I agree that measurements on the RCA should have been done, but I think you're being a bit hyperbolic.
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Topping DX1 II DAC & HP Amp Review
- Thread starter amirm
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Pausi
Active Member
When half done measurements show the sunny side and facts from users and responses from Topping show the dark side you call me hyperbolic. I can live with that.
OP
- Thread Starter
- #323
You didn't bother to read the review it seems:
One of the key innovations from Topping is to bring us balanced output in this price range. So I focused the rest of my testing on that and showed that it worked perfectly. If you have no need for that, and the rest of the features that make the DX1 II unique, then you should move on and buy plenty of other simple DACs out there.
Someone else did measurements of the RCA in another review and it performed pretty well. I still think you're blowing up the software issues with this device out of proportion considering it's otherwise stellar measurements and performance. You and others are far too fixated on relatively minor issues that are very likely to be ironed out with software updates given Topping's solid track record at this point. Yes, maybe Amir should have reviewed the RCA connections a bit more, but even WITHOUT the RCA outputs this device is kind of ridiculous for what it offers at its price point. You are missing the forest for the trees.
OP
- Thread Starter
- #325
Nonsense. I not only ran a suite of measurements, I also listened to it. It was perfect in every regard other than RCA out showing some grounding noise with my analyzer.
I am not here for this product or any other, as a reliability tester. If a problem shows up during my testing, I note it. Otherwise, I provide a free platform for you all to do that. But you have to do it responsibly and not resort to incorrect statements. If you do, I will correct you. Responsibility goes both ways.
It's honestly kinda shocking they haven't pulled the latest firmware with how it can give people heart attacks at 48kHz (and apparently multiples of it), wonder if we're even getting a new firmware this week, it's Friday in China now. I contacted them about this last week Thursday night.
OP
- Thread Starter
- #327
That's only because you are new here and don't know about the dozen times we have gone through this argument. No way, no how have I or any other reviewer has signed up to do reliability testing. If a device passes my extensive testing without failure, then that is that. If it doesn't fail that way, it means we are talking about corner bugs, not mainstream functionality. As I just noted, that is for you all to do. Don't put it my shoulders.
And no, I will not change the review because of things you all report as they are not what I have found. My assessment must be based on objective facts during the review. Which DX1 II passed with flying colors.
Again I am running latest version 96 kHz daily without issues here. Do not generalize.
OP
- Thread Starter
- #329
That's completely wrong. The most common sample rate for music streaming is 44.1 KHz because that is what the music is mastered for (CD). You only get access to higher sample rate in premium lossless/high-res tier.
For youtube video, if you are consuming that through the browser, then you are using the OS pipeline. There, you can set the sample rate to anything. Set it to 44.1 kHz and you will avoid the 48 kHz.
And I thought the 48 kHz issue was limited to Toslink. It certainly didn't show up in my Jitter and THD+N vs Frequency which use 48 kHz sampling.
It is this kind of sloppy posting that is getting me to respond to you all. You arguing while misstating the most basic facts here.
Bleib reproduces the issue at 96kHz and 48kHz, so I'm not sure how this is explainable. Again Topping also says it's an issue in the firmware, which doesn't vary between units.
You have the issue at 48kHz but not 96kHz?
You're using USB as the input for audio?
No, if anything Toslink is free from the issue.
Mike123 had to do USB to trigger the issue, and it takes over an hour to start happening.
Pausi
Active Member
I stand corrected. Maybe it all boils down to hit or miss in QA and QC from Topping, causing some to receive faulty hardware while others seem to have perfectly running specimens, even though both are running the same firmware.
Well so far everyone who said they don't haven't:
1. Used USB input for audio.
2. For at least 2 hours.
3. On the latest firmware (which wasn't even released at the time of Amir's review/testing).
4. At 48kHz.
Unless Matias is now saying these are the conditions he followed.
Hardware issue would be even worse for Toppings reputation, and isn't what I believe the issue is nor does Topping, unless they're wrong or lying.
I did my review initially from RCA outputs only, since it was buzzing from XLR out. You can check how it performs.
Bleib
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In my testing I just put a very long list of music on Foobar, lower the volume and just wait for it to occur.
My guess is 192 has the issue as well as 384 kHz
The things that have improved:
CD-support (44.1 audio) through optical
https://home.toppingaudio.com/ webpage. Early on it required logging in constantly.. now it's much easier to use
Just got a DX1 II:
I can confirm changing the setting 5.11 to OPT U-2 does enable volume control on the optical output which is quite rare! (All new DACS should have this feature as there are more and more speakers with digital inputs nowadays)
I have the DX1 II and just tested optical output to a cheap optical to s/pdif converter to my Neumann speakers via the digital in: and the volume control/remote volume control works to control the volume to the Neumann speakers digitally!
For the price: this may make this the cheapest digital volume control for digital speakers that there is and it has a remote control too!
The only downside is that when you switch to headphones: it still mirrors the output level of the headphone out - so when you turn up your headphone volume: the optical output volume goes up and your speakers turn up too which means you need to power off your speakers if you don't want them playing at the same time as your headphones.
I hope they can update the firmware to turn off the optical output when the phones only output is selected (or have an option to do either) - that way you can use LO for optical volume control for speakers, and phones out for headphone output without having your speaker volume go up when you turn the phones up.
I will admit my DX5 II died in less than a year ... so I'm hoping this one doesn't have any issues!
