Topping D90 Balanced USB DAC Review

[Martin]

Im lazy so like to adjust volume from my seat across the room with DAC remote. But in a desktop situation, probably this.

I’m lazy, too. My preamp has a remote and the headphone amp is within easy reach.

Martin

 

[Jimbob54]

I’m lazy, too. My preamp has a remote and the headphone amp is within easy reach.

Martin

The avatar was the clue.

 

[dpippel]

The Dude abides.

 

[Harmonie]

I have a question regarding gain and volume controls in my headphone stack. I have the Topping D90 connected to the Monoprice Monolith THX AAA 887 headphone amp via balanced XLR. With this setup, I have three distinct mechanisms to control the loudness of the music coming out of the headphones:

1. The volume pot on the headphone amp
2. The gain level on the headphone amp (level 1, 2, or 3)
3. The digital volume control on the D90 DAC

I am wondering if there is any difference in "sound quality" for these different mechanisms such that I should prefer one over the others?

I am aware that there are channel imbalance issues with the Monoprice headphone amp when the volume pot is down below, say, 9 o'clock or so. Therefore, I do not set the DAC to output at full digital volume, because I would then be forced to turn the headphone amp volume pot down too low. I usually set the DAC digital volume to somewhere between -10dB and -25dB, and then set the gain level on the headphone amp to either 1 or 2, depending on the sensitivity of the headphones I have plugged in. Is it "better" or "worse" in any way to prefer the gain level on the headamp to the digital volume on the DAC, or vice versa? Or are these just two equivalent mechanisms for changing the loudness in headphones?

I think that you are raising a major point. While everybody is focused on the dac and it's performance, how about the output stage and the sound it conveys ? The volume pot, digital or else is quite important here. So important that in my last DIY passive "pre", I did it with abunch of Vishay resistors ...

 

[Objectivist01]

I think that you are raising a major point. While everybody is focused on the dac and it's performance, how about the output stage and the sound it conveys ? The volume pot, digital or else is quite important here. So important that in my last DIY passive "pre", I did it with abunch of Vishay resistors ...

What is special about Vishal resistors ?

 

[zskyper]

Hello,

We take a couple of hours with friends to compare our (hell sound machines) D90 / D90 MQA with almost all sound formats compatible and found a big issue with the MQA version which may interest this community.

Changing from DSD to FLAC during playback = Huge POPS with D90 MQA version not present with D90, at high volume this literally explode your ears! so be careful to turn down the vol before testing.

tested and repro easily with D90 MQA version firmware 1.22 and 1.23,
previous and latest audio MPD server under linux used over USB,
Minimal audiophile config:
Focal speakers + Power amp+ DAC (XLR Balanced wired),

we told you stay away from MQA version! until they fix this if you listen like us a lot of DSD in addition to FLAC and others...
Hope this helps!

 

[hmscott]

Hello,

We take a couple of hours with friends to compare our (hell sound machines) D90 / D90 MQA with almost all sound formats compatible and found a big issue with the MQA version which may interest this community.

Changing from DSD to FLAC during playback = Huge POPS with D90 MQA version not present with D90, at high volume this literally explode your ears! so be careful to turn down the vol before testing.

tested and repro easily with D90 MQA version firmware 1.22 and 1.23,
previous and latest audio MPD server under linux used,
Minimal audiophile config:
Focal speakers + Power amp+ DAC (XLR Balanced wired),

we told you stay away from MQA version! until they fix this if you listen like us a lot of DSD in addition to FLAC and others...
Hope this helps!

It's been reported by a couple of people that the D90 MQA RCA out's are "noisy" to the point of unusable, while the XLR's are dead quiet. Can you also please check that out as well? I haven't heard back if they ran RCA only or left in the disconnected XLR's while testing - extra unloaded cable might act as an antenna.

Same goes for whether BT is enabled or not during testing, how about your testing / set up? Is BT disabled or active? Did you attach the BT antenna?

Whether we use DSD + FLAC, or RCA or not, I know I want my unit to be working in all modes before I decide to keep it.

Thank you for the detailed info

 

[bahamot]

Just FYI, I'm using D90 MQA to Stax amp through RCA just fine. And changing between MQA, DSD, PCM just fine. I'm using USB Audio Player Pro on Android.

 

[zskyper]

Just FYI, I'm using D90 MQA to Stax amp through RCA just fine. And changing between MQA, DSD, PCM just fine. I'm using USB Audio Player Pro on Android.

Hey,

could you please be more rigorous in your test!

The Android USB Audio Player Pro by default do a auto fade in/out on change and convert DSD to PCM.... put it in NATIVE DSD mode with bitperfect activated and you'll see!

do the following:
- add a flac 96KHz in the queue
+ a DSD

Play DSD and during playback switch to the FLAC!
boum! here you're ! the clicks/pops! attenuated by the auto fad in/out but clearly audible

trust me this has been tested and re-tested this is a bug of the current firmware of the MQA version and need to be fixed.

Whether we use DSD + FLAC, or RCA or not, I know I want my unit to be working in all modes before I decide to keep it.

Thank you for the detailed info

no problemo, the RCA is fine but I strongly suggest to go with a XLR to RCA cable from Mogami for example, but frankly if you don't care about MQA go for the D90 std version.
Cheers!

 

[hmscott]

Just FYI, I'm using D90 MQA to Stax amp through RCA just fine. And changing between MQA, DSD, PCM just fine. I'm using USB Audio Player Pro on Android.

Thanks for the feedback on your use case. What version of firmware did your unit come with out of the box? Have you installed the update?

 

[bahamot]

Hey,

could you please be more rigorous in your test!

