Thoughts on hearing aids for audiophiles?

[Naaalaaa]

I think I may have some very mild hearing loss -- nothing too worrisome yet but I noticed I may not be hearing the same things or nuances I used to enjoy. And it's a slap in the face.

I've always had this weird ego thing about wearing hearing aids (I always told myself I'm not old enough for that!)

But recently saw this article about how there are actually hearing aids that can enhance music listening (and they even called it the ultimate hifi hack which is a lot) and now my views are slowwwly changing

As I mentioned, ny hearing loss isn't so bad yet that drs would recommend hearing aids but is it possible to request one just to see how it'll help anyway?

Any experience with this?

 

[DSJR]

Get your hearing properly professionally tested.

I'll freely admit, I had to be literally dragged kicking and screaming to my first audiology appointment and have to say, the nurse who did the initial testing was very timid in suggesting that I should do a proper follow-up, as I suspect she gets a number of older fellas like me in total denial (it was upsetting my son when I innocently ignored him when he spoke to me that was the trigger). For an ex audio industry bod to be wearing hearing aids is a source of great humiliation and yeah, shame too, but I can't do anything about it and it's really only the last ten to fifteen years post semi-retirement that it's come on, repeated middle-ear infections since my mid forties making it worse I think.

Most chaps in their sixties have hearing loss, but unlike me, it's general over the frequency range I gather. Mine is different, with a massive loss of sensitivity in the 4 - 7kHz region, meaning my 'aids have a massive boost here.

Please fellas, DON'T do anything until you've had a professional test your hearing. I had a bone conduction test too which broadly followed the 'headphone' test, so mine is not wax or whatever.

 

[audio_tony]

@Naaalaaa Have a look as this thread.

Hearing and hearing aid recommendations

I'm wondering if the whole issue of hearing, and deficiencies in same, isn't sort of the "elephant in the room" surrounding so many of the discussions here and elsewhere, especially when the topic of subjective listening is at issue. Many threads I've noticed ask about the possibility of...

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[Yuhasz01]

Yes anyone over 60 should have their ears and hearing(brain activity) tested professionally.
I am 76 and just participated in an extensive hearing medical research study at Mass Eye and Ear Institute(Boston). I have lost some upper frequency but no tinnitus and all the hearing mechanisms and parts involved are healthy .
At the end I briefly discussed my hifi hobby and listening practices. My practices seems helpful to these people: I use eq headphones alot, powered speakers(with eq) and my DAC is an RME with great with auto reference levels and PEQ and ability to adjust left and right ear volumes. With speaker listening, I carefully and accurately measure my listening volume. One of the benefits of all the DSP in our systems today is ability to make some needed adjustments.

 

[SSS]

Nice to see that there are hearing aids for music bandwidth and dynamic. Due to my age I don't hear above around 12 kHz. But I take it as it is and I don't think that a hearing aid will help much in my case since these cannot regain my hearing loss due to degeneration. I just enhance the treble at my preamp. And since 30 years I protect my ears when working with loud machines like saw and mower. Neighbours did not do it, I still have a fair hearing ability.

 

[Dunring]

There's ear buds with very effective ambient sound modes that can increase the volume around you when turned up.

It's a lot cooler wearing those since everyone uses them these days. Whenever I grocery shop or see someone walking the dog they always wear them. I'd do a search to find out which current models have the best ambient mode.

 

[Speedskater]

The newest hearing aids have high-tech computers that can deal with many demanding hearing situations.
But many of these functions are not enabled while streaming. This won't be a problem for an audiophile that just needs mild frequency response and level help. But for those with serious problems, hearing aids don't do much else while streaming.

 

[amper42]

Nice to see that there are hearing aids for music bandwidth and dynamic. Due to my age I don't hear above around 12 kHz. But I take it as it is and I don't think that a hearing aid will help much in my case since these cannot regain my hearing loss due to degeneration. I just enhance the treble at my preamp. And since 30 years I protect my ears when working with loud machines like saw and mower. Neighbours did not do it, I still have a fair hearing ability.

It's all PR. None of the hearing aids add enjoyment to music. That's a bogus claim. Music always sounds unnatural with hearing aids, no matter the price or what they claim. If you need them for TV or conversation that's fine but most take them out when listening to HiFi. They usually give you a free trial so it doesn't hurt to try it for yourself. I would probably sell my stereo gear if I ever had to wear hearing aids permanently.

