ziggurcat
Major Contributor
I'm waiting for them to reboot their MX series.
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Topping DX5II Balanced DAC and Headphone Amp Review
- Thread starter amirm
- Start date
I'm waiting for them to reboot their MX series.
ziggurcat
Major Contributor
It isn’t informative, but I just wanted to show off how tidy my stack has become thanks to the DX5 II being the perfect size on my rack
I have a very satisfying video of all the audio visualisers / VU meters on all three units moving, but I can only attach it as a Google drive link I’m afraid:
IMG_7872.MOV
drive.google.com
That's quite the headphone cable -- I think I found it online, and just ordered the 3.5mm to 4-pin XLR with the blue/grey braid.
Any chance you could post a link as I was just thinking this morning about doing the same.
ziggurcat
Major Contributor
This is the version I got. You can find the purple one there with a quick search. It's on sale right now, and I added an extra coupon, so it was $54 CAD for me. I'm not one of those people who think that a more expensive cable = better sound, but I am generally okay spending a bit of $$ on one that is aesthetically pleasing.
I did happen to find other links that had the same cable for a bit less, so shop around.
ziggurcat
Major Contributor
And another update on the hiss issue:
They were finally able to reproduce the issue, and they sent me a beta FW to test. I'll test it out when I have the time. (it's going to be a very busy week in the ol' art studio as I try to meet a few deadlines).
Edit:
I just decided to test it out right away because work be damned. The beta FW appears to have fixed the problem!
Edit 2:
And HOLY S*** it also fixed the popping issue I was having that forced me to add a USB DDC into the connection chain. Now I can fully run my DX5 II from USB with my Mac, and not have to deal with any popping!
I may have spoken too soon. No idea why, but the popping came back.
Edit 3:
A few weird things I have recently discovered about the popping is it will not happen if I use the HPA SE output, but it will happen if I use the LO SE output (it obviously happens with the HPA BAL and LO BAL outputs, too since those are the outputs I've been using). Also, when playing from local files, or system notification sound, the pop will happen only a second after audio has been paused/stopped. From a web-based source, I noticed it will pop after about 10 or so seconds (previously, I had not noticed it with any web-based source).
I want to stress that I'm not claiming this is a bug -- or even a potential one -- with the Topping device as I am almost certain that this is a Mac issue (it was first discovered almost by accident when I was using a D50 III DAC), but if anyone that uses a Mac can check whether they hear any pops when pausing/stopping music from their local files (or test the system notification sounds) to see if it's just me, that'd be very helpful. I'm only asking again because of the fact that the popping was legit gone for a little bit after I installed the beta FW, and I have no idea why it returned.
Now, it is a faint pop (it's more audible with speakers, but you need to have your ear, at most, 6 inches away from the speaker drivers), so it may require a bit more focused attention to catch. I've even asked on the Apple forums, and no one seems to know anything, and the one suggestion didn't resolve anything. No fancy connections necessary, just straight USB from Mac to DAC (I'm using a USB C to USB-B cable). My best guess at this point is it us related to whatever USB audio driver Apple uses, but that's a total guess.
They were finally able to reproduce the issue, and they sent me a beta FW to test. I'll test it out when I have the time. (it's going to be a very busy week in the ol' art studio as I try to meet a few deadlines).
Edit:
I just decided to test it out right away because work be damned. The beta FW appears to have fixed the problem!
Edit 2:
I may have spoken too soon. No idea why, but the popping came back.
Edit 3:
A few weird things I have recently discovered about the popping is it will not happen if I use the HPA SE output, but it will happen if I use the LO SE output (it obviously happens with the HPA BAL and LO BAL outputs, too since those are the outputs I've been using). Also, when playing from local files, or system notification sound, the pop will happen only a second after audio has been paused/stopped. From a web-based source, I noticed it will pop after about 10 or so seconds (previously, I had not noticed it with any web-based source).