*For future models or higher end future models: I'd suggest s/pdif or AES/EBU output instead of or with optical ouputs as pretty much all speakers with digital inputs are s/pdif or AES/EBU: so it removes the need for a separate box.
I can confirm changing the setting 5.11 to OPT U-2 does enable volume control on the optical output which is quite rare! (All new DACS should have this feature as there are more and more speakers with digital inputs nowadays)
I have the DX1 II and just tested optical output to a cheap optical to s/pdif converter to my Neumann speakers via the digital in: and the volume control/remote volume control works to control the volume to the Neumann speakers digitally!
For the price: this may make this the cheapest digital volume control for digital speakers that there is and it has a remote control too!
The only downside is that when you switch to headphones: it still mirrors the output level of the headphone out - so when you turn up your headphone volume: the optical output volume goes up and your speakers turn up too which means you need to power off your speakers if you don't want them playing at the same time as your headphones.
I hope they can update the firmware to turn off the optical output when the phones only output is selected (or have an option to do either) - that way you can use LO for optical volume control for speakers, and phones out for headphone output without having your speaker volume go up when you turn the phones up.
I will admit my DX5 II died in less than a year ... so I'm hoping this one doesn't have any issues!
*For future models or higher end future models: I'd suggest s/pdif or AES/EBU output instead of or with optical ouputs as pretty much all speakers with digital inputs are s/pdif or AES/EBU: so it removes the need for a separate box.
AndreaT
Addicted to Fun and Learning
I received mine today. Boxing of the highest quality, perfect fit’n finish, USB cables included are fabulous, I cannot wait to power it up tomorrow. Less than $ 120 w tax included (there was a small discount coupon on Amazon) for a DAC performance on par or superior to the big boys, not to mention the high quality HP amp. Bravo Topping. Thank you Amir for testing this gem for us.
Just not without. Active speakers can be connected via an analog balanced cable. Yes, it requires unnecessary conversion, but it's still high quality. In contrast, I haven't seen a modern TV with a copper SPDIF. Only optical. Therefore, removing optical connectors from a modern device is pointless. If Topping had made a standard-sized DAC on a single board, there would have been room for an SPDIF. But Topping has its own vision of the buyers of this device. They opted for two boards with connectors (which is always more difficult and expensive than a single board) just to maintain maximum compactness while maintaining uncompromising sound quality. Perhaps this is a marketing strategy. Perhaps it's an attempt to reach a new audience. Perhaps it's an attempt to avoid accidentally creating a perfect device. Otherwise, there won't be anything else to made
.Soundproof
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Being away from hifi for a long time thus newbie, and about to get everything new, toslink, USB C, XLR, 4.4 mm and HDMI would be the ones relevant to me. Gave away my vinyl to my younger brother 25+ years ago and decided then I'm not going to revisit. If I had versatility in mind, I would have picked different, but this cute little bugger is for my desk only, will only be connected to a PC/Lin/Mac, a Dab+ with toslink, one headset and one in-ear. The only potential addon beyond that would be small active speakers, probably not. No wifi/BT is indeed a feature for me, thus featurewise it is just about as right as I can get it for MY purposes. The one feature apparently missing of value to me would be PEQ on opt in/opt out, but I presume that combo was designed as a bypass which might be great for others.Just not without. Active speakers can be connected via an analog balanced cable. Yes, it requires unnecessary conversion, but it's still high quality. In contrast, I haven't seen a modern TV with a copper SPDIF. Only optical. Therefore, removing optical connectors from a modern device is pointless. If Topping had made a standard-sized DAC on a single board, there would have been room for an SPDIF. But Topping has its own vision of the buyers of this device. They opted for two boards with connectors (which is always more difficult and expensive than a single board) just to maintain maximum compactness while maintaining uncompromising sound quality. Perhaps this is a marketing strategy. Perhaps it's an attempt to reach a new audience. Perhaps it's an attempt to avoid accidentally creating a perfect device. Otherwise, there won't be anything else to made
Power by USB C (would require their Y split USB for a cellphone, but the music will be available on both, thus no need. With PEQ and no powerbrick are essentials to me, PEQ because I know my preferences differs form the "perfect sound and measurements" norm.
For my next project it is unsuitable, for that I need (preferably) HDMI, optical and USB C (X2 if possible), 220v XLR and sub out.
As for software, Topping has bit of work to do, but that is fully expected and natural as it is early days for them and it takes time to get software perfected, easy to use for all sorts of users, and ideal for all. My take is that they need to integrate the firmware uploader with Tune, and they need to structure themselves better by coordinating Tune updates. For instance, version 1.16 was visible as an update in Tune, without working, whereas it was not visible on their site (one can just change the name of the download file from 1.15 to 1.16). I at least, have had to delete the installed version, download and install the new version for all updates to Topping Tune. I'm on Mac for this, thus it might be working well for Windows.
But they are working on at least 3 different "apps" simultaniously - iPhone/Android, Tune (Mac/Win builds), Home and firmware downloader, and they probably would do better if they got e.g Tune right. Having one working prefectly would induce patience for those waiting for the alternatives.
Oh, sorry if misunderstood, my measurement was of cheap DSDTECH USB to SPDIF converter that was mentioned, not Topping DX1.
sphenicstands
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This might actually work/work now: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...-ii-dac-hp-amp-review-ntty.71973/post-2630587
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