Topping DX5II Balanced DAC and Headphone Amp Review

[Power Pop 23]

I can't understand why @TOPPING doesn't recruit a group of 15-20 very active users as beta testers instead of constantly releasing flawed and buggy versions.

Indeed. Instead @TOPPING (probably) reads postings from owners.

Ideally, of course, with beta hardware, in case something needs to be changed for final production.
@TOPPING seems to have no experience with proper specifications and a professional approach to such developments.
I would never have released such a product for production if the software and hardware weren't flawless.

But as the saying goes, no risk, no fun...

I don't expect the software to be flawless upon release. It should have been flawless soon thereafter. I can only surmise @TOPPING cannot or will not devote more resources to developing software and firmware.

As the owner of a 'game-changing' Topping PA5 amplifier, I now let 6 to 12 months pass after introduction before I consider gear from Topping Audio.

 

[Berwhale]

Another test...

1. Left all 5 default configs, added MTM (EQ6) and HD660S (EQ7) to User Configs in T.T (copied from Local Configs).
2. Confirmed that correct PEQ was applied when switching to the appropriate output (LO BAL or HPA BAL).
3. Confirmed that all 7 PEQs were visible in the DX5 II UI and switched between them all.
4. Closed T.T.
5. Did a soft power off and on by long pressing volume button.
6. Opened T.T.

Result: MTM and HD660S configs disappeared from DX5 II UI, but are still showing in T.T! If I click on the MTM or HDD660S configs in T.T, it does nothing on the DX5 II (selecting one of the default configs in T.T is reflected on the DX5 II display).

That's all I have time for today

 

[jodrim]

Yeah same issue for me I think. It randomly changed some gain sliders to +12 and -12 dB after restarting

Before on left and after restart on right:
View attachment 483472View attachment 483471

Doing some quick maths it seems like it multiplied all gain levels (except preamp) by 5. Looking at EQ9 it went from -1.8 to -1.8*5 = -9

Edit: I can consistently get this bug to happen by
1. Exiting Topping Tune in Windows
2. Restarting DX5 with power switch
3. Opening Topping Tune.

Doesn't seem to happen if I just turn Topping Tune or the device on/off it has to be that specific sequence

I'm on DX5 II firmware V1.76 and Topping Tune V1.09

After testing listening to it a bit it seems to only be a bug in Topping Tune because it doesn't actually apply those high gain values to the device. When using a simple 2.4 dB peak EQ at 108 Hz on my already quite boxy HD 620S and doing the steps to get the 12 dB bug to appear, so the 2.4 dB multiplies to12 dB, it doesn't sound any boxier. But if I toggle the 105 Hz 12dB EQ on and off with the checkbox in the UI then it's sounds very boxy. So I don't think there's any risk of headphones or speakers blowing up. At least not by restarting the device but maybe by inadvertently toggling those high gain sliders.

 

[Roland68]

Indeed. Instead @TOPPING (probably) reads postings from owners.


I don't expect the software to be flawless upon release. It should have been flawless soon thereafter. I can only surmise @TOPPING cannot or will not devote more resources to developing software and firmware.

As the owner of a 'game-changing' Topping PA5 amplifier, I now let 6 to 12 months pass after introduction before I consider gear from Topping Audio.

However, the software must be tested to the extent that it is guaranteed that the hardware will work properly with it.

Currently, no one can say whether this is actually the case.
Let's hope for the sake of DX5 II users and Topping that this is the case and that no hardware changes are necessary.

 

[Timbo2]

I tried repeating your steps to reproduce you issue, but got another outcome...

Before: 2x User Configs for iLoud MTM and HD660S (5 default user configs deleted)

Close T.T (minimize to systray and autostart are both disabled), power off DX5 II using back switch, wait 10 seconds, power on DX5 II, open T.T

After: 2x user config disappeared, 5 default user configs back in place.