I want to stress that I'm not claiming this is a bug -- or even a potential one -- with the Topping device as I am almost certain that this is a Mac issue (it was first discovered almost by accident when I was using a D50 III DAC), but if anyone that uses a Mac can check whether they hear any pops when pausing/stopping music from their local files (or test the system notification sounds) to see if it's just me, that'd be very helpful. I'm only asking again because of the fact that the popping was legit gone for a little bit after I installed the beta FW, and I have no idea why it returned.
Now, it is a faint pop (it's more audible with speakers, but you need to have your ear, at most, 6 inches away from the speaker drivers), so it may require a bit more focused attention to catch. I've even asked on the Apple forums, and no one seems to know anything, and the one suggestion didn't resolve anything. No fancy connections necessary, just straight USB from Mac to DAC (I'm using a USB C to USB-B cable). My best guess at this point is it us related to whatever USB audio driver Apple uses, but that's a total guess.
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There is setting on the Windows Topping USB Audio Device Control Panel to keep a stream of data going to the DAC, even when nothing is playing in Windows. In some cases this can prevent popping. But I think you are already aware of this as you posted in one of threads I was going to link to. Also, the Topping software is a branded copy of the Thesycon driver and Thesycon don't make drivers for Mac. I guess you'll have to wait for Topping to work out a solution.
ziggurcat
Major Contributor
I'm 99.9% certain it's a Mac issue, but I might just ask Topping if they have any thoughts (again, so no one jumps down my throat -- I'm not saying it's a bug with their devices). I was so incredibly happy when I didn't hear it earlier -- buzzing with excitement, actually -- only to have my hopes crushed when I heard it again. I thought Topping low key indirectly fixed it when they fixed the hissing issue with this beta FW.
Edit:
I just saw a new Mac OS update (26.1 Tahoe), and I've finished that process. To a certain extent, it has "improved" in that now there's about a 5-10 second delay before any pop happens with local files... and it's a longer delay with web-based sources.
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KokoCollie
Member
It’s the Tripowin Granvia. It feels excellently made, better made than some significantly more expensive options I’ve gotten to try out. Highly recommend it!
This really does sound like the stream shutting down and the DAC chip effectively turning off. IIRC someone on ASR did propose an approach to fix this on Mac. It probably involved sending a stream of 0's to the DAC, even when nothing is playing. I'll have a search...
Found this, have tried the MacClick solution?
I'm not a Mac guy, but looking at the project, i'm guessing it constantly plays silence like I suggested above (see silence.mp3 below)...
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Roland68
Major Contributor
I operate and test DACs with two Macs, an M2 mini, and an older MacBook Pro. I've never experienced this crackling or other interference with any of them, except for the old SMSL Sanskrit 10th MK I or II.
This also included three DX5 II from friends, as well as over 50 other USB DACs from SMSL, Sabaj, Loxjie, Topping, Gustard, Singxer, and other manufacturers, including some significantly more expensive ones.
In most cases, this is a grounding issue, even though the users affected usually don't want to admit it.
Create galvanic isolation by inserting a short TOSLINK connection between the Mac/PC and the USB DAC. If the crackling disappears, you can assume it's a grounding problem.
I have the popping as well. I have an M1 MacBook Air with macOS 15.7.2 using a USB C hub and USB A to USB B cable. It also happens on HPA SE. It can be circumvented by installing TASCAM Hi-Res Editor or using Qobuz. See
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...for-no-cutoff-delay.25838/page-3#post-1831257
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...for-no-cutoff-delay.25838/page-4#post-2219482
Turning off the speakers does not change it occurring over HPA SE. Disconnecting the XLR cables to the speakers, does not either.
I have had some intermittent pops with web based content on Firefox 145.0.2, but found no clear pattern - 1 every minute maybe and typically not centered - sometimes all the way right or left. Also, they are at a lower level than the playback start/stop pops. Using TASCAM Hi-Res Editor does not resolve this. With Safari 26.1, there is start/stop popping after 8 s or so of stopping, but still some intermittent popping. Using TASCAM Hi-Res Editor does not resolve this either. Even just using TASCAM Hi-Res Editor with no sound playing, I get some intermittent pops. So they might come from the headphones moving around on my head even slightly.
