Topping DM7 8-Channel DAC Review

[voodooless]

Damn you, I can’t use this spoon as a knife, therefor it sucks

 

[dwkdnvr]

a) you describe a device that has other functionalities than what a simple DAC will have. An analogy will be asking multiple input on a power amplifier.

b) this is a consumer device designed to operate by itself.

The above is not a limitation of an 8-ch DAC. You want a different equipment, which this device is not.

We're already going in circles and we're only on page 10. I literally said in my 1st post to this thread that the DM7 is interesting but an Ultralite Mk5 probably suits my needs better. AND I pointed out in a previous post that this is ideal for some scenarios like DSP speakers w/ Roon where you don't care about other sources or a JRiver based HTPC.

 

[MenloBob]

Does the volume control work in conjunction with Roon?

How are you currently doing Roon volume control with the Ultralite?

 

[Trell]

Having multiple digital inputs is more complicated than it might look.
You need to have a common clock for the inputs and outputs, which means you either need to use one of the inputs as clock source (eg what the RME digiface does) or have an ASRC on each input to convert to your internal clock (eg what the minidsp UDIO8 does).
The second solution is arguably better when done properly, but more costly as it requires one ASRC chip per stereo pair.
The first solution on the other hand implies that all you inputs have to use the same clock (ie come from the same device, of fed from the same wordclock source).

I like the fact that the DM7 is only focused on outputs: it makes things simpler and helps keeping the cost low.
It is less versatile than an Okto for sure, but what it does it seems to do it right.

The device does not HAVE multiple digital inputs so it's quite moot: Why add ASRC to a single digital input USB device?

 

[testp]

Imagine if future ones have wifi || bt lossless digital sent to it.. i could use my laptop from my couch for all of this + dsp/roon streaming,
Then i'd buy it, though i need only 2 channels, i know, rpi does this, but still..

 

[MAB]

Has anyone dealt with Apos audio lately? I've found them to be reliable but getting response from them was very slow and challenging. Ultimately, they quickly resolved my issue, but getting response took constant follow up. So, anyone have recent dealings with them?
Also, I would like to see the user manual for the DAC but can't find anywhere. Anyone happen to see one on the website? I'm particularly interested in seeing if Topping has recommendation for converting balanced to unbalanced, such as floating pin 3.

I am struggling with Apos right now on a return, repair, or refund on a broken D30 Pro.
I am on week 2 of the negotiations...

Regarding the manual, it's just like other Topping manuals, a brag-sheet for SINAD with no useful information for the end user. The DM7 in particular could use some system integration information. Instead we get this from one of the resellers:

Do they actually mean it needs a computer attached, as NOT shown in their graphic?

Seems all you need to do is place the DM7 near a TV and HiFi and done!

Don't get me wrong, there appears to be lots of uses for this neat piece of gear. Part of me wants to use this for a pair of Seas Thor active DIY monstrosities that I keep around in the basement. Perhaps I could finally fully integrate the subwoofers with a single DAC and DSP stack. It would be fun, but I am pretty sure I would need support before even buying this though.

Manual for dm7 is here

Contrast with RME manual:

https://www.rme-audio.de/downloads/adi2dacr_e.pdf

It's interesting to see the swirling confusion and speculation in the first 10 pages of this review on what this product is and isn't.
I do want to like this, and even own one. But it does seem like the carriage is way in front of the horses here...

 

[jtwrace]

How are you currently doing Roon volume control with the Ultralite?

Move the slider within Roon

 

[mdsimon2]

I am struggling with Apos right now on a return, repair, or refund on a broken D30 Pro.
I am on week 2 of the negotiations...

Regarding the manual, it's just like other Topping manuals, a brag-sheet for SINAD with no useful information for the end user. The DM7 in particular could use some system integration information. Instead we get this from one of the resellers:

Seems all you need to do is place the DM7 near a TV and HiFi and done!

Don't get me wrong, there appears to be lots of uses for this neat piece of gear. Part of me wants to use this for a pair of Seas Thor active DIY monstrosities that I keep around in the basement. Perhaps I could finally fully integrate the subwoofers with a single DAC and DSP stack. It would be fun, but I am pretty sure I would need support before even buying this though.

Contrast with RME manual:

https://www.rme-audio.de/downloads/adi2dacr_e.pdf

It's interesting to see the swirling confusion and speculation in the first 10 pages of this review on what this product is and isn't.
I do want to like this, and even own one. But it does seem like the carriage is way in front of the horses here...

