Topping B100 Amplifier Review

[MKWingchun]

Not sure what your units are here. 110dB SPL is deafeningly loud and will result in ear damage pretty quickly.

And for most systems, -110db on a volume control is going to be below the threshold of human audibility.

I fixed that, thanks. Truthfully at 68 ears old, I might be at -90 in my ability to hear distortion in amplifiers. I'm not sure that's age related. I've never actually tried to anything systematic to figure that out. I've just noticed things like the Mini-Dip HD, when added to my system, sounded transparent to me, even though it added measured noise.

 

[miero]

Maybe something really new...

The T'ang-ku-la Module uses a brand new three-stage feedback circuit technology. It reduces circuit noise and high-frequency distortion, thereby increasing the dynamic range of the power amplifier to 151 dB. This technology also significantly lowers the heat produced by circuits, further boosting the reliability of the circuits, extending service life, and effectively diminishing thermal noise.

Source: https://www.toppingaudio.com/product-item/b100

 

[KSTR]

This technology also significantly lowers the heat produced by circuits, further boosting the reliability of the circuits, extending service life, and effectively diminishing thermal noise.

Laws of physics still apply. They can't get any higher efficiency than outlined in my post #1126.
The only way to overcome this limit would be by using tracking rails via local switch mode supply regulators, or at least switching rails between several fixed voltages, again with switching regulators. Doesn't look like we have anything like that happening here.

 

[pjug]

Maybe something really new...

Source: https://www.toppingaudio.com/product-item/b100

Probably talking about heating at idle.

 

[antcollinet]

I might be at -90 in my ability to hear distortion in amplifiers.

I doubt very much you can reach anywhere near that. If you look at the klippel listening test results, the vast majority of people can't hear lower than about -45dB. Not even that low when using speakers.

Try the test yourself if you are interested in finding out how inaudible even relatively large amounts of distortion are.

 

[Sokel]

If you own one of these new DACs with "sound colors" like Topping and SMSL you can try it with them.
The THD+N of these "modes" varies from -50db to -70dB and I believe you can do it on the fly.

That's a good chance to fall a full -60dB (from their rated -120dB THD+N) and see the difference.

(hint,across forums no one can tell,at least those who use them at DAC and no at pre-amp mode attenuated them at a usual -30dB or so for normal listening with a decent gain amp)

 

[pma]

Load 8Ω: (OK) 8.9 Vrms / 10W ... 7 minutes of 50Hz signal

Impossible with normal btl class-(a)b and that small heat sink. Total heat generated is 30W.

Confirming 30W dissipated heat under such conditions by 2 H-bridge transistors.

And nobody has confirmed the specs in the red frame below.

 

[MAB]

It’s interesting on a technical forum to see people react to tests of a product that they have an emotional investment in. It gets really interesting when the real-world measurements are different than the perfection they dreamed about as they pored over the SINAD claims on the manufacturer's website. In this thread they call the measurements 'opinions'. Or try to re-write the history of a classic amplifier and misstate it's actual measured performance.

And to be clear, PMA has measured real-world scenarios, not opined. Amir has measured the best case performance, also not an opinion. Use of the word 'opinion' to describe PMA's work is incredibly ironic, and is just a bunch of trash-talk that has no place here.

The amp doesn't meet manufacturer's claimed spec, in real-world use is seriously flawed. It's fine that we have lots of non-technical people here, but it's not even dimly OK to allow their emotional investment in a product to overrule actual findings.

The amp isn't very cheap either.

 

[EddNog]

It’s interesting on a technical forum to see people react to tests of a product that they have an emotional investment in. It gets really interesting when the real-world measurements are different than the perfection they dreamed about as they pored over the SINAD claims on the manufacturer's website. In this thread they call the measurements 'opinions'. Or try to re-write the history of a classic amplifier and misstate it's actual measured performance.

And to be clear, PMA has measured real-world scenarios, not opined. Amir has measured the best case performance, also not an opinion. Use of the word 'opinion' to describe PMA's work is incredibly ironic, and is just a bunch of trash-talk that has no place here.

The amp doesn't meet manufacturer's claimed spec, in real-world use is seriously flawed. It's fine that we have lots of non-technical people here, but it's not even dimly OK to allow their emotional investment in a product to overrule actual findings.

The amp isn't very cheap either.

Fair point, it most definitely is not a priceerformance king by any measure.

