Topping D70 Pro Sabre DAC Review

[BeeKay]

New firmware available. https://www.toppingaudio.com/download/d70-pro-sabre-version-v1-10-firmware-update

Thanks for the hint. With the new version, the initial pop that appeared when playing the first album after powering up has vanished.

 

[Lux Maldini]

ES9039pro has a smaller output current and that is better for the op amps of the I/V converter. If they use the same opa1612, maybe the sound will be a little livelier than ES9038pro. There are currently no op amps that can perfectly manage loads of one hundred and two ohms. Most likely, in the present case, the current-voltage conversion load is around 600 ohms which is better for the "live" sensation of the sound.

Hello, may I ask if there is any theoretical support for this?

 

[Rick63]

I ordered one while on sale for $525 and it arrived awhile ago.

 

[Jimster480]

I ordered one while on sale for $425 and it arrived awhile ago.

View attachment 494691

These units really really look nice! Topping seriously nailed the design here.

 

[Rick63]

These units really really look nice! Topping seriously nailed the design here.

I agree, and it matches my SMSL PL200T pretty well.

 

[Jimster480]

I agree, and it matches my SMSL PL200T pretty well.

The PL200T is actually awesome. In your picture I actually thought it was a Topping device originally, I had to take a double look because both have similar design language.
I have an SMSL SU-8S + Douk G7 for my TV setup in my living room and it looks pretty nice but not as nice as your setup

 

[Rick63]

Well, after 5 weeks I've ran into my first glitch with this unit.

I always set the display to turn off while watching TV/movies, and only turn it on when listening to music, so I can see the VU meter of course.

I haven't listened to music in about a week until moments ago, and when I turned it on the display on neither the VU meter or spectrum analyzer displays moved. Oh the horror I thought!!

I tried turning it off for a couple of minutes and turned it back on and still nothing. l then tried turning it off again, but this time on the back panel instead of the front. A few minutes later I powered it back on and the displays work properly again.

Now I'll always be concerned about it happening again, or some other issue popping up. I can't lie, I was worried about spending that much on it even at the sale price, given the issues Topping seems to have far too often (though my luck has been great with Topping thus far).

Truth be told, I have concerns about the new SMSL PL200T's long term reliability as well. Hopefully it will prove to be trouble-free.

As great as Topping products measure, look, and sound, I wish they would spend a little more time engineering their products to be more reliable before releasing, than rushing to get the next dozen products developed. I mean, if they can be built with high quality parts and materials, and be engineered to perform fantastic, how hard should it be to build them to be reliable as well? And I'm not even talking about internet/streaming issues because I do not do that.

Rant over, time for some music and smoke...

 

[Jimster480]

Well, after 5 weeks I've ran into my first glitch with this unit.

I always set the display to turn off while watching TV/movies, and only turn it on when listening to music, so I can see the VU meter of course.

I haven't listened to music in about a week until moments ago, and when I turned it on the display on neither the VU meter or spectrum analyzer displays moved. Oh the horror I thought!!

I tried turning it off for a couple of minutes and turned it back on and still nothing. l then tried turning it off again, but this time on the back panel instead of the front. A few minutes later I powered it back on and the displays work properly again.

Now I'll always be concerned about it happening again, or some other issue popping up. I can't lie, I was worried about spending that much on it even at the sale price, given the issues Topping seems to have far too often (though my luck has been great with Topping thus far).

Truth be told, I have concerns about the new SMSL PL200T's long term reliability as well. Hopefully it will prove to be trouble-free.

As great as Topping products measure, look, and sound, I wish they would spend a little more time engineering their products to be more reliable before releasing, than rushing to get the next dozen products developed. I mean, if they can be built with high quality parts and materials, and be engineered to perform fantastic, how hard should it be to build them to be reliable as well? And I'm not even talking about internet/streaming issues because I do not do that.

Rant over, time for some music and smoke...

Could just be that it encountered a bug when the display was disabled for a long time and actually power cycling the device fixed it.

