TOPPING DX9！

[swim]

May I ask how you came to the conclusion that the DX9 15th Anniversary is a rip-off?

knew this comment was coming. I was venting. When it comes down to it, its very robust and no - it doesn't really qualify as a "rip off". My opinion is I think everything in this realm that's out between the $900-1300 price range - I personally feel the whole lot in this range need to collectively step back around $200, give or take. Mainly I'd say we're in diminishing returns here in this range. Yes this is an all in one that provides more than some common stack setups but that's what I'm saying, those are overpriced to.
I've read your comments defending the price over and over and I'm not at all interested in a debate with you about that. that wasn't the point of my comment. There was no point.

 

[Roland68]

knew this comment was coming. I was venting. When it comes down to it, its very robust and no - it doesn't really qualify as a "rip off". My opinion is I think everything in this realm that's out between the $900-1300 price range - I personally feel the whole lot in this range need to collectively step back around $200, give or take. Mainly I'd say we're in diminishing returns here in this range. Yes this is an all in one that provides more than some common stack setups but that's what I'm saying, those are overpriced to.
I've read your comments defending the price over and over and I'm not at all interested in a debate with you about that. that wasn't the point of my comment. There was no point.

It's just sad that people like you want to be paid for their work, but then don't allow others to. It's like your boss or your customers coming to you and simply wanting to pay you 20-30% less, even though you've done your work.
If you believe that the significantly higher effort Topping has invested in development and materials for the DX9, and that this has to be paid for with much lower quantities than, for example, with a DX5 II or L30/E30 II stack, is a rip-off, then you should boycott the device,

 

[swim]

It's just sad that people like you want to be paid for their work, but then don't allow others to. It's like your boss or your customers coming to you and simply wanting to pay you 20-30% less, even though you've done your work.
If you believe that the significantly higher effort Topping has invested in development and materials for the DX9, and that this has to be paid for with much lower quantities than, for example, with a DX5 II or L30/E30 II stack, is a rip-off, then you should boycott the device,

sounds like they really got you where they want you. I want the dx9 for the feature set and I just prefer the form factor over the topping a90d/d90 stack and the luxsin x9. I'm going to likely pay $900 for a used one, with slight prejudice. and you're never going to say or do anything to change how I feel about it

 

[Roland68]

sounds like they really got you where they want you. I want the dx9 for the feature set and I just prefer the form factor over the topping a90d/d90 stack and the luxsin x9. I'm going to likely pay $900 for a used one, with slight prejudice. and you're never going to say or do anything to change how I feel about it

I'm one of those people who develop and produce products in the industry and sell them worldwide, both B2B and B2C. Therefore, I understand both costs and calculations, and I appreciate a well-developed device that has also been the subject of extraordinary effort.
Topping couldn't do anything to convince me except do good development work, because I examine every device very closely from the inside, both the components and the circuitry.
You get the same range of functions with the DX5 II for a fraction of the price.

 

[LETRA]

and it looks like they're sorting out the catastrophic bugs by now. But wait, will that even be worth it?

There are no catastrophic bugs in the 15th. There are no bugs. If you have any problems, update the firmware.

 

[LETRA]

Just to note that I replaced the fuse in the Topping DX9 with a Synergistic Research Purple Fuse Slow-Blow 20mm 1A, and the level of detail I've obtained from the very first moment, without any burn-in, is simply amazing. If anyone is skeptical, try buying it at a store with a return policy or come listen to it at my house. Simply impressive.

 

[Veri]

;p

and I suppose you need to replace the fuse on every device in your chain? right? $$$

 

[Roland68]

Just to note that I replaced the fuse in the Topping DX9 with a Synergistic Research Purple Fuse Slow-Blow 20mm 1A, and the level of detail I've obtained from the very first moment, without any burn-in, is simply amazing. If anyone is skeptical, try buying it at a store with a return policy or come listen to it at my house. Simply impressive.

Sorry, but you've been fooled.

We did this three times as a blind test, always with two identical devices. Each time, someone brought along fuses claiming they made a big and very clear difference. One even (allegedly) cost over €1000. In a direct comparison with two devices, one with the original fuse and one with the ridiculously overpriced one, nobody could tell the devices apart without knowing which fuse was installed in which device.

Without a second device and a test without truly blinded conditions, you're only fooling yourself; I figured that out 25 years ago.

 

[ObjectiveSubjectivist]

One even (allegedly) cost over €1000.

1k for a fuse...

Still there are people that can be fooled.

