Topping DX5II Balanced DAC and Headphone Amp Review

[KokoCollie]

Hey guys, what PCM filter settings are you favouring?

I've been using F-2 for the past few months. My friend just got the device as well based on my recommendation, so i'm reassessing which filter to recommend. I remember F-2 and another one were highly regarded here. I've searched through 15 pages of this thread but can't find what the other one was.

I cannot personally hear a difference, but I'm using F-3 (Linear Phase Fast Roll-Off) due to a comment I saw regarding a video Amir made on the differences between the filters. If you don't hear a difference like I do, I'd set it to F-3 and forget about it, though I do recommend watching the video; it's pretty informative and interesting imho.

Link to the comment: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/topping-dx5-ii.60996/post-2366878

 

[ziggurcat]

@JIW @staticV3

So Topping responded to what I mentioned regarding the DAC streaming issue, and they aren't exactly fighting me on it, but they are blaming the computer (which it isn't, but kind of is at the same time?). Is there any technical information that I could bring back to them that would help them understand? I've mentioned that it isn't something that is specific to any one of their DACs, and it's a broader issue that seems to plague Mac users due to the fact that there is no driver/audio control panel to be able to set the streaming to be always on that way rather than jumping through a variety of different (and unnecessary, IMO) hoops to get the popping to stop. I've also mentioned the XMOS USB Bridge, but that didn't seem to convince them. I also linked that XMOS thread from here as well. They are asking for a video/audio, but with the latest Mac OS (Tahoe 26.1) it has changed slightly in that there's a much longer delay before the popping happens after things have stopped/been paused.

On Sequoia 15.6.X, the popping would happen within a second after pausing/stopping (with Tahoe, it's about 5 or so seconds after). With some craftiness in the Audio MIDI app, I found that there is also a pop when audio has started up -- @JIW , you can test this out yourself by creating an Aggregate or Multi Output profile in the Audio MIDI app with your SMSL PO100/DX5 II, setting the Aggregate/Multi-Output profile as the output device (for both audio and system sounds), but selecting the USB input on the DX5 II (you won't hear any audio, obviously, but you should hear the before/after popping).

Edit:

Apologies, I must correct myself -- they said that the issue may be more complex, they weren't blaming the computer (it was the first thing I read this morning, so my brain hadn't fully de-fuzzed).

 

[JIW]

After some more testing, the PO100 2024 also has issues with exclusive mode in TIDAL. It does sometimes also cut the start but sometimes also has a hick-up within the first second. With exclusive mode in foobar2000, there are no such issues.

EDIT: After restarting the DX5 II and the MacBook Air this no longer occurs.

This has occurred again today. If system output is something else and it is not in exclusive mode, it does not do it. Restarting the DX5 II does not fix it. Restarting the MacBook Air might, since it has been in standby. I will test that at a later time.

 

[JIW]

@JIW @staticV3

So Topping responded to what I mentioned regarding the DAC streaming issue, and they aren't exactly fighting me on it, but they are blaming the computer (which it isn't, but kind of is at the same time?). Is there any technical information that I could bring back to them that would help them understand? I've mentioned that it isn't something that is specific to any one of their DACs, and it's a broader issue that seems to plague Mac users due to the fact that there is no driver/audio control panel to be able to set the streaming to be always on that way rather than jumping through a variety of different (and unnecessary, IMO) hoops to get the popping to stop. I've also mentioned the XMOS USB Bridge, but that didn't seem to convince them. I also linked that XMOS thread from here as well. They are asking for a video/audio, but with the latest Mac OS (Tahoe 26.1) it has changed slightly in that there's a much longer delay before the popping happens after things have stopped/been paused.

On Sequoia 15.6.X, the popping would happen within a second after pausing/stopping (with Tahoe, it's about 5 or so seconds after). With some craftiness in the Audio MIDI app, I found that there is also a pop when audio has started up -- @JIW , you can test this out yourself by creating an Aggregate or Multi Output profile in the Audio MIDI app with your SMSL PO100/DX5 II, setting the Aggregate/Multi-Output profile as the output device (for both audio and system sounds), but selecting the USB input on the DX5 II (you won't hear any audio, obviously, but you should hear the before/after popping).

Edit:

Apologies, I must correct myself -- they said that the issue may be more complex, they weren't blaming the computer (it was the first thing I read this morning, so my brain hadn't fully de-fuzzed).

I have always had a pop with beginning playback. It coincides with audio output so may be masked. Using a low level signal reveals it. Turning the volume all the way down should be enough. It also pops when opening Qobuz or TASCAM Hi-Res Editor and also pops when closing them.

