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Topping D90 Balanced USB DAC Review

KingFiercer

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I've already contacted seller for fixing this problem. I tried both V4.67.0 and V4.47.0 drivers. ASIO, WASAPI, KS, windows mixer. D70 works properly, but D90 speeds up with PCM 44.1/88.2 etc. It's fun to be able to watch YouTube on 4x speed. I think it's just defect in usb-module or unit firmware. There is no problem with optical input.
 
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Cut-Throat

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Just click on the link provided under the photo. The video says it all.
Watched the video a number of times.... If the problem is the audio is sped up 2X, is was hard for me to discern as this type of music is not what I listen to. It seemed sped up at all bit rates. Also, is the problem only with USB input or all inputs? Is it just RCA outputs or XLR as well?
 
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KingFiercer

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I'm using only RCA, problem appears only with USB. In this video you must be able to hear acceleration when switching to 44.1/88.2/176.4.
 

AndyLu

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I've already contacted seller for fixing this problem. I tried both V4.67.0 and V4.47.0 drivers. ASIO, WASAPI, KS, windows mixer. D70 works properly, but D90 speeds up with PCM 44.1/88.2 etc. It's fun to be able to watch YouTube on 4x speed. I think it's just defect in usb-module or unit firmware. There is no problem with optical input.

Bummer, there must be something wrong with your unit then. Hopefully they can do something about it or exchange it.
Normally I let Audirvana upsample 44.1 to a higher quantity. But to be sure I tried 44.1 without upsampling with my D90 and I don't have that problem over USB.
I hope they get you a new one ;).
I hope you'll keep us informed, because I am anxious to know how well their customer service is.
 
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Nicolaas

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For my understanding: wat happens if you play an original 88.2 kHz 24 bit file without oversampling, does this also get the higher anlogue pitch/speed?
Just asking because I expect my new D90 DAC by the end of this week. And I hope I can use the D90 in Non Oversampling Mode...
I do not like oversampling mode!
I am new to this forum and love the reviews and discussions!
 
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Veri

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For my understanding: wat happens if you play an original 88.2 kHz 24 bit file without oversampling, does this also get the higher anlogue pitch/speed?
Just asking because I expect my new D90 DAC by the end of this week. And I hope I can use the D90 in Non Oversampling Mode...

At 88kHz there is no real problem with FR. But D90 does not have a NOS mode, you can put it only in 'Super Slow' oversampling which is the lowest setting. No pitch/speed problems whatsoever.

I still recommend the default filter though. Imo it should sound the best :)
 

Nicolaas

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At 88kHz there is no real problem with FR. But D90 does not have a NOS mode, you can put it only in 'Super Slow' oversampling which is the lowest setting. No pitch/speed problems whatsoever.

I still recommend the default filter though. Imo it should sound the best :)

I do not understand this at all. What do filter settings like slow roll off have to do with oversampling?
 

Veri

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I do not understand this at all. What do filter settings like slow roll off have to do with oversampling?
Um. NOS stands for "no oversampling (filter)". The filter is the digital filter which performs an oversampling which is necessary to prevent stair-stepped response at for example 44kHz, and to prevent aliasing in the analogue signal.

If you don't understand this at all I would suggest reading up on the principle https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ng-differ-from-over-sampling.3440/#post-83318 there's many other information sources online.

In any case the D90 does not have a "NOS" mode. You can only make the digital filter steeper or slower (or set it to linear phase or minimum phase, which is yet another distinction here. Linear phase has worse latency but keeps phase in tact). To make matters worse people generally can't hear a difference in linear/minimum phase, nor in digital filters. They are a really subtle thing and a lot of devices just have the manufacturer set a default filter and that is it. Exposing the digital filter to the end user only confuses people who do not really know what this even affects/is in the first place.

If you use a low sample rate like 44kHz and process it "NOS"/without proper filtering, the end result looks like so:
RJ6WaEh.png


Thankfully your ears will probably not hear much of a difference besides some loss in treble. Our ears are very forgiving even when crucial principles like these are not respected. But you can understand now I assume, why the love for "NOS mode" in the audiophile community is something silly. At low sample rates it distorts the signal severely, at a high sample rate like 88/192kHz and up NOS mode will not harm the signal any more, but it won't make it magically sound "better", either :)...
 
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Nicolaas

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Um. NOS stands for "no oversampling (filter)". The filter is the digital filter which performs an oversampling which is necessary to prevent stair-stepped response at for example 44kHz, and to prevent aliasing in the analogue signal.