 

[Audiolab800]

Indeed, we are a lot here who think that at such price, buy to buy a RME or another well established pro interface is a much wiser decision. Well, may be except the Sinad record breakers adorator type of guys or the fans of fancy display with vu meters.

Perhaps this one has more outputs... it was the case when I decided to pull the trigger for this one. Oh and the lights are off (no VU, no Sunroof light)

 

[Roland68]

1k for a fuse...

Still there are people that can be fooled.

There have been more expensive fuses for several thousand euros each; compared to those, the Synergistic Research Purple Fuse is a real bargain .

Anyone about to spend their money on such nonsense should engage their brain and actually use it before buying.

- How is a fuse supposed to change the sound of a DAC?

- Every functioning fuse has a defined resistance; even ultra-expensive fuses don't change that, nor do they conduct electricity any better.

- Alternatively, a simple bypass would provide a much greater improvement than any overpriced fuse, if such a thing even exists.

By the way, a 5x20mm section of tubing costs €10-20 in pure silver, €150-300 in gold (depending on the alloy), and just a few cents in copper at a jeweler's/specialty store.
Each of these tubing sections would then have to be sonically superior to any overpriced fuse.

 

[pinger]

Just to note that I replaced the fuse in the Topping DX9 with a Synergistic Research Purple Fuse Slow-Blow 20mm 1A, and the level of detail I've obtained from the very first moment, without any burn-in, is simply amazing. If anyone is skeptical, try buying it at a store with a return policy or come listen to it at my house. Simply impressive.

You cant be serious claiming a fuse affects sound quality. Please tell us you arent.

 

[LETRA]

There have been more expensive fuses for several thousand euros each; compared to those, the Synergistic Research Purple Fuse is a real bargain .

Anyone about to spend their money on such nonsense should engage their brain and actually use it before buying.

- How is a fuse supposed to change the sound of a DAC?

- Every functioning fuse has a defined resistance; even ultra-expensive fuses don't change that, nor do they conduct electricity any better.

- Alternatively, a simple bypass would provide a much greater improvement than any overpriced fuse, if such a thing even exists.

By the way, a 5x20mm section of tubing costs €10-20 in pure silver, €150-300 in gold (depending on the alloy), and just a few cents in copper at a jeweler's/specialty store.
Each of these tubing sections would then have to be sonically superior to any overpriced fuse.

I'll just tell you, because I know that what I've written is an anathema in this forum (not so in many other audio forums on the Internet), that you try things for yourselves before convincing yourselves with the opinions of one or the other. In my case I was skeptical and bought a Synergistic Orange before the Purple. The sound was horrible. A massive veil. So yes, a fuse does dramatically change the sound, in this case for the worse. The instructions and recommendations on the Internet were that the Synergistic Orange needed a burn-in of about 300 hours. As I wasn't willing to suffer for weeks that loss of audio quality in search of the promised land, I researched more and discovered that the Synergistic Purple gave results out of the box (although a 300-hour burn-in is also recommended). And it has been impressive. Yesterday in the early morning in Spain I wrote that message simply to share it simply with those who, like me, love the Topping DX9 15th. It's not magic. It's technology. Better quality of the parts, better sound quality, although the price doesn't match its production cost, but that's capitalism.

 

[ObjectiveSubjectivist]

I'll just tell you, because I know that what I've written is an anathema in this forum (not so in many other audio forums on the Internet), that you try things for yourselves before convincing yourselves with the opinions of one or the other. In my case I was skeptical and bought a Synergistic Orange before the Purple. The sound was horrible. A massive veil. So yes, a fuse does dramatically change the sound, in this case for the worse. The instructions and recommendations on the Internet were that the Synergistic Orange needed a burn-in of about 300 hours. As I wasn't willing to suffer for weeks that loss of audio quality in search of the promised land, I researched more and discovered that the Synergistic Purple gave results out of the box (although a 300-hour burn-in is also recommended). And it has been impressive. Yesterday in the early morning in Spain I wrote that message simply to share it simply with those who, like me, love the Topping DX9 15th. It's not magic. It's technology. Better quality of the parts, better sound quality, although the price doesn't match its production cost, but that's capitalism.

Were your listening test done in a controlled manner?

 

[LETRA]

Were your listening test done in a controlled manner?

No. Nor did I conduct any controlled test to decide that I liked the sound of the Topping DX9 more than that of the Flux Mentor or other headphone amplifiers that I had. It is purely subjective, like 99% of things in life in which I make decisions based on my own experience and perception as an adult. Like when I prefer one food over another, one book or another, or one album or another.