There are many reports of popping sounds from DACs when music stops or starts (or between tracks) on both Windows and MacOS on the internet. The symptoms are not the same as ground loop noise or noise being passed from a PC via USB shielding.
I think the popping issue is worse for those that like to use exclusive mode for audio (perhaps because they are chasing 'bit perfect'). Personally, i've always used shared audio because I used eAPO for whole system PEQ. I think the OS is always streaming something to the DAC, regardless of any app playing anything, so the issue is avoided.
Enabling AlwaysOn streaming in the Thesycon control panel in Windows seems to fix the issue for many (i'm guessing they are the ones using ASIO or one of the exclusive modes of other drivers). A solution playing a silent MP3 file on a Mac also appears to work.
I have disconnected everything grounded other than the DX5 II from my power strip, disconnected the MacBook from the power supply and also disconnected the HDMI connection to the screen. I have also disconnected the XLR cables going to the speakers. The popping is still there.
I have connected it directly to an outlet and run the MacBook on battery. The popping is still there.
ziggurcat
Major Contributor
I have not seen that, and I will try it out. I did try the Qobuz trick that @JIW discovered with the SMSL RAW MDA-1, but it didn't resolve the issue with my Topping DACs, unfortunately (though seeing @JIW 's posts again, I may have missed an important step).
I am currently using a Topping D10s in between my Mac and DAC that does 100% eliminate the popping. I have a SMSL PO100 Pro that also does the trick, but I like the look/feel of the D10s instead. I will bring my Air M2 and the DX5 II to work to see if it happens in a completely different environment. I can even connect the DX5 II to a PC at work. If it doesn't happen in either of those scenarios, then I definitely need to figure out what to do at home to fix the problem. If you recall, this all came to light when I added the 3e A7 into my desktop system. One of those tests was connecting everything to my M2 Air (connection was Air >> USB >> DAC >> TRS >> 3e A7 amp >> passive speakers), but I ran the Air off of its battery, and the issue still happened (this was done to see if it was specifically my M1 Mini).
Additionally, when I was doing all of that testing, it was with a D50 III DAC, and there were two audible pops. With the DX5 II, there's only one pop, and it isn't as audible (if either of those things are clues). Under the new Tahoe 26.1 OS, there's an additional delay prior to the pop happening (5 or so seconds instead of about 1 second).
One of the very first things I tried was the Qobuz trick because when I tried out a SMSL RAW MDA-1, simply booting the app did the trick with that device. However reading your post in the first link makes me think I might have missed an important step (i.e. setting the output device in the app -- with the RAW MDA-1 I don't think that was necessary). I will try it again when I get home later tonight, and check out the TASCAM Hi-Res Editor. I don't love the idea of having an app always running in the background like that, though. However, if it does stop the pop once I made sure I've done it correctly, that is something I can bring to Topping since it could be something they can probably tweak via FW.
Is this dual 3.5mm to 4.4mm?
ziggurcat
Major Contributor
Yes, you can select that as an option (pick 3.5mm under "Color" at either the 1.5m or 2m cable lengths, and 4.4mm under "Size"). I personally selected 3.5mm to 4-pin XLR.
Roland68
Major Contributor
Unfortunately, that doesn't tell us whether it's a grounding issue.
The first test would be to galvanically isolate the connection between the PC and Mac using a Toslink cable.
Also, read what @ziggurcat just wrote; he has some experience with this.
As has been said several times already:
- Grounding problems are always related to multiple devices.
- Just because the crackling disappears when you remove or replace a specific device doesn't mean that device is solely responsible.
TASCAM Hi-Res Editor uses a lot of CPU even just idling and hidden. Around 10 %. Qobuz is much more efficient doing the same at below 1 % for the most part.
That would also circumvent the USB receiver chip, which is the source of the clicking unless it goes MacBook Air -> USB -> Toslink -> USB -> DX5 II. Since the Toslink to USB step would need to be powered that would make isolation more difficult. A USB isolator might be more appropriate for testing USB input.
Using my multimeter, I measured between the ground in the MacBook Air's headphone output using the connection to sleeve on a cable and get around 3.5-4 V AC on the power strip, but only around 350-400 mV AC at the wall socket.
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