*edit*

I repeated the above, but I left the 5 default user configs in place (so MTM and HD660s are EQ6 & 7). The outcome is the same in Topping Tune, only the 5 default User Configs are displayed. However, the DX5 II is still switching between EQ6 & 7 when switching output (I made sure that PEQ memory was working before executing the test). So the EQ configs are still on the DX5 II and they both sound correct as far as I can tell with my ears, they are just not being shown in Topping Tune.

I’ve had that bug on older firmware and older versions of Topping Tune. I don’t think it is new to 1.09.

 

[Mario1969]

do this experiment
1) Turn off POWER UP / AUTO RUN in the Topping Tune settings...
2) Then turn off the computer and DX5 using the rear switch...
3) Turn them back on so that T T does not load during startup ,
4) turn on PEQ with the remote control
5) Turn down the volume. Connect your headphones ... you will hear what happens.

 

[ziggurcat]

It's a shame to hear about the issues with this unit. If not for the issues and personal concerns about when/if I'd ever receive one from China, I decided to order an S.M.S.L. Raw MDA1 instead. It will be here tomorrow and my fingers are crossed that it'll be trouble free. Not much good to have near perfect measuring inexpensive gear if it doesn't work properly or last long...

If you're a Mac user, I wouldn't expect it to be trouble-free because they don't believe Mac users exist. On PC, though, make sure you go into the device's audio control panel, and change the DAC streaming to be always on otherwise you're going to hear a pop every time audio stops/is paused (this includes system notification sounds). Mac users don't have the luxury of doing that, so it will always pop (I know because I tried one out for a few days).

But this is all a discussion for a different thread.

 

[Berwhale]

I’ve had that bug on older firmware and older versions of Topping Tune. I don’t think it is new to 1.09.

I wasn't suggesting this was a new bug, I just wanted to document what was happening. Usually, my DX5 II goes to sleep with my PC (I don't turn it off physically) and 90% of the time I have no issues. The 10% where I lose my PEQ is bearable for now (I have to re-store PEQ to the DX5 II every ~10 days).

 

[Rick63]

If you're a Mac user, I wouldn't expect it to be trouble-free because they don't believe Mac users exist. On PC, though, make sure you go into the device's audio control panel, and change the DAC streaming to be always on otherwise you're going to hear a pop every time audio stops/is paused (this includes system notification sounds). Mac users don't have the luxury of doing that, so it will always pop (I know because I tried one out for a few days).

But this is all a discussion for a different thread.

I don't use my DACs for anything other than the optical and coaxial inputs. I don't even own a PC anymore.

 

[Madragon]

The fact that there’s a warning about dB spikes when not limiting the sampling rate in Topping Tune, and that they also mentioned a supposedly fixed bug in the DX5 II firmware that caused dB increases when switching EQ settings, had already made me a bit concerned. We’re not just talking about damaging equipment, we’re also talking about potentially damaging your hearing.

 

[audiofun]

I bought in early June but returned it four months ago, hoping to buy it again a few months later, when they fix most of the bugs.
after checking this thread today, I realize it still not a good time to click the order button.

 

[delta76]

I can't understand why @TOPPING doesn't recruit a group of 15-20 very active users as beta testers instead of constantly releasing flawed and buggy versions.

Ideally, of course, with beta hardware, in case something needs to be changed for final production.
@TOPPING seems to have no experience with proper specifications and a professional approach to such developments.
I would never have released such a product for production if the software and hardware weren't flawless.

But as the saying goes, no risk, no fun...

Who could have thought proper QA costs money, and time. Which is money itself. Why not release immature incomplete products and let the buyers buy and test them. And fix some of the bugs before your next shiny product is released and your less then 2y product EOL? Isn't that more cost effective and let you sell more?

 

[Mario1969]

Who could have thought proper QA costs money, and time. Which is money itself. Why not release immature incomplete products and let the buyers buy and test them. And fix some of the bugs before your next shiny product is release and your less then 2y product EOL? Isn't that more cost effective and let you sell more?