 

[RandomEar]

No. Nor did I conduct any controlled test to decide that I liked the sound of the Topping DX9 more than that of the Flux Mentor or other headphone amplifiers that I had. It is purely subjective, like 99% of things in life in which I make decisions based on my own experience and perception as an adult. Like when I prefer one food over another, one book or another, or one album or another.

There's clear differences between different foods or albums or books. You could technically measure them, although people rarely do. There's no clear differences between DACs or headphone amps which measure transparent.

Our senses are not very reliable. Hearing is one of the worst in that regard. It's fine to use select an excellent headphone amplifier based on subjective criteria and to be happy with it. It's borderline fraud to sell "audiophile fuses" to people claiming any audible difference between them.

 

[LETRA]

In this forum I have learned things, but I also discovered what I call "the Fukuyama fraud", that one who says that we are "at the end of History" and everything can be measured. Since no manufacturer pays me, nor any Intelligence Agency, to establish half-truths, or complete lies in the common sense of ordinary people, I have told you my subjective experience. There are people in other forums who listen with the money they have in the bank, and there are people in all forums who listen to the music with what they read from others in those same forums. For everyone else, shops with right of return. In the EU we have 14 days to return a product without having to give any excuse. You buy it, you try it, and if you agree more with what the science of 2026 says than with what the science will be able to say in 2036, you return it

Best regards.

 

[Geert]

In my case I was skeptical and bought a Synergistic Orange before the Purple. The sound was horrible. A massive veil.

So the Synergistic Orange fuses are designed to degrade the sound?

 

[LETRA]

So the Synergistic Orange fuses are designed to degrade the sound?

There would be several explanations. The most common in the audio world is that being a cheaper model it was made that way on purpose so that people would be willing to pay more money for the superior model that sounds better out of the box. But that's not the case, since the Orange fuse was the superior model until the Purple fuse arrived (and now there's another superior one, the Pink, which I'm not going to buy). The explanation is that they have improved their technology with each new model. Now the improvement is perceived as soon as you install the fuse. Surely with the Orange the company had many returns from people like me who were not willing to wait 300 hours to see the improvements.

Note: between the installation of the Orange and the Purple I went back to the stock fuse, so my comparison is not directly between the Orange and the Purple but between the Orange without burn-in and the Stock (much better the Stock) and between the stock and the Purple without burn-in (much better the Purple).

 

[RandomEar]

In this forum I have learned things, but I also discovered what I call "the Fukuyama fraud", that one who says that we are "at the end of History" and everything can be measured.

That's not a valid comparison, though. Nobody claims there's nothing to improve anymore or that measurement instruments won't improve further - both will happen. The points are that

A) Measurement instruments already are orders of magnitude better, more precise and more sensitive than our hearing. That's not debatable and won't ever change, since instruments - as noted - will only improve further. You can measure sounds so far below our threshold of hearing and so far above our pain threshold. You can measure distortion so far below our best case detection limit that it's hard to put into words. You can measure frequency response deviations orders of magnitude more precise than you will ever be able to detect by ear. This allows fully characterising an audio device. This is also not debatable.

B) There are devices like DACs which, already for quite some time, are 100% transparent. You can exchange one for another from a different company with a different chip and nobody will be able to detect it in a double blind, well controlled test. They sound identical to all humans. This has been shown and - more importantly - the opposite has not been shown by all those claiming they could hear the difference. They failed repeatedly. So we reached this point of transparency already - doesn't mean history is over. Technology simply got that good. It will improve further, but it's already better than human hearing. So all further improvements are more or less the pursuit of engineering perfection or for marketing.

-> At some point, humans learned to fly and they still do. Sometimes, thresholds are reached. Doesn't mean history is over. That's just how it is and why your comparison doesn't fit for the properties of technology we discuss here.

---

Concerning your latest claim: A fuse is a fuse. It's a small piece of wire in a glass or ceramic casing. It's on the AC side of the power supply, so almost any influence that could be imagined would be flattened by the DC conversion anyway. There is absolutely nothing about a fuse that influences sound in any way. It conducts the necessary amount of electricity, or it blows. There's no in-between.

This is the same as weird idea that a power cable could make any detectable difference - to people who are aware of how the technology works, it's astonishingly absurd. Power goes through hundreds of kilometers of wire, dozens of connections, in the air, in the ground, in your house walls. Would you say it's plausible to claim that you can hear if the power flows through the eastern or the western high voltage line of your town? Or can you hear if you power company burns gas today or currently gets all the electricity from hydro? Do you see how absurd that sounds?