If you don't understand this at all I would suggest reading up on the principle https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ng-differ-from-over-sampling.3440/#post-83318 there's many other information sources online.

In any case the D90 does not have a "NOS" mode. You can only make the digital filter steeper or slower (or set it to linear phase or minimum phase, which is yet another distinction here. Linear phase has worse latency but keeps phase in tact). To make matters worse people generally can't hear a difference in linear/minimum phase, nor in digital filters. They are a really subtle thing and a lot of devices just have the manufacturer set a default filter and that is it. Exposing the digital filter to the end user only confuses people who do not really know what this even affects/is in the first place.

If you use a low sample rate like 44kHz and process it "NOS"/without proper filtering, the end result looks like so:
RJ6WaEh.png


Thankfully your ears will probably not hear much of a difference besides some loss in treble. Our ears are very forgiving even when crucial principles like these are not respected. But you can understand now I assume, why the love for "NOS mode" in the audiophile community is something silly. At low sample rates it distorts the signal severaly, at a high sample rate like 88/192kHz and up NOS mode will not harm the signal any more, but it won't make it magically sound "better", either :)...


Thank you so much: the info slowly (!) starts to sink in...So the issue KingFiercer brought up was an issue of "upsampling" and had nothing to do with "oversampling" (if I am correct...). Also good to know there will be no pitch/speed problem with my 24 bit 88.2 kHz flac files!
 

KingFiercer

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Topping guys said that it's not problem of the product, but in the player settings, they recommended to try another player.
So I recorded another video for clarification:

Nicolaas
It's just the uniqe issue of my current D90 unit with performance of PCM signal of 44.1/88.2/176.4/352.8kHz via USB.
 
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KingFiercer

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From Aoshida-HIFI Audio Store (aliexpress). Dealer making contacts with factory, it just takes some time. I'm okay with it.
 

Cut-Throat

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OK, the problem is very obvious to me now! --- The previous video which had music that I was not familiar with, all sounded fairly bad to me.
Have other people reported this problem? -- If so, the Mfgr. should have already have a solution/replacement.
 
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Veri

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Thank you so much: the info slowly (!) starts to sink in...So the issue KingFiercer brought up was an issue of "upsampling" and had nothing to do with "oversampling" (if I am correct...). Also good to know there will be no pitch/speed problem with my 24 bit 88.2 kHz flac files!
Correct! :)

But it looks like a factory defect, the issue he is experiencing. Very unusual.
 

Vladecrni

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Hi all, my first post here.

I am looking for a DAC+AMP to buy, and would prefer all in one unit. So far my favourite is Topping Dx7 PRO, but is lacking two technologies that I would like (at least I think that I would like them, judging from what I read): THX AAA and MQA.

I see that some of you guys here are "in" with manufacturers, and know the rumors of upcoming products... Sooo is there any rumor about potential Dx9 PRO, with MQA at least?

If so, I would be willing to wait.

Thanks in advance.
 

Veri

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Hi all, my first post here.

I am looking for a DAC+AMP to buy, and would prefer all in one unit. So far my favourite is Topping Dx7 PRO, but is lacking two technologies that I would like (at least I think that I would like them, judging from what I read): THX AAA and MQA.

Topping D90 MQA DAC ? It is different from default version that has no MQA decoding support. Combine it with Monoprice 887, Drop's 798 or (Schiit Magni Heresy which also has feed-forward correction) and you're set...

As far as THX-AAA combo dac/amps, there are few... Monoprice Monolith comes to mind, but it is not 'top of the line' performance.
 

Vladecrni

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Topping D90 MQA DAC ? It is different from default version that has no MQA decoding support. Combine it with Monoprice 887, Drop's 798 or (Schiit Magni Heresy which also has feed-forward correction) and you're set...

As far as THX-AAA combo dac/amps, there are few... Monoprice Monolith comes to mind, but it is not 'top of the line' performance.
Many thanks for your insight, unfortunately as far as I know Massdrop and Monoprice are not available in EU at decent prices :(

And If I'm not mistaken, I read about D 90 MQA version earlier in this topic, that is why I'm asking here...
 

Veri

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Many thanks for your insight, unfortunately as far as I know Massdrop and Monoprice are not available in EU at decent prices :(

And If I'm not mistaken, I read about D 90 MQA version earlier in this topic, that is why I'm asking here...
Monoprice 887 is available for order at audiophonics. The price is not unreasonable since it has shipping and import taxes included in the price..

If you are looking for TOTL performance, MQA decoding(for those who like MQA..) and THX amplification, as well as affordable and cheap, this thing does not exist right now.
 
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