I will get in touch with Topping myself about audio/video recordings.

EDIT: Someone might want to test it on the balanced HPA since there is no connection to ground there.

 

[ziggurcat]

EDIT: Someone might want to test it on the balanced HPA since there is no connection to ground there.

Popping with HPA BAL, no popping with HPA SE. It's probably why I hadn't noticed it until recently since my previous HPA was the L50, and that was SE only (even though it has an XLR connector on the front).

 

[JIW]

Popping with HPA BAL, no popping with HPA SE. It's probably why I hadn't noticed it until recently since my previous HPA was the L50, and that was SE only (even though it has an XLR connector on the front).

I have popping on HPA SE, but not as loud as on the XLR line out. In low gain with HD600, it is subtle enough to miss it, but in high gain with HD598, it is really noticeable.

I may test it with RCA line out connected to speakers, but it seems to come from the DA conversion and is on both the normal and inverted output signal.

 

[ziggurcat]

I have popping on HPA SE, but not as loud as on the XLR line out. In low gain with HD600, it is subtle enough to miss it, but in high gain with HD598, it is really noticeable.

I may test it with RCA line out connected to speakers, but it seems to come from the DA conversion and is on both the normal and inverted output signal.

I'll check High gain when I have a chance to this evening (at work, so I cannot do anything right now). So I could simply not have noticed it since I haven't switched it off of Low gain at all. In all of my testing, I do seem to recall it not being as noticeable on Low gain, and it depended on the volume level (this was with, at the time, my D50 III set to DAC mode, and using the HPA to control the volume on my L50 -- with Medium, and High gain on the L50, it was noticeable a lot sooner on the volume dial for obvious reasons).

Edit:

@JIW -- can confirm the pop is audible when the DX5 II is set to High gain, which would explain why I thought it didn't happen with the HPA SE output. May I ask you to check something for me? WIth your DX5 II connected to your Air laptop via USB, restart the Air via Apple icon > Restart. Observe the screen on the DX5 II and let me know if the screen ever says "UNLOCK" on the bottom. This is normal, but it will indicate something related to my DX5 II disappearing upon restarting my Mac Mini. Every time it has disappeared, "UNLOCK" does not appear on the DX5 II's screen. When I have seen it do that, the DX5 II does not disappear from my list of audio connected devices. @Bauhaus if you would also be so kind as to check that as well. Again, this does not mean I am saying this is a bug, as it could easily be my computer.

Edit 2:

I think it is a me thing. I just changed to a different USB cable (I was using a USB-C to USB-B cable) to a USB-A to USB-B, restarted 5 times in a row (not right away each time), and every time "UNLOCK" showed up on the DX5 II's screen. Seems it was a cable problem [edit: or a problem with the specific USB port on my Mac]

 

[JIW]

I have received the USB isolators. With one, the popping is gone but so is all sound. It seems to pass no signal. With the other, sound is present but so is popping. Thus, it is not a grounding issue.

I also measured the voltage between the ground from the PO100 2024 RCA connector and the RCA connector on a 3.5 mm to 2 x RCA cable out of the MacBook Air's analog output. It is 0.000 V AC and 0.012 V DC with the MBA connected to power as well as the display. Disconnecting those does not change anything for AC voltage but DC voltage drops to 0.011 V when the display is disconnected. With the USB isolator between the PO100 2024 and the MBA, DC voltage fluctuates around +- 2mV, whereas AC voltage is around 470 mV. With the display disconnected, it is around 6 V and fluctuates up to +-100 mV DC. Disconnecting the charger reduces DC fluctuations to +-1 mV with some spikes to around +-10 mV. AC fluctuates between 350 and 650 mV.

Voltage between the PO100 2024 and the DX5II without the USB being connected is 0.000 V AC and 67 mV DC. With the USB isolator between MBA and PO100 2024, DC voltage fluctuates around +-5 mV, but AC voltage is 482 mV. With the USB connected, AC voltage is 0.000 V amd DC voltage is 9 mV. With the USB connected via the isolator, AC voltage is 0.000 V, but DC voltage is 68 mV.

Voltage between the DX5 II and the MBA is 0.000 V AC and DC with charger and display connected. Disconnecting the charger does not change this. Disconnecting the display, AC is 4 mV while AC is 0.000 V. Using the isolator, DC fluctuates up to +- 100 mV and AC is 6 V. With the charger connected but display disconnected AC voltage between MBA and DX5 II was around 86.5 V, DC could not be determined. With the charger removed but the display connected AC is 0 but DC is 56 mV.

