Topping D10s USB DAC and Bridge Review

[NewbieAudiophileExpert]

Topping D10s uses the ES9038Q2M DAC which has 7 presets available. Has anybody found a way/hack to select another preset than the default apodizing fast roll-off filter?

Theoretically it should be doable - just requires the skills, time, and effort.

 

[Veri]

Topping D10s uses the ES9038Q2M DAC which has 7 presets available. Has anybody found a way/hack to select another preset than the default apodizing fast roll-off filter?

I believe Archimago (look up his blog) has firmware for Linear Fast filter. But I'm not sure he can/is allowed to share.

 

[tomchris]

I believe Archimago (look up his blog) has firmware for Linear Fast filter. But I'm not sure he can/is allowed to share.

In his review of the D10S, he just ponders the possibility of changing the filter settings using a firmware update.

 

[Veri]

In his review of the D10S, he just ponders the possibility of changing the filter settings using a firmware update.

It must be in another post where he mentions having both D10s and D10 balanced linear fast firmwares, 99% sure of that but this is off the top of my head/memory

 

[NewbieAudiophileExpert]

Has anybody here replaced the op-amps in the D10S and had any demonstrable results?

 

[Veri]

Has anybody here replaced the op-amps in the D10S and had any demonstrable results?

Well. So far it looks like the conclusion is there's no point. All current Topping products also no longer have such a gimmick at all.

Rolling (replacing) Op-amps in Topping D10 DAC

This is a study of whether changing op-amps in a DAC makes a measurable difference. Taking a lead form "rolling" tubes in tube products, a trend has started in replacing op-amps -- sometimes with much difficulty -- to improve performance of solid state products like DACs. A few months ago I...

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[pma]

Well. So far it looks like the conclusion is there's no point. All current Topping products also no longer have such a gimmick at all.

Rolling (replacing) Op-amps in Topping D10 DAC

This is a study of whether changing op-amps in a DAC makes a measurable difference. Taking a lead form "rolling" tubes in tube products, a trend has started in replacing op-amps -- sometimes with much difficulty -- to improve performance of solid state products like DACs. A few months ago I...

www.audiosciencereview.com

A small problem is that only one type of measurement has been provided and, moreover, results are masked by the wideband DAC noise. I am not saying there is an audible difference, but the measurements might have been done in a much better way.

BTW, I am getting better results from D10s

 

[Veri]

BTW, I am getting better results from D10s

Stock?

 

[pma]

Yes, no mods.

 

[half_dog]

Correct if I'm wrong... I think that a mod could bring some improvement (I don't know the best way if there's a way to implement it) would be to put a clean and powerful dual op amp after the 3.3V LDO which feeds the AVVCs. This is recommended by ESS and I believe that's one of the reasons D10 Balanced (E50 has this implemented as well and has low noise even for the RCA output) has a lower noise floor than D10s.

 

[pma]

I am not sure if a mere change of LME49720 for something else would bring any improvement. Depends what you want. As a link stage, I am doubtful. If you wanted to drive headphones, then yes.

 

[NewbieAudiophileExpert]

In my opinion the D10S is such a solid piece of hardware that there's nothing to improve about it... although it's always fun to entertain the idea of improving things further, though that might be an OCD.

 

[Shadowkill]

I'll put opa2107ap in 10s and see how the sound changes

 

[raif71]

Correct if I'm wrong... I think that a mod could bring some improvement (I don't know the best way if there's a way to implement it) would be to put a clean and powerful dual op amp after the 3.3V LDO which feeds the AVVCs. This is recommended by ESS and I believe that's one of the reasons D10 Balanced (E50 has this implemented as well and has low noise even for the RCA output) has a lower noise floor than D10s.

