleep/auto wake function works by detecting whether or not 5V is supplied to the USB port.
Is the charging function of the USB port connecting the E30 enabled?

 

[voodooless]

@voodooless that link doesn't work for me, but I take your comment to mean check the datasheet that came with the E30. What I find there is the filters effect nothing below 20kHz (human upper audible limit) - no wonder I don't hear much difference.

No I mean the data sheet of the AK4493. Obviously the filters should not interfere with anything below 20 kHz..

 

[Jarrett]

Read the review. You can see the effects of the filters in one of the charts. Describing them doesn't help.

 

[magicscreen]

Does this Topping E30 have a warmer musical sound? (because of the orange display?)
Are the added USB cables audiophile?
I have a Klotz USB cable and that is not audiophile because it is randomly interrupting the music, detaching the DAC. It is good for transferring files anyway.

 

[voodooless]

Does this Topping E30 have a warmer musical sound? (because of the orange display?)

Do you think it would sound differently if they would have chosen green?

Are the added USB cables audiophile?

I don't think I want to go there..

I have a Klotz USB cable and that is not audiophile because it is randomly interrupting the music, detaching the DAC. It is good for transferring files anyway.

Why would it transfer files just fine, but not work for USB audio..? I'm pretty sure the cable is not the issue here.

 

[samsa]

What's this auto/on feature? Can someone explain? Hopefully my replacement e30 doesnt get the "Err" message and detects usb input this time! Waiting on the l30 for the stack.

The E30 did come with a manual (in English, Chinese and Japanese). Its feature (including this one) are explained there.

 

[mlilliman]

Does this Topping E30 have a warmer musical sound? (because of the orange display?)
Are the added USB cables audiophile?
I have a Klotz USB cable and that is not audiophile because it is randomly interrupting the music, detaching the DAC. It is good for transferring files anyway.

Why the sarcasm?