I really want to buy one of these as I am basically a multichannel DAC hoarder but experiences like yours with Topping retailers and the terrible documentation make me hesitant on a $600 product.

Is there any Topping retailer that seems dependable when something goes wrong? Actually looks like I can buy one of this 500 euro (500 USD at today's exchange rates!) from Audiophonics and have had good luck with them in the past, may go that way.

Michael

 

[KSTR]

Voted "great". A device I've been waiting for. Affordable simple USB 8-ch DAC of excellent quality at low cost. If it runs under RPi-Linux it'll be perfect for a standalone DSP active speaker controller project. It also offers new possibilities for measurement purposes. If it's not prone to failing and driver issues this IHMO sure is a best-buy product.

 

[Razorhelm]

Man, reading this is infuriating, if you need 8 channels, which are audibly transparent, buy this.
If you need something else buy that.

I don't come to all the speaker threads moaning they have a passive crossover when I am going to actively cross it, I just rip that sucker out and get on with it.

Not everything is for you and that's ok.

For me and a few other in this thread this is perfect, I have found my next upgrade!

 

[jtwrace]

Is there any Topping retailer that seems dependable when something goes wrong?
Michael

Sadly, not from my experience and this is what keeps me away.

 

[MAB]

I really want to buy one of these as I am basically a multichannel DAC hoarder but experiences like yours with Topping retailers and the terrible documentation make me hesitant on a $600 product.

Is there any Topping retailer that seems dependable when something goes wrong? Actually looks like I can buy one of this 500 euro (500 USD at today's exchange rates!) from Audiophonics and have had good luck with them in the past, may go that way.

Michael

Let's see how Apos deals with the defective D30 Pro. I actually bought it through Apos' Amazon storefront, so if they keep running me in circles I can escalate though Amazon.
To be honest, I am still a little worked up with Shenzhenaudio over what should have been straightforward warranty on a PA5.
Maybe Apos will come correct on the D30 Pro, and I will settle down...
I know what you mean about wanting to buy this, but without documentation we are all speculating. People are legitimately asking in this thread; what are the use models for this thing? Some of these would be better answered with a proper user's manual, rather than some of the responses.

 

[gvl]

Although the Okto has no ASRC between the AES input and the USB host it does have an ASRC between the USB host and the DAC clock domain (i.e ESS jitter eliminator). All described much better here -> https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...kto-dac8-8ch-dac-amp.7064/page-60#post-333521. It needs this as otherwise you would get buffer underruns due to mismatch between the AES and DAC clock domains.

The nice thing about the Okto is you do not need to engage resampling or rate adjust in CamillaDSP which consumes resources. Also the buffer level is more stable than a CamillaDSP async resampler / rate adjust setup.

Michael

Topping DACs with ESS chips usually run the DAC chip in async mode, so there’s no difference to OKTO from that perspective if this DAC uses an ESS chip running asynchronously. OKTO clocks USB from AES clock, so no need for ASRC on the USB host to match the clocks. Big miss by Topping.

 

[MenloBob]

Move the slider within Roon

So pre convolver (stereo source) digital volume with Roon's DSP and fixed volume into the Ultralite output channels?

 

[mdsimon2]

Big miss by Topping.

What is a big miss?

Michael

 

[gvl]

What is a big miss?

Michael

Not providing SPDIF to USB host path for processing.

 

[sarumbear]

Not providing SPDIF to USB host path for processing.

For me it will be a useless addition and I bet to the vast majority of the market as well. This is a DAC not a multiple input interface.

 

[Labjr]

When you get your wishlist will you find the device too expensive?

The market for multi-channel music isn't that large. And it's limited to source material that's been mixed for multi-channel release. Also many who are into multi-channel music already have a DAC. I'd think a new product would have to add something and be more inclusive to be successful in a niche market. This product is probably not going to motivate me to invest in a surround system for demoing DSOTM to anyone who will listen.

 

[gvl]

For me it will be a useless addition and I bet to the vast majority of the market as well. This is a DAC not a multiple input interface.

Multiple inputs is not the point. If it had parity with OKTO in that regard you would for example be able to use a CCA as a source into the DAC, send to USB host for crossover DSP processing, and back to the DAC and feed into amps and have a clean active DSP speaker setup with no additional ASRC in the chain.

 

[jtwrace]

So pre convolver (stereo source) digital volume with Roon's DSP and fixed volume into the Ultralite output channels?

Probably easier to show the path.