 

[guyboisvert]

Well, after 5 weeks I've ran into my first glitch with this unit.

I always set the display to turn off while watching TV/movies, and only turn it on when listening to music, so I can see the VU meter of course.

I haven't listened to music in about a week until moments ago, and when I turned it on the display on neither the VU meter or spectrum analyzer displays moved. Oh the horror I thought!!

I tried turning it off for a couple of minutes and turned it back on and still nothing. l then tried turning it off again, but this time on the back panel instead of the front. A few minutes later I powered it back on and the displays work properly again.

Now I'll always be concerned about it happening again, or some other issue popping up. I can't lie, I was worried about spending that much on it even at the sale price, given the issues Topping seems to have far too often (though my luck has been great with Topping thus far).

Truth be told, I have concerns about the new SMSL PL200T's long term reliability as well. Hopefully it will prove to be trouble-free.

As great as Topping products measure, look, and sound, I wish they would spend a little more time engineering their products to be more reliable before releasing, than rushing to get the next dozen products developed. I mean, if they can be built with high quality parts and materials, and be engineered to perform fantastic, how hard should it be to build them to be reliable as well? And I'm not even talking about internet/streaming issues because I do not do that.

Rant over, time for some music and smoke...

"That much" for that level of fidelity, balanced outputs, 12V trigger, great LCD, etc? Have mine since 2023, never had a problem and sound quality is pristine. Sure, one could go for less money and have the same level of audio fidelity (SMSL D6s is 199$!). DACs are at "consumable" level, it's a very well mastered techology. "... given the issues Topping seems to have far too often..." Why did you buy it in the first place if you don't like the product and if it is "crap" then? Here, we all know why...

 

[Rick63]

"if you don't like the product and if it is "crap"

I said neither of those things. Please don't put words in my mouth...

 

[guyboisvert]

"if you don't like the product and if it is "crap"

I said neither of those things. Please don't put words in my mouth...

"...given the issues Topping seems to have far too often"...
"...I wish they would spend a little more time engineering their products to be more reliable before releasing..."
"...neither the VU meter or spectrum analyzer displays moved. Oh the horror I thought..."
"...how hard should it be to build them to be reliable as well..."
"...And I'm not even talking about internet/streaming issues because I do not do that..."

The last one is the most stupid as the D70 Pro sabre has NOTHING TO DO WITH INTERNET STREAMING, IT ISN'T A STREAMER...

We're all waiting you provide your evidence about all you say above... all words from your mouth...

 

[Rick63]

Good grief. Welcome to my ignore list.

 

[Roland68]

Well, after 5 weeks I've ran into my first glitch with this unit.

I always set the display to turn off while watching TV/movies, and only turn it on when listening to music, so I can see the VU meter of course.

I haven't listened to music in about a week until moments ago, and when I turned it on the display on neither the VU meter or spectrum analyzer displays moved. Oh the horror I thought!!

I tried turning it off for a couple of minutes and turned it back on and still nothing. l then tried turning it off again, but this time on the back panel instead of the front. A few minutes later I powered it back on and the displays work properly again.

Now I'll always be concerned about it happening again, or some other issue popping up. I can't lie, I was worried about spending that much on it even at the sale price, given the issues Topping seems to have far too often (though my luck has been great with Topping thus far).

Truth be told, I have concerns about the new SMSL PL200T's long term reliability as well. Hopefully it will prove to be trouble-free.

As great as Topping products measure, look, and sound, I wish they would spend a little more time engineering their products to be more reliable before releasing, than rushing to get the next dozen products developed. I mean, if they can be built with high quality parts and materials, and be engineered to perform fantastic, how hard should it be to build them to be reliable as well? And I'm not even talking about internet/streaming issues because I do not do that.

Rant over, time for some music and smoke...

It can happen, and this occurs with many everyday products, not just toppings or hi-fi equipment, that they don't fully wake up from standby after very long periods of inactivity. Often, the only solution is to unplug the device for a minute.
Switching it off at the front won't help if it simply puts the device back into standby mode.
This is absolutely nothing to worry about. If you're not going to be using the device for an extended period, just switch it off completely.

