Topping D10 Balanced Review (USB DAC)

[kchap]

I don't like the bright sound of D10b, so I changed the op-amps. It stopped working several times, mostly when I was touching the trackpad or the charging phone. It's sensitive to ESD, so I looked into how it is grounded. I am using it with Topping L50 amp. L50 is perfect, but this one is NOT.
I am sharing information with people who need it. I'm sorry it's irritating to you.

No need to apologize . Do as you wish but, I would like to see some measurements. The differences between modern OP amps are well into the inaudible range.

 

[Ogdens-Sliced]

Can it be powered by a RPi USB ouptput?

I have a D10b powered by a Pi4 running Ropieee.
Works flawless.
USB auto suspend with Ropieee also works.
Pi4/Ropieee > D10b > A90 > DCA Aeon 2 Closed.
Happy days

 

[Deleted member 23982]

Topping couples the metal case to the circuit board with a gold pin. I "THOUGHT" it's directly connected to the USB socket shield, then connects to the circuit board GND by coupling a large resistor and a capacitor.
BUT I was wrong, the circuit board GND on D10b is directly connect to the metal case with the gold pin, then connects to the USB shield with 1M resistor.
If heatsink is directly connected to circuit GND, it will act as an antenna and pick up a lot noise.

did you check just the usb shield or also the actual ground pin on the usb connection? having a large resistor on GND doesnt sound right, having it on the shield sounds better since EMI would flow the other direction to the gnd/usb source instead of through the dac this way

i did some "light" research and heatsinks mounted on IC`s (can) act as a "transmitter-antenna" for EMI of the IC, so they could do more harm than they are good for (they can actually amplify the emi of the IC), you can reduce this by grounding the heatsinks but from what i understood maybe its better to have no heatsink at all which "can" act as a "transmitter-antenna"

 

[BVa]

Hello everyone!
I have a problem with my D10bal..After turning on the PC (Win 10) and starting playback in Foobar, no sound from the D10bal. The last driver 5.27 was installed, this was the same with 5.20. Everything seems normal, playback runs with all indications, but no sound. The only thing that will help is to disconnect / connect the USB cable, as some kind of reset. Then everything works normally. 2-3 months everything worked normally, the problem appeared gradually about 1 month . Now it's permanent. Has anyone encountered this, what is the possible problem?

 

[Deleted member 23982]

Hello everyone!
I have a problem with my D10bal..After turning on the PC (Win 10) and starting playback in Foobar, no sound from the D10bal. The last driver 5.27 was installed, this was the same with 5.20. Everything seems normal, playback runs with all indications, but no sound. The only thing that will help is to disconnect / connect the USB cable, as some kind of reset. Then everything works normally. 2-3 months everything worked normally, the problem appeared gradually about 1 month . Now it's permanent. Has anyone encountered this, what is the possible problem?

did you try another usb port or usb cable?

 

[BVa]

Yes, I tried 4 USB ports, 3 USB cables. And USB power suspend is disabled. The older CA DAC magic + works normally there under the same conditions (but has its own external PSU ..)

 

[actionmask]

Hello everyone!
I have a problem with my D10bal..After turning on the PC (Win 10) and starting playback in Foobar, no sound from the D10bal. The last driver 5.27 was installed, this was the same with 5.20. Everything seems normal, playback runs with all indications, but no sound. The only thing that will help is to disconnect / connect the USB cable, as some kind of reset. Then everything works normally. 2-3 months everything worked normally, the problem appeared gradually about 1 month . Now it's permanent. Has anyone encountered this, what is the possible problem?

Hi, I also encounter this problem every time I use D10b. I need to disconnect/connect every time. I am using Mint OS, so it's a OS-independent problem.

 

[Dunring]

Ive got one but haven't encountered it (yet). Have you tried a USB powered hub just to see if constant power between it and the DAC will keep the problem from happening? Mine is plugged into the USB hub that's built into the monitor which is always on, so haven't run into it, might help to try.

 

[actionmask]

Ive got one but haven't encountered it (yet). Have you tried a USB powered hub just to see if constant power between it and the DAC will keep the problem from happening? Mine is plugged into the USB hub that's built into the monitor which is always on, so haven't run into it, might help to try.

I used D10b as USB hub-> topping-> HS-01 -> D10b.
This "bug" only happens I turn on the power of the whole system. I need to disconnect /connect once every time, and it works fine afterward.

 

[actionmask]

did you check just the usb shield or also the actual ground pin on the usb connection? having a large resistor on GND doesnt sound right, having it on the shield sounds better since EMI would flow the other direction to the gnd/usb source instead of through the dac this way

i did some "light" research and heatsinks mounted on IC`s (can) act as a "transmitter-antenna" for EMI of the IC, so they could do more harm than they are good for (they can actually amplify the emi of the IC), you can reduce this by grounding the heatsinks but from what i understood maybe its better to have no heatsink at all which "can" act as a "transmitter-antenna"

I checked the actual ground pin (Gold plated) on the PCB. It's directly connect to the circuit ground including the USB GND, which means the metal case is directly connect to the signal ground but is coupled with a 1Mohm resistor when connecting the USB shield.