The Android USB Audio Player Pro by default do a auto fade in/out on change and convert DSD to PCM.... put it in NATIVE DSD mode with bitperfect activated and you'll see!

do the following:
- add a flac 96KHz in the queue
+ a DSD

Play DSD and during playback switch to the FLAC!
boum! here you're ! the clicks/pops! attenuated by the auto fad in/out but clearly audible

trust me this has been tested and re-tested this is a bug of the current firmware of the MQA version and need to be fixed.



no problemo, the RCA is fine but I strongly suggest to go with a XLR to RCA cable from Mogami for example, but frankly if you don't care about MQA go for the D90 std version.
Cheers!

I always listen from album to album and stop playback before changing album. Just my habit to stop before changing song.

Oh I'm on the stock firmware, don't know which version.

 

[jason.voegele]

Personally, for ease and based on what I have read...

If all your 'phones can get loud enough on gain 1, stay there. Going higher gain (unless you are at the very end of the dial on low) will either make no difference or worsen distortion.

Knock the DAC volume down lets say 4 or 5 notches (maybe more)

Turn amp volume up for just about as loud as you'd want for first listening. As your ears adjust , if you're like me you'll crave more volume- use the DAC remote to up to taste (or down if a loud track comes on) .

Thanks for the advice. I failed to mention originally that the reason that I asked this question in the first place because, based on purely subjective listening, I thought that music sounded "better" when I had the gain set at level 2, as compared to gain level 1. I was therefore wondering if there is any possible mechanism by which the sound quality might differ based on the gain setting, or if this was just my ears/brain fooling me.

For what it's worth, the three gain settings on the Monoprice 887 amp correspond to -10dB, 0dB, and +10dB, respectively. There have been reports of clipping when using gain level 3 (+10dB), so I tend to avoid that setting.

I set the DAC to output fixed volume at 0.0dB and use the headphone amp (or preamp when listening over speakers) to adjust volume. Pick the gain setting that allows you to set the volume knob between 11 and 1 o’clock. The rest is all volume knob tweaking. Enjoy

I originally had the D90 set in pure DAC mode, where it outputs full digital volume. I found that, in that configuration, everything was just too loud when using sensitive headphones/IEMs even when the headphone amp was set to the lowest gain level. I would have to set the volume knob on the headphone amp way down to about 7 o'clock position, and that would result in channel imbalance. (Recall that I am using XLR connections between the DAC and the headphone amp, which is double the voltage of RCA connection.) For a while, I was even inserting an iFi IEMatch device between the headphone amp and my IEMs, until it occurred to me that I could use the digital volume control on the DAC instead. But I had read somewhere that for the "best sound quality", the D90 should be set in pure DAC mode or at full digital volume level. I was skeptical about that, so that's why I asked the question here.

Thanks all.

 

[bahamot]

Hey,

could you please be more rigorous in your test!

The Android USB Audio Player Pro by default do a auto fade in/out on change and convert DSD to PCM.... put it in NATIVE DSD mode with bitperfect activated and you'll see!

do the following:
- add a flac 96KHz in the queue
+ a DSD

Play DSD and during playback switch to the FLAC!
boum! here you're ! the clicks/pops! attenuated by the auto fad in/out but clearly audible

trust me this has been tested and re-tested this is a bug of the current firmware of the MQA version and need to be fixed.



no problemo, the RCA is fine but I strongly suggest to go with a XLR to RCA cable from Mogami for example, but frankly if you don't care about MQA go for the D90 std version.
Cheers!

Just tried switch between dsd, mqa, pcm... no pops here, tried with native dsd on the UAPP.
There was silent when switching the song while buffering.

 

[Cut-Throat]

Hi Cut-Throat

The manual in my opinion should improve. It is small and somewhat confusing, especially if it is not in my language.

Look at this video. Where you can read "LO Mode" is where you can select the DAC or Pre mode
To enter setting mode, press the power / SEL button while simultaneously operating the rear power switch.

I just recived my Topping D90 and I pretty much have it figured out.... The one pictured in the Video, must be an older D90 Version as the newer ones do not have a Round Volume knob, they have up and down buttons instead.

 

[GeorgeWalk]

I just recived my Topping D90 and I pretty much have it figured out.... The one pictured in the Video, must be an older D90 Version as the newer ones do not have a Round Volume knob, they have up and down buttons instead and Apparently all you have to do is set it to 0db and it will automatically be in a PURE Dac mode.

The one with the round knob was a user modification. They all have up down buttons.

 

[Rigel]

I just recived my Topping D90 and I pretty much have it figured out.... The one pictured in the Video, must be an older D90 Version as the newer ones do not have a Round Volume knob, they have up and down buttons instead and Apparently all you have to do is set it to 0db and it will automatically be in a PURE Dac mode.

It is indeed a modification, I feel it may confuse. I will edit the post to warn.

 

[Jimbob54]

I just recived my Topping D90 and I pretty much have it figured out.... The one pictured in the Video, must be an older D90 Version as the newer ones do not have a Round Volume knob, they have up and down buttons instead and Apparently all you have to do is set it to 0db and it will automatically be in a PURE Dac mode.

Not entirely sure you are right there. Though the effect may be the same (DAC mode is just locked to max output for PCM) but it has some impact on DSD

Per post #190
When the preamp option is enabled, DSD> PCM conversion is enabled. When this option is disabled, the DSD preamp plays in the main mode without conversion!
Volume control is only possible in PCM format.

 

[777]

D90 MQA mod.

 

[Yviena]

I always wonder why most dacs use the Acusillicon,or crystek clocks, and not something like NDK SDA, looking at specs the NDK SDA clocks seems both better in jitter performance, and in price.

 

[Guddu]

Another interesting D90 review