There is also 0.000 V AC and DC between the DX5 II's HPA ground and coaxial input ground which has 0 impedance to the ground in the power plug.

Thus, when the MacBook Air is connected to the display, the difference in ground voltage between MacBook Air and the DX5 II is below 0.5 mV AC and DC. Therefore, the USB popping is not related to grounding.

 

[ziggurcat]

The latest response from Topping about the popping:

"Unlike Windows, MAC cannot achieve a continuous data stream by modifying the driver, so we may need to explore further solutions."

I had mentioned that since Windows users can simply change a setting in the audio control panel, that told me that a software solution would be possible. So I think they are at least interested in finding some kind of solution. I'm wondering if it can just be a setting in the DX5 II's menu (à la SPDIF mode, etc...). It could be worth also contacting Apple Support to see if there's a thing they can do in the back end (or by adding a DAC streaming option in the Sound settings).

 

[wavetrade]

Apple Music users have been asking for a direct stream for years. I don't think they are going to help.

 

[Guetta]

Hey everyone,

I’m currently using the first-gen JDS Labs Atom stack (Atom Amp + Atom DAC) with my Beyerdynamic DT 1990 Pro, and it’s been great.

I’m thinking about switching to the Topping DX5II mainly because I really like the design and having everything in one unit. On paper it measures extremely well, but I’m not sure if it would actually sound any better than the Atom stack in real listening.

Has anyone made this upgrade, or compared them directly?

Would the DX5II give me any audible improvement with the Beyerdynamic DT 1990 Pro, or would it just be a side-grade that looks nicer on the desk?

Any advice or experience would be appreciated!

 

[ziggurcat]

Hey everyone,

I’m currently using the first-gen JDS Labs Atom stack (Atom Amp + Atom DAC) with my Beyerdynamic DT 1990 Pro, and it’s been great.

I’m thinking about switching to the Topping DX5II mainly because I really like the design and having everything in one unit. On paper it measures extremely well, but I’m not sure if it would actually sound any better than the Atom stack in real listening.

Has anyone made this upgrade, or compared them directly?

Would the DX5II give me any audible improvement with the Beyerdynamic DT 1990 Pro, or would it just be a side-grade that looks nicer on the desk?

Any advice or experience would be appreciated!

Looking at the review of the Atom DAC+ here (not sure if that's a different model?), you're likely not going to hear any audible difference.

 

[Guetta]

Looking at the review of the Atom DAC+ here (not sure if that's a different model?), you're likely not going to hear any audible difference.

This is the first gen DAC actually

JDS Labs Atom DAC Review

This is a review and detailed measurements of the JDS Labs Atom DAC. It was kindly sent to me by the company and costs US $99. As the name indicates, this is the long anticipated companion to the JDS Labs Atom headphone amplifier: I like the big circle but oddly, it is not a switch. There...

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[ziggurcat]

This is the first gen DAC actually

JDS Labs Atom DAC Review

This is a review and detailed measurements of the JDS Labs Atom DAC. It was kindly sent to me by the company and costs US $99. As the name indicates, this is the long anticipated companion to the JDS Labs Atom headphone amplifier: I like the big circle but oddly, it is not a switch. There...

www.audiosciencereview.com

Looking at that, I would probably still say you're not going to hear any audible difference.

 

[Berwhale]

Would the DX5II give me any audible improvement with the Beyerdynamic DT 1990 Pro, or would it just be a side-grade that looks nicer on the desk?

The PEQ capability of the DX5 II has the potential to improve the DT 1990 Pro (and many other headphones). However the DT 1990 Pro suffers from high distortion in the lower frequencies and these are the frequencies one would likely want to boost to match most peoples preference. This makes the DT 1990 Pro difficult to correct with PEQ.

In terms of frequency response alone, it would probably make more sense to invest in some other headphones which conform more closely to the Harman preference curve, that are more accommodating of PEQ so they can be tuned to your own preference. Something like the Sennheiser HD560S are relatively cheap and might fit the bill (although the HD 560 S also suffers from distortion in the lower frequencies, it's much less than the DT 1990 PRO and its confined below 50hz).

Amir's review and measurements of DT 1990 PRO: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...erdynamic-dt-1990-pro-headphone-review.54872/

Amir's review and measurements of HD 560 S: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/sennheiser-hd560s-review-headphone.29603/

Note: See the Total Harmonic Distortion (THD) graphs from these reviews to compare the bass distortion.