About the heatsink on ICs, I'll remove them. I also think that's meaningless for XMOS and ESS9038m chip. Thanks
Another thing to mention is in my system (("un-grounded")Notebook->usb hub -> D10b),
I heard ground loop noise from time to time. After using a USB isolator (HS-01), the noise is gone.

 

[pma]

Hello everyone!
I have a problem with my D10bal..After turning on the PC (Win 10) and starting playback in Foobar, no sound from the D10bal. The last driver 5.27 was installed, this was the same with 5.20. Everything seems normal, playback runs with all indications, but no sound. The only thing that will help is to disconnect / connect the USB cable, as some kind of reset. Then everything works normally. 2-3 months everything worked normally, the problem appeared gradually about 1 month . Now it's permanent. Has anyone encountered this, what is the possible problem?

It is actually the 5V/0.5A consumption issue from USB port which is just at the edge, as you have correctly stated elsewhere. The interface works but the DAC is in fact sleeping. When I operate the D10s (also 0.5A) from iPad through unpowered USB adapter, the DAC seemingly works, the display works but there is no analog output. When the exteral power is connected to the USB adapter (there are both options) the DAC starts to work properly.

 

[BVa]

So I found out that I have 2 USB3 ports available , that have a higher power load than 0,5A. I had them unnecessarily occupied by USB2 devices. I swapped it, but no change. After turning on the computer, I have to disconnect / connect the USB cable, otherwise it doesn't play, despite the player running and an indication that everything is fine. He even knows it now and displays fs correctly, but it's quiet. I had the D10 in the W10 settings as the system sound device, I changed it to an internal sound card (Asus XonarST2), but it didn't help .. The only explanation seems to me that the power supply must start up quickly, with fast transients, otherwise the DAC will get into some kind of hazardous state.

 

[pma]

Maybe @JohnYang1997 could tell us something.

 

[Ingenieur]

Perhaps this may help?
Mine stays in an idle state, 1 small 'dot' on the DAC until the computer is turned on.
I use a small form factor box, Windows 10, as a music server.

How to disable Windows 10's 'USB selective suspend' setting

When a USB device is not working correctly with your Windows 10 PC, you can try disabling the "USB selective suspend" feature to fix the problem. Here's how.

www.windowscentral.com

 

[BVa]

I did it..

And USB power suspend is disabled.

 

[xaviescacs]

Bought one but returned it because I went for a different setup in the end. Must say that the first impressions were quite good: functionality, packaging, construction, look and feel,... definitely would have kept if I really needed it.

 

[actionmask]

So I found out that I have 2 USB3 ports available , that have a higher power load than 0,5A. I had them unnecessarily occupied by USB2 devices. I swapped it, but no change. After turning on the computer, I have to disconnect / connect the USB cable, otherwise it doesn't play, despite the player running and an indication that everything is fine. He even knows it now and displays fs correctly, but it's quiet. I had the D10 in the W10 settings as the system sound device, I changed it to an internal sound card (Asus XonarST2), but it didn't help .. The only explanation seems to me that the power supply must start up quickly, with fast transients, otherwise the DAC will get into some kind of hazardous state.

I am using topping's HS-01 USB isolator and ifi 5V/2A power supply, but still have this problem. I hope it can be fixed by a firmware update instead of a hardware flaw.

 

[Toku]

Hello everyone!
I have a problem with my D10bal..After turning on the PC (Win 10) and starting playback in Foobar, no sound from the D10bal. The last driver 5.27 was installed, this was the same with 5.20. Everything seems normal, playback runs with all indications, but no sound. The only thing that will help is to disconnect / connect the USB cable, as some kind of reset. Then everything works normally. 2-3 months everything worked normally, the problem appeared gradually about 1 month . Now it's permanent. Has anyone encountered this, what is the possible problem?

I purchased the D10B last August and have continued to use it, but recently I have noticed that I have the same symptoms as you.
I start the PC and play music, but the display shows that it works perfectly, but there is no sound from the TRS analog output. At this time, the OPT/COAX output will be output normally without any problem.

I investigated to find out the cause. The findings are as follows.
If you connect and disconnect the USB cable several times, it will operate normally.
Symptoms do not always occur. Occurs on a whim.
The symptoms are the same even if you change the USB port of the PC.
This phenomenon occurs only on one of the two PCs.
D10s does not have this symptom at all. Occurs only on D10B.
It does not depend on the type of audio player on your PC.
The same symptom was reported in the Japanese Topping forum.

From the above, it is considered that there is some problem in the circuit operation of the power supply to the D10B or the analog output.

 

[BVa]

In last time it occurs also during playback, not only at start. In the midle of song apears muting, all indication are normal... The only way to solve this is disconnect/ connect USB cable... It really seems as analogue part problem, PSU or signal circuits..

 

[Hee]

The left channel noise of the topping d10b is strange.
When the output is higher than -30 dbfs, the noise level increases by +3 db.
This can also be found on the Archimago's Musings site.
Can we fix this?