Unfortunately, like many other users, you have to look to yourself and your purchasing habits for the problem of improved development and reliability from these manufacturers. If that were important to you, you could have supported companies that have been doing exactly this for 30 years or more, such as Lake People/Violectric or RME. These manufacturers also repair older devices as long as spare parts are available, and usually at reasonable prices.

Final development of devices, meaning the last 2-10%, is very expensive and can easily cost as much, or even more, than the first 90-98%. For this, companies need the appropriate staff and the necessary expertise, which is also costly.

The same applies to any kind of long-term and reliability testing. Such testing takes at least a year, meaning that the entire development process must be pre-financed for that entire time, the device doesn't reach the market for a year, and no revenue can be generated from the tied-up resources during that period. Manufacturers also need another expensive laboratory and highly paid employees with the relevant expertise.
This can quickly double the price of the device, as these costs also need to be covered.

And at this point, the manufacturer faces another problem: with a price that is twice as high, sales figures drop so drastically that they risk making a loss on the product. Only through high production volumes can Topping, and other manufacturers, offer these devices at such low prices.

Honestly, would you really be willing to pay twice as much, or even two and a half times as much, for the same device with more reliable operation, better durability, and repair options?

 

[Bob101]

After two years of ownership I still like my D70pro. Not looking for another DAC, don't want another, and it should last. Soundquality is SOTA. It's a good pre-amp, IF you have the nice aluminium remote control from topping. But I could have done with a more affordable DAC in hindsight. Transparent is transparent. The bluetoooth I wanted I do not use, mainly USB, and occasionally optical and coax. I can't hear the difference between it and my E50.
I have noticed glitches in the GUI. Sometimes the level meter bars freeze. Shouldn't happen, but turn it on and off, and all is well again. Got the latest firmware. Thing to note: since I've bought it, it's been powered on for 98% of the time, and I 'blame' the GUI glictches on me being too lazy to power it off. I leave the screen on auto now. So it's black most of the time. It looks good though. Better than a D90 IMO.

 

[mike7877]

After two years of ownership I still like my D70pro. Not looking for another DAC, don't want another, and it should last. Soundquality is SOTA. It's a good pre-amp, IF you have the nice aluminium remote control from topping. But I could have done with a more affordable DAC in hindsight. Transparent is transparent. The bluetoooth I wanted I do not use, mainly USB, and occasionally optical and coax. I can't hear the difference between it and my E50.
I have noticed glitches in the GUI. Sometimes the level meter bars freeze. Shouldn't happen, but turn it on and off, and all is well again. Got the latest firmware. Thing to note: since I've bought it, it's been powered on for 98% of the time, and I 'blame' the GUI glictches on me being too lazy to power it off. I leave the screen on auto now. So it's black most of the time. It looks good though. Better than a D90 IMO.

It is a nice DAC. Very nice. I can hear the difference between it and the E50. though. The E50 is pretty good itself, and it's probably limitations of your other gear, why they sound the same to you. And that is a good thing. It means you probably won't need an upgrade when you get new speakers or headphones or amplifier. Unless it's a heuuge upgrade!

The biggest difference between the E50 and D70 Pro in sound quality, is the E50 doesn't resolve the mids as much - they can blend together when there are a bunch of harmonics. It's not a big problem obviously, but it's by far its most notable variation from perfect. Next notable is probably its bass is slightly weak. I've only tested single ended output from the E50, so consider that as well (most likely to affect bass, not the other two.
Two? Last place is the highs - the highs can be fatiguing. Just use filter 1 - it's the brightest sounding option. Yes, that sounds counter intuitive, but it's not for highs being too prominent that there's fatigue (well that's the only thing that could make sense, isn't it?)

Just my 2c on the E50 vs. A70 Pro Sabre

 

[BeeKay]

The E50 is pretty good itself, and it's probably limitations of your other gear, why they sound the same to you.

Checking my popcorn supplies.