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Time to Review Ethernet Switches and Cables?

stevenswall

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Stopped watching as I was commenting when he got to that point in his video, but I'm curious if these things make a difference or if it's just a small amount of noise and jitter that don't matter at all because it's digital. (EX: it doesn't matter if there is some noise and the timing isn't perfect for morse code: If the operator decodes it right, in this case the DAC, it spells out the same thing as if there were no noise on the line.)
 

pierre

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I did found a very large difference between an optical fiber and a coper internet cable. I could push the first one through the house but couldn’t push the other one which is thicker. So I get sound with the optical fiber and have to rely on WiFi for the other one ...
 
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Matias

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EtherRegen and USB cables were already tested.
 

Jinjuku

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Stopped watching as I was commenting when he got to that point in his video, but I'm curious if these things make a difference or if it's just a small amount of noise and jitter that don't matter at all because it's digital. (EX: it doesn't matter if there is some noise and the timing isn't perfect for morse code: If the operator decodes it right, in this case the DAC, it spells out the same thing as if there were no noise on the line.)

Well, good ol' Hans keeps deleting posts that challenge his technical chops. (he has very little).

Here is a video I did in response. I linked to it in a reply to his YT channel but he deleted my post along with many others.

In it you will see me disconnect the cabling but somehow, by some voodoo, music still plays.
 
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adc

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I'm curious if these things make a difference or if it's just a small amount of noise and jitter that

Network quality can affect your audio, sure -- but in ways that you can measure and correct, and not in ways that esoteric silliness will help you with. For instance, if you have a ton of latency, you'll have dropouts, but that means you need to either reduce traffic on that network segment or fix faulty network design (or failing equipment). Neither calls for thousands of bucks or specialized equipment. A bit is a bit; it either arrives intact in a timely fashion or it doesn't.

VoIP engineers have already covered this ground. Solutions to audio problems where IP is involved usually boil down to giving it a fat pipe and isolating it from busy data networks (or, if all else fails, giving audio-related traffic priority). There's no magic.
 
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k3nb5t

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VoIP engineers have already covered this ground. Solutions to audio problems where IP is involved usually boil down to giving it a fat pipe and isolating it from busy data networks (or, if all else fails, giving audio-related traffic priority). There's no magic.

It is making inroads in the pro-audio and recording sector as well.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audio_over_Ethernet
 

Jinjuku

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I responded point by point to Clever Hans and of course, true to form, he can't rebut a we reasoned response so he deleted this:

"You've deleted technical posts by myself and others in the past. Let's see how this one goes (I'll be sure to screen scrape right after I've posted).

At 8:01 you get into jitter and phase on the PAM encoding on the Ethernet signal. If you have a powerful enough measurement device you will find deviation from TX side of things. This is especially true as cable lengths increase and toss in poor terminations, and as BlueJeans cable proved, with many no name cables you get out of spec solutions. But you have a failure in your understanding and you are attempting to teach that which you don't know.

Your first issue is that the switch isn't the biggest indicator of signal integrity. It's the interconnects.

Your second issue is that with interconnects that are in spec wrt to signal integrity at each end all that data is buffered and copied, multiple times. You should read up on clock domain boundaries.

At 12:45 you start talking about buffering. You seem to be conflating various inputs (S/Pdif, AES-EBU, USB) of a 2011-2013 design and the ability to buffer. If those inputs have ground tie you could have an issue that isn't related to buffer. BUT Ethernet cabling isn't tied to any ground in unshielded applications. Also we are not talking about AES-EBU vs TOSLink vs USB vs SP/DIF co-ax.

We are talking about one upstream switch vs another. Again you are confusing your inter-connects with regards to buffering. Now if you want to make the argument that one switch vs another is going to introduce some constant analog noise just by virtue of being plugged in please let me know. I have a response all ready to that. And yes I've had the eR, and Audio Quest, WW, Nordost Ethernet cabling. "

He uses a Chord QDB76 HDSD as an example because it has a 3 second buffer and he can tell the differences in whether the input is AES-EBU, TOSLink, S/Pdif, USB. That DAC is from 2013 and:

1. It doesn't have an Ethernet input
2. He's talking about inputs right on the DAC itself
3. How can he fail to realize we can take the Chord QDB76, connect a computer to it's USB and on the other end feed the computer via Ethernet and swap out the upstream switch!

He can't be that daft, can he?
 

tomtoo

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The pros will lough there ass of. That's why they use DAW's now. Not aaw's.
 

mansr

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Well, good ol' Hans keeps deleting posts that challenge his technical chops. (he has very little).

Here is a video I did in response. I linked to it in a reply to his YT channel but he deleted my post along with many others.

In it you will see me disconnect the cabling but somehow, by some voodoo, music still plays.
Didn't that experiment basically get you banned at Audiophool Stool?
 
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Wes

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That place is virtually an owned subsidiary of MupTone Audio and various cable companies
 

March Audio

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They make no difference, which is obvious to anyone with any technical understanding of Ethernet. Amir has even tested one of these devices to prove it.
This.

It's proof positive of how misled people can get just relying on subjective evaluations.
 
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Jinjuku

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When I get time I will download Hans video and respond to it point by point. He's left some major logic holes.
 
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