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Topping D90 Balanced USB DAC Review

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amirm

amirm

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NTomokawa

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Now a site known for its subjective reviews is using ASR as reference. .https://audiobacon.net/2019/12/24/topping-d50s-dac-review/
They write, and I quote:
Battery Benefits:
  • Much more solidity
  • Smoother. Much less grain and roughness
  • More weight and dimension
  • Better focus
  • More tonal colors
  • Quieter
  • Lyrics are more intelligible

What does all that mean!?!?!?
tenor.gif
 

maxxevv

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These guys write the same words when a DAC measures great and doesn't cost a lot. It is sterile, not coherent, etc., etc. I don't know how it is that subjectivists don't catch up to the sameness in all these reviews.

I was about to reply regarding the same thing !! :D:D

As always, if its not a level matched blind comparison, it doesn't carry much weight in my opinion when he talked about the Mojo.
 

MC_RME

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@amirm, did you check with Topping to see if this is an actual issue or intended behaviour? It certainly looks like Mode 1 and Mode 3 filters are identical, but the same could be said for Mode 2 and Mode 4 filters as well. Out of curiosity, could you run the FFT up to 100kHz wide?

@WolfX-700, could you perform the same FFT for the filters on the D90 to see if you observe the same behaviour? Perhaps you can also run the same test on the Gustard-DACA22 for comparison?

For reference, AKM4499 filters:
  • Short Delay Sharp Roll-off, GD=6.0/fs
  • Short Delay Slow Roll-off, GD=5.0/fs
  • Sharp Roll-off
  • Slow Roll-off
  • Super Slow Roll-off
  • Low Dispersion Short Delay Filter

After the D90 that my friend bought completely independently this week is delivered, I will measure it. But unfortunately the A22 has been returned. I'll try if I can borrow one elsewhere.

That would be wasted time. SD Sharp/Sharp and SD Slow/Slow are 100% identical, as described in the data sheet, and can be seen also in the ADI-2 DAC (and others, although I think only the ADI manuals explain it that clearly). The main difference is that one filter set is minimum-phase, the other one linear phase.
 

JohnYang1997

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If one wants to see the difference. Just measure the square wave in time domain....
 

headwhacker

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Now a site known for its subjective reviews is using ASR as reference. .https://audiobacon.net/2019/12/24/topping-d50s-dac-review/

"As you know, I’m all about the subjective. I believe measurements are great for repeatability and finding problem areas. But I’ve realized the important attributes that translate into the better enjoyment of music simply can’t be measured."

This is a statement the review said that I somewhat agree. Because it's all in your head. Subjective impression is just opinion, mostly influenced by non-audible factors (e.g. design, colors, display etc).
 

confucius_zero

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Now a site known for its subjective reviews is using ASR as reference. .https://audiobacon.net/2019/12/24/topping-d50s-dac-review/

I can imagine the results as becoming technical to a point of sterility, however his impressions reflect more the state of his audio components than the DAC itself. When something reaches that level of transparency, it simply outputs its input.

He was hearing his gear rather than the DAC. PS Audio Sprout100 when fed a very competent DAC does sound like shit. Couple that with Spotify not Tidal as source... you're throwing a lot of shit towards the D50s... therefore garbage in garbage out into more garbage...
 

maxxevv

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I can imagine the results as becoming technical to a point of sterility, however his impressions reflect more the state of his audio components than the DAC itself. When something reaches that level of transparency, it simply outputs its input.
.

I tend to agree on that.

.
He was hearing his gear rather than the DAC. PS Audio Sprout100 when fed a very competent DAC does sound like shit. Couple that with Spotify not Tidal as source... you're throwing a lot of shit towards the D50s... therefore garbage in garbage out into more garbage...

And this from PS Audio themselves .... :facepalm:

"The PS Audio Sprout100 is one of the best-sounding, minimalist amps built for the modern age that you can buy. With a top notch phono pre-amp and excellent DAC built in, the Sprout100 can handle anything from a turntable to a game console and make it sound its best."
 

confucius_zero

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one of the best-sounding, minimalist amps
77354423_10162583147405298_2395520281381699584_o.jpg

compared nad D3020 D3045, sprout100, yamaha wxa50 and the D3020 + yamaha destroyed the sprout100
 

maxxevv

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Hahaha... I don't have a liking to the use of subjective prose in product descriptions from manufacturers (which is what I quoted above and note the * facepalm" emoticon.)

You should send that "one" in for @amirm to dissect its performance parameters !
 

bennetng

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That would be wasted time. SD Sharp/Sharp and SD Slow/Slow are 100% identical, as described in the data sheet, and can be seen also in the ADI-2 DAC (and others, although I think only the ADI manuals explain it that clearly). The main difference is that one filter set is minimum-phase, the other one linear phase.
Yes, it is "by design". AKM's datasheets are non-confidential:
datasheet.PNG


To elaborate, as the input signal has more tones, or to another extreme (e.g. noise), then individual frequency components needed to be in lower amplitude to maintain the same overall peak level, otherwise clipping will occur. For example here are some 16-bit signals with one to five tones, and the last one is a pink noise with 2-4kHz notched out. It is just a matter of setting the graph's reference level so that the top of the spectrum aligns to 0dB.
1tone.png

5tone.png

pink.png

normalized.png
 

ZgSTar

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No, it won't be any better than USB. And you can use any IIS if you wanted. In my past testing there is little difference between them.
Do you remember which source you used for your tests? I've seen many use usb to i2s adapter to feed a i2s dac. I can't imagine this to be any better than usb straight.
 

Frank Dernie

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My Dad is 86yo and has probably 50-60+ amplifiers and receivers in his main listening room. All restored vintage and only one (A Pioneer C-90s reference preamplifier) which has remote control of volume. He doesn't like that unit because the buttons and legends are too small both on the unit and the remote. As he is getting less agile, I recently gave him remote control of all the main power feeds in the room, so he can shut off the various banks of gear without having to get to the multiple power points. He loves that.

So, I built him this yesterday for Christmas, to sit in the tape loop of any of his amplifiers and give him proper remote control of volume:

View attachment 43585

View attachment 43586

View attachment 43587

Old school instrument case, IP-67 weatherproof buttons, transmission/receive confirmation LEDs both on remote and receiver. Passive attenuator (motorized ALPs), power-on motorized automatic reset of volume to minimum, then advances to a low, nominal value, and of course it can be bypassed by just flicking the tape monitor switch to off.

Let me know if you want one for next Christmas, Frank. ;)
Brilliant!
My Devialet amp has a rotary volume control on its remote. I will probably never change it.
Quad had a proper volume control on its remote years ago, I would like the complete Quad setup which goes with it so maybe I should look around.
 

Snafu

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So, if we compare measurements, can we except any (real world) difference in sound between D90 and D50s ?

Not much ?
 
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