That may be true... just like with HifiMan headphones. There are many versions of the same headphones and it's unclear which ones are the best. After some time, it turns out that none of them are... but the same product with minor changes has been sold several times under different names.

 

[delta76]

That may be true... just like with HifiMan headphones. There are many versions of the same headphones and it's unclear which ones are the best. After some time, it turns out that none of them are... but the same product with minor changes has been sold several times under different names.

if you watch for a while, you realize the strategy of flooding markets with products with a lot of overlap and short product time. It's almost a culture in China. You have to push out new products every 6 months, or go bankrupt. The market is extremely competitive and if you don't make the news every other week, you're out.
I'm interested in this DAC+HP amp, but the more I read about it, the more I think I should go with RME instead.

 

[Mario1969]

if you watch for a while, you realize the strategy of flooding markets with products with a lot of overlap and short product time. It's almost a culture in China. You have to push out new products every 6 months, or go bankrupt. The market is extremely competitive and if you don't make the news every other week, you're out.
I'm interested in this DAC+HP amp, but the more I read about it, the more I think I should go with RME instead.

So far, the DX5 II works well, there are only problems with PEQ... although this is one of the main features of this device.

RME = reliability, great drivers, long-term support... I've had two RME devices ,never let me down.

 

[Timbo2]

if you watch for a while, you realize the strategy of flooding markets with products with a lot of overlap and short product time. It's almost a culture in China. You have to push out new products every 6 months, or go bankrupt. The market is extremely competitive and if you don't make the news every other week, you're out.
I'm interested in this DAC+HP amp, but the more I read about it, the more I think I should go with RME instead.

I would agree with @Mario1969.

RME
1. Stable, long term support.
2. Well tested, long track record.
3. Roughly 3x the cost, however.

DX5II
1. More amplifier power
2. More PEQ filters (when they work) . Also more flexibility as two of the RME filters are shelf only and I believe 7 filters total.
3. Bluetooth including LDAC protocol. - If you need this, and I do, this makes the DX5II much more compelling.
4. Roughly 1/3rd the cost, but be prepared to be a beta tester for PEQ.

If you don't care about the cost and want it to "just work" the RME is the way to go. Most people don't need the extra power or the Bluetooth.

 

[audiofun]

I would agree with @Mario1969.

RME
1. Stable, long term support.
2. Well tested, long track record.
3. Roughly 3x the cost, however.

DX5II
1. More amplifier power
2. More PEQ filters (when they work) . Also more flexibility as two of the RME filters are shelf only and I believe 7 filters total.
3. Bluetooth including LDAC protocol. - If you need this, and I do, this makes the DX5II much more compelling.
4. Roughly 1/3rd the cost, but be prepared to be a beta tester for PEQ.

If you don't care about the cost and want it to "just work" the RME is the way to go. Most people don't need the extra power or the Bluetooth.

I believe Loudness and Crossfeed are more useful features of the RME, which is completely missing in DX5II. 7-band eq, although not as great as 10, is enough for most use cases.

 

[teleblaze]

I believe Loudness and Crossfeed are more useful features of the RME, which is completely missing in DX5II. 7-band eq, although not as great as 10, is enough for most use cases.

How useful is Loudness for headphones? I'm quite interested in it as I like to listen to music at low levels since I have sensitive ears and tinnitus.

 

[respice finem]

How useful is Loudness for headphones? I'm quite interested in it as I like to listen to music at low levels since I have sensitive ears and tinnitus.

Very useful IMHO - the quieter you are listening, the more useful.

 

[teleblaze]

Very useful IMHO - the quieter you are listening, the more useful.

Fuck.

I'm on the fence regarding my next purchase and obviously this market is saturated with amazing value compared to years past, but there is a part of me that wants to purchase the RME over the DX5 II (disappointed with the bugs and read that the sound can be harsh), FiiO K13 r2r and the T71. I just can't justify it completely, you know.