 

[Brian Hall]

Offtopic. I was waiting in line at the DMV renewing my car tags last week and had my Galaxy Buds 2 Pro in listening to music. An older lady tugged on my arm and asked me "What kind of hearing aids are you using? They must not be very good since I've been trying to get your attention to ask and you couldn't hear me.".

 

[Doodski]

Offtopic. I was waiting in line at the DMV renewing my car tags last week and had my Galaxy Buds 2 Pro in listening to music. An older lady tugged on my arm and asked me "What kind of hearing aids are you using? They must not be very good since I've been trying to get your attention to ask and you couldn't hear me.".

I had 2 people ask if I got new hearing aids.

 

[Brian Hall]

I had 2 people ask if I got new hearing aids.

Next time I will take my DAP and use the HD800S headphones.

 

[Emlin]

Interesting article on Apple launching OTC hearing aids.

Apple’s new AirPods will make America hear again, but no thanks to the regulator | John Naughton

The tech firm’s federal approval to turn its earbuds into hearing aids is one in the eye for the monopolistic US healthcare agency

www.theguardian.com

 

[Petrushka]

Nice to see that there are hearing aids for music bandwidth and dynamic. Due to my age I don't hear above around 12 kHz. But I take it as it is and I don't think that a hearing aid will help much in my case since these cannot regain my hearing loss due to degeneration. I just enhance the treble at my preamp. And since 30 years I protect my ears when working with loud machines like saw and mower. Neighbours did not do it, I still have a fair hearing ability.

Hearing aids are computerized and designed to single out human speech. This ruins music. I have a music mode on mine, which is better, but not really better than just turning up the treble. An audiogram and DSP might be better, if you listen alone.

 

[amper42]

Hearing aids are computerized and designed to single out human speech. This ruins music. I have a music mode on mine, which is better, but not really better than just turning up the treble. An audiogram and DSP might be better, if you listen alone.

Yes, Hearing Aids suck! No replacement for good hearing and awful for music no matter how much you pay. Their only value is if you are really hard of hearing and can't easily have a conversation with someone or watch TV, then they will help you get by in the world with much lower fidelity audio. You can forget about enjoying high fidelity music like you once did. It's a huge step down.

But if you have no other option it's better than being deaf. Don't be surprised if you don't enjoy music like you once did and may want to find another hobby? Hearing aid companies will make claims that their product is great for music and offer designs for thousands. Poor audiophiles that just want to enjoy music again will get fooled into buying them only to find they are absolutely NO REPLACEMENT for natural hearing. Protect your ears - if you enjoy music. There is no substitute.

If your vision is clouded by cataracts, surgery is great at fixing that. You can see just like a young person again provided there is no other damage. But you loose your hearing and its hard to settle for the quality of hearing available even with the best hearing aid.

Many people with 20% loss of hearing or more choose not to use hearing aids as they sound unnatural compared to what they are use to. Many actually prefer to turn up the TV or read the transcribed text on the screen rather than listen thru hearing aids. If science ever conquers this problem as well as cataract surgery has there will be a lot of people lining up for treatment.

 

[Petrushka]

Yes, Hearing Aids suck! No replacement for good hearing and awful for music no matter how much you pay. Their only value is if you are really hard of hearing and can't easily have a conversation with someone or watch TV, then they will help you get by in the world with much lower fidelity audio. You can forget about enjoying high fidelity music like you once did. It's a huge step down.

But if you have no other option it's better than being deaf. Don't be surprised if you don't enjoy music like you once did and may want to find another hobby? Hearing aid companies will make claims that their product is great for music and offer designs for thousands. Poor audiophiles that just want to enjoy music again will get fooled into buying them only to find they are absolutely NO REPLACEMENT for natural hearing. Protect your ears - if you enjoy music. There is no substitute.

If your vision is clouded by cataracts, surgery is great at fixing that. You can see just like a young person again provided there is no other damage. But you loose your hearing and its hard to settle for the quality of hearing available even with the best hearing aid.

Many people with 20% loss of hearing or more choose not to use hearing aids as they sound unnatural compared to what they are use to. Many actually prefer to turn up the TV or read the transcribed text on the screen rather than listen thru hearing aids. If science ever conquers this problem as well as cataract surgery has there will be a lot of people lining up for treatment.

Everyone is different, but I have discovered some unexpected things.

In another post I mentioned that violins sound screechy on stereo systems. But live acoustic instruments do not. The highs are diminished, but not distorted. Same with things like clock chimes.