-Ed

 

[MAB]

Fair point, it most definitely is not a priceerformance king by any measure.

-Ed

My main concern is the performance in real world use.

And the inability for some members to respect the contributions of some very smart and experienced members. Keyboard warrior style.

But yeah, it’s expensive.

 

[Chr1]

Much as I admire Toppings DACs, it seems to me that their amplifiers are only really useful for small nearfield desktop applications or super sensitive horns. They seem underpowered (re specs) and are woefully inadequate regarding thermal management, which really shouldn't be so difficult. Small cases with no or minimal venting, and what appears to be insufficient stress testing before release to the public. No complaints whatsoever re my D50, DX3 Pro and E50 DACs They are great and have worked flawlessly, but I won't be looking at their amps anytime soon.

 

[TNT]

But, this thread will push them in the right direction and we will hopefully see better performing products really soon - this is free education for them but not a cheap way to go about it but Im sure they will prevail and come out in a way that all will benefit.

//

 

[pogo]

The amplifier rating somehow does not match reality (Great 69.8%).

 

[Old_School_Brad]

It’s interesting on a technical forum to see people react to tests of a product that they have an emotional investment in. It gets really interesting when the real-world measurements are different than the perfection they dreamed about as they pored over the SINAD claims on the manufacturer's website. In this thread they call the measurements 'opinions'. Or try to re-write the history of a classic amplifier and misstate it's actual measured performance.

And to be clear, PMA has measured real-world scenarios, not opined. Amir has measured the best case performance, also not an opinion. Use of the word 'opinion' to describe PMA's work is incredibly ironic, and is just a bunch of trash-talk that has no place here.

The amp doesn't meet manufacturer's claimed spec, in real-world use is seriously flawed. It's fine that we have lots of non-technical people here, but it's not even dimly OK to allow their emotional investment in a product to overrule actual findings.

The amp isn't very cheap either.

It’s frustrating to see objectively derived data dismissed as mere opinions. Sometimes, it makes me wonder if we’re not as far removed from the mindset of burning witches as we’d like to believe.

 

[LKA]

Low dissipation BTL amp. Class D amplifier (E1,E2) driven low voltage power supplies of the Class B amplifier. (similar to Class A+)

 

[KenA]

The amp doesn't meet manufacturer's claimed spec, in real-world use is seriously flawed.

And yet quoting Amir:

‘I have no choice but to bow to their mission and abilities.
It is my absolute pleasure to recommend the Topping B100 monolock amplifier.’

And it appears 70% of ASR members who voted agree with him.

 

[antcollinet]

And yet quoting Amir:

‘I have no choice but to bow to their mission and abilities.
It is my absolute pleasure to recommend the Topping B100 monolock amplifier.’

And it appears 70% of ASR members who voted agree with him.

Non of which changes the statement you were replying to.

Amir does not do a continuous power test. In fact this thread has brought it home exactly how short Amir's power test is. I, for one, am valuing this "holding to account" of manufacturers claims.

 

[Old_School_Brad]

And yet quoting Amir:

‘I have no choice but to bow to their mission and abilities.
It is my absolute pleasure to recommend the Topping B100 monolock amplifier.’

And it appears 70% of ASR members who voted agree with him.

The tests conducted by Amir and PMA are not the same.

 

[TNT]

amir does not do a continuous power test.

And didn't play them using his own speakers...?

Perhaps the unreserved reccomendation by @amirm hadn't been given if he had chosen to do so?

If one don't listen, one has to be really sure that ones measurement suite is really complete... now that the reactive load test was omitted due to "protection circuit" interference maybe it should have been done anyways within the protection regions to show the amps abilities even more clear. Now, I don't know for how long that particular test sequences are going on per load combination variants.. maybe it is also very short... like a blink of a second...

... but last time I played Ottorinos "Via Appia", the rage goes on for seconds ;-)

Science need to be reality connected.

PS. Using this track, "pre-heating" has been going on for mintes ;-) and quite probably and done right, there is a big organ involved in the end...

//

 

[KenA]

Non of which changes the statement you were replying to.

Amir does not do a continuous power test. In fact this thread has brought it home exactly how short Amir's power test is. I, for one, am valuing this "holding to account" of manufacturers claims.

Agree. And personally I wouldn’t touch it. So, applying science (the S in ASR), is this a good amp or not?Many people will come to this site, read the first few pages, see the recommendation by Amir and the 70% support and thinks its absolutely marvellous.