Also, depending on what you are driving the Atom stack from, there are various software PEQ solutions that you can play with before spending any money at all.... https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ows-linux-macos-ios-ipados-and-android.18450/

 

[Guetta]

The PEQ capability of the DX5 II has the potential to improve the DT 1990 Pro (and many other headphones). However the DT 1990 Pro suffers from high distortion in the lower frequencies and these are the frequencies one would likely want to boost to match most peoples preference. This makes the DT 1990 Pro difficult to correct with PEQ.

In terms of frequency response alone, it would probably make more sense to invest in some other headphones which conform more closely to the Harman preference curve, that are more accommodating of PEQ so they can be tuned to your own preference. Something like the Sennheiser HD560S are relatively cheap and might fit the bill (although the HD 560 S also suffers from distortion in the lower frequencies, it's much less than the DT 1990 PRO and its confined below 50hz).

Amir's review and measurements of DT 1990 PRO: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...erdynamic-dt-1990-pro-headphone-review.54872/

Amir's review and measurements of HD 560 S: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/sennheiser-hd560s-review-headphone.29603/

Note: See the Total Harmonic Distortion (THD) graphs from these reviews to compare the bass distortion.

Also, depending on what you are driving the Atom stack from, there are various software PEQ solutions that you can play with before spending any money at all.... https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ows-linux-macos-ios-ipados-and-android.18450/

The DT 1990 second generation brings noticeably improved drivers, better dynamic control, and more refined detail retrieval, with particular focus on reducing distortion and smoothing the treble. The impedance has also been updated to 30 ohms from the previous 250-ohm design, making them far easier to drive while retaining their resolution.

As for Amir’s measurements, I respect the data, but these headphones perform well enough that you don’t need a graph to appreciate the difference. Compare them directly with other models in this price range, and even higher, and the strengths are obvious. I recently borrowed a few Sennheiser models from a friend in the hi-fi business, and while they’re excellent in their own right, I personally prefer Beyerdynamic’s tuning and the level of detail they deliver.

Ultimately, it comes down to individual preference rather than declaring one brand universally “better.” Each listener gravitates toward the sound signature that resonates with them.

 

[ziggurcat]

Apple Music users have been asking for a direct stream for years. I don't think they are going to help.

I think there's a difference between something that would be a nice feature to have, and a functional issue/problem.

 

[wavetrade]

I think there's a difference between something that would be a nice feature to have, and a functional issue/problem.

I am not getting how Apple has a functional issue or problem here. I have three Mac's using three different brands of dac's. None of them pop or have any issues. With that said I have had a couple of dac's that did pop. I am wanting a DX5 II and hoping it isn't one of them.

 

[ziggurcat]

I am not getting how Apple has a functional issue or problem here. I have three Mac's using three different brands of dac's. None of them pop or have any issues. With that said I have had a couple of dac's that did pop. I am wanting a DX5 II and hoping it isn't one of them.

On Windows, you can change the DAC streaming in the driver to be always on rather than only on when needed. Since there are no drivers, technically (I'm guessing because they want to have more control over things), Apple can tweak whatever their equivalent to a driver happens to be to either add an option in the Sound settings for people set the DAC streaming to be always on or they do it in the background/under the hood. I will refer you to this post:

XMOS driver settings for no cutoff/delay

Es apsvēru iespēju izveidot sava veida "pamācību" visiem XMOS draiveriem ierīcēs, kurām ir nogrieznis — latentums starp skaņas sākumu un dac "reaģēšanu" un šīs skaņas atskaņošanu... Tātad šeit tas ir: XMOS draiveri izmanto vadības paneli, kas atšķiras no šī: Parasti izvēlnes "Opcijas", kas ir...

www.audiosciencereview.com

You might need to pay a little closer attention, then because the popping is there. It's there on my Mac Mini M1, and it's there on my Macbook Air M2. It's there with three different Topping DACs, and it was also there with an SMSL RAW MDA-1. I'm also not the only one who has this problem.

 

[Berwhale]

The DT 1990 second generation brings noticeably improved drivers, better dynamic control, and more refined detail retrieval, with particular focus on reducing distortion and smoothing the treble. The impedance has also been updated to 30 ohms from the previous 250-ohm design, making them far easier to drive while retaining their resolution.

As for Amir’s measurements, I respect the data, but these headphones perform well enough that you don’t need a graph to appreciate the difference. Compare them directly with other models in this price range, and even higher, and the strengths are obvious. I recently borrowed a few Sennheiser models from a friend in the hi-fi business, and while they’re excellent in their own right, I personally prefer Beyerdynamic’s tuning and the level of detail they deliver.

Ultimately, it comes down to individual preference rather than declaring one brand universally “better.” Each listener gravitates toward the sound signature that resonates with them.

Well it sounds like you have all the answers already. I wish you well on your audio journey.