There is some processing going on in my brain that can distinguish between live and Memorex, even though I shouldn’t be able to hear the relevant frequencies.

To add to the mystery, I’ve seen several operas at the Met in recent years, and their augmentation system does not trigger this sensation. And some speakers don’t.

 

[Petrushka]

Part of the problem is ENT's in the USA offer a wide variety of talent. Some are absolutely fantastic, some are quite lazy and some will actually make your condition worse. You don't know which one you will get until they are done treating you.

I went to a well recommended ENT for poor drainage in the Eustachian tube and his treatment was to put a tube in my ear. I didn't notice much difference and after a year it fell out. Then, I went back to him and explained I still have issues and rather than treat the cause he puts in a 2nd tube. I ask if this could damage my hearing with multiple tube insertions. He says, "no".

10 months later the tube falls inside the ear and leaves a hole in the ear drum. I can't tell where sound is coming from and a loss of hearing is very noticeable. I go back to the ENT and he says, huh nothing I can do about that. I say, I need to seek help elsewhere. He refers me to a surgeon in his group. The surgeon doesn't treat the underlying issue and says surgery won't work as I have allergies. He tells me to try a hearing aid. I try several different hearing aids over a 3 month period. Many of them over $3K. My expensive Revel sound system sounds absolutely horrible with each hearing aid tried. I'm about to give up on my audio hobby when my wife comes back from a different ENT who she thought was good. She recommends I see her ENT.

I visit her ENT. The Dr. says I can patch the ear drum and it will make your hearing much better. And we will address the underlying issues with treatments that have worked for others. She does the surgery and once the ear opens up again it's like night and day. It's as if the ear was never damaged. I love listening to my stereo again and I can't believe I wasted so much time on the first Dr and surgeon. The new Dr. took a part of my skin from near the opening of the ear and used it to patch the hole. Six months later my hearing is fantastic! I hear the direction of sound, my F328Be's sound fabulous and I notice my wife's hearing is worse than mine. It's a crazy life.

Hearing Aids suck.... You only like them if you absolutely can't get by without them. The technology is close to the Stone Age compared to the difference you notice before and after cataract surgery. AND ENT's can easily be dangerous to your hearing. If you get a good one - don't stray from them. They are a blessing! If they are not so good... run away!

Dittos on cataract surgery. My sight is better than it was at 14.

 

[vertumno]

Interesting article on Apple launching OTC hearing aids.

Apple’s new AirPods will make America hear again, but no thanks to the regulator | John Naughton

The tech firm’s federal approval to turn its earbuds into hearing aids is one in the eye for the monopolistic US healthcare agency

www.theguardian.com

Very interesting indeed clickbait title aside

If you read the frequency response of FDA approved AirPods Pro II they are a way lot better than 7000$ hearing aids. Also they were designed primarily to listen to music, they could be much better than hearing aids at that.

The cpu in those AirPods also might be equal or more powerful than top of the range hearing aids (just an opinion hard to find comparative data) so with proper software I don’t see why they wouldn’t be able to work well as hearing aid.

I was looking at Apple hearing test Mimi and they so far they test only a limited sample of frequencies, similar to the classic audiologist test, so that will have to be enhanced.

Hearing aids have very hard to justify from what I see and for what you get.

 

[vertumno]

Dittos on cataract surgery. My sight is better than it was at 14.

Very good point, even with the utmost care age catches up on you. Restorative surgery or therapy for hearing hopefully would become a reality sooner rather than later just as it is for sight now.

 

[vertumno]

Hearing aids have very hard to justify from what I see and for what you get.

Sorry typo: I meant hearing aids prices are very hard to justify for what you get in terms of technology compared to something like AirPods 2.

In a not too distant future an audiologist could perhaps fine tune them to each individual needs, though someone that has spent a lifetime listening to music has pretty good understanding and with proper tools would possibly be able to get close to a good tuning without too much help.

 

[quattro98]

If you're thinking about it, getting tested and looking at various options seems reasonable. I disagree with other posts about how modern hearing aids are for music.

Mine have a music mode that I like (Oticon brand) for listening at home with speakers or headphones. My biggest complaint is audible background noise which is apparent when it is quiet. I turn down the aids a little bit to decrease this noise. The audio quality of the hearing aids when used as a streaming device are much worse than AirPods Pro (used with audiogram data).