I see that the D10s is clearer than than the D10b... oooh shiny vs blurry . Don't mind me

 

[half_dog]

I see that the D10s is clearer than than the D10b... oooh shiny vs blurry . Don't mind me

At first I thought I had interpreted wrongly the measurements of the DACs and than... "oh, that was a joke" xD
Talking about joke... Just don't juge me. Far from being a example of soldering work but on my defence I had a problem with my iron solder. I won't say anything subjective about how it is souding but there is two things that I can confirm: that's stills working and my audio interfaces are not sensible enought to measure any change - for better or for worst. No meaningful measurable differences on noise either harmonic distortion. But using a sensitive IEM (AKG K321) with L30 on max gain, I was able to hear the background noise from D10s, it stills audible although considerably lower than before. I'm planning to acquire a Cosmos ADC soon, probably it will may tell how bad was mine intervention haha
About the audible background noise... Beside the D10s, I have other DACs as the E50 and a old KTB, this one has a noise similar to the stock D10s and using that as reference, I was able to get a picture of how much the noise was decreased. The modded D10s seems almost as silent as the E50. AKG K321 is a heck of sensitive IEM - in a bad way.

 

[raif71]

At first I thought I had interpreted wrongly the measurements of the DACs and than... "oh, that was a joke" xD
Talking about joke... Just don't juge me. Far from being a example of soldering work but on my defence I had a problem with my iron solder. I won't say anything subjective about how it is souding but there is two things that I can confirm: that's stills working and my audio interfaces are not sensible enought to measure any change - for better or for worst. No meaningful measurable differences on noise either harmonic distortion. But using a sensitive IEM (AKG K321) with L30 on max gain, I was able to hear the background noise from D10s, it stills audible although considerably lower than before. I'm planning to acquire a Cosmos ADC soon, probably it will may tell how bad was mine intervention haha
About the audible background noise... Beside the D10s, I have other DACs as the E50 and a old KTB, this one has a noise similar to the stock D10s and using that as reference, I was able to get a picture of how much the noise was decreased. The modded D10s seems almost as silent as the E50. AKG K321 is a heck of sensitive IEM - in a bad way.

I had hoped you got my meaning of shiny vs blurry ... I was commenting on the shiny picture of d10s vs the blurry picture of d10b which also correspond to the "s" and "b" of the dacs.

 

[half_dog]

English is not my first language but I got it
I admit that I took a time to be sure

 

[noi1996]

At first I thought I had interpreted wrongly the measurements of the DACs and than... "oh, that was a joke" xD
Talking about joke... Just don't juge me. Far from being a example of soldering work but on my defence I had a problem with my iron solder. I won't say anything subjective about how it is souding but there is two things that I can confirm: that's stills working and my audio interfaces are not sensible enought to measure any change - for better or for worst. No meaningful measurable differences on noise either harmonic distortion. But using a sensitive IEM (AKG K321) with L30 on max gain, I was able to hear the background noise from D10s, it stills audible although considerably lower than before. I'm planning to acquire a Cosmos ADC soon, probably it will may tell how bad was mine intervention haha
About the audible background noise... Beside the D10s, I have other DACs as the E50 and a old KTB, this one has a noise similar to the stock D10s and using that as reference, I was able to get a picture of how much the noise was decreased. The modded D10s seems almost as silent as the E50. AKG K321 is a heck of sensitive IEM - in a bad way.

I have previously added a similar Avcc Mod to SMSL DAC M8.
In this case, I think it would be better to use a low-voltage and low-noise bipolar op-amp that serves as a 3.3V buffer, and to configure the op-amp using only a positive 5.6V rail power supply.

 

[GXAlan]

I don’t think it will be easy, from the Denon software part. There is a small chance the pre out is connected to the amplifier without any relay, such that the pre out of the sub can be connected to the pre*out* of the intended amplification channel to get the internal amplifier to work. The true output for that channel will get summed, because I think the relays will turn off amplifiers that are not in use.

It does NOT look like the x8500h’s custom amp assign lets you assign the sub to powered output either.

Yes, the JBL Professional line of drivers is impressive. People forget that all the fancy DSP and ultra high power is for getting good bass out of small enclosures and small woofers for convenience (plus taming down room nodes). If you have the size and space for big subs, a little bit of power goes a long way!

 

[Tony_db]

If I use the D10s just as Usb-spdif converter to a spdif dac sing Ak4399, can I achieve bitperfect volume control? I